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Invisibleryan
Member since 1997
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Posts: 111
Psilocybin Extraction Project
    #3521243 - 12/19/04 06:36 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Ok, there have been quite a few posts recently regarding the extraction of psilocybin. While it can be done current methods require solvents or glassware most of us cant get. I am setting up this thread as a collaboration of multiple experimenters to find home solvents and equipment to do simple at home extractions and hopefully get crystals.

How can you help? We need alot of things.
1. List of solvents available to average people
2. People willing to try at least one of the solvents (requires min 5 gram of fungus, the more the better)

Solvents:
We need to find which solvents psilocybin is soluble/insoluble in. For each solvent we should try hot(boiling -careful with flamable solvents), and cold (near freezing)
1. Water: soluble in hot and cold
2. Isopropanol
3. Ethanol (everclear) 194 proof
4. White gas

... please help scour your homes and propose more solvents. I will update the list.

After we have a list of solvents we will need people to experment with them. This will require 4 steps:
1)soak fungus powder in solvent, using equal vol of solvent to fungus powder. Hot vs Cold. Each person only needs to do one
2)Filter the fungus powder (coffee filter) and collect the solvent
3)Allow solvent to evaporate and then test the residue for activity. Careful to divide the dose, ie if you extracted 10gms dont take all the residue, just a third of it.
4)report your results: did the residue have an effect? was there any nausea? no effect?


Edited by ryan (08/17/11 05:31 PM)


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Offlineshirley knott
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ryan]
    #3521292 - 12/19/04 06:51 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

ok. i have 'denatured alcohol 70%'. what's that, and i'll give it a go.
sounds a bit random, though. if i trip on the residue, does that make it a good solvent? what about correction for substance tested, user sensitivity, set and setting?
bagsy not one of the freezing cold (dud extract) experiments.


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Offlinegryphix
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: shirley knott]
    #3521767 - 12/19/04 09:06 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

methanol, ether, and naphtha are all common solvents that might be worthwhile to investigate


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InvisibleveggieM

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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: shirley knott]
    #3521926 - 12/19/04 09:47 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Denatured alcohol is ethyl alcohol (ethanol) to which a small percentage [~15%] of methyl alcohol (methanol) has been added to render the mixture poisonous. Methanol (naphtha) is toxic. Be careful with your experiments!!


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Invisiblemicro
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: veggie]
    #3522642 - 12/20/04 12:36 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Methanol (naphtha) is toxic




Naphtha is not methanol.

I found glacial acetic acid on E-bay (be careful):

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...ssPageName=WDVW

You could substitute toluene or xylene for the ether -- it's available at a paint store. If you use xylene, use a lot. The downside is that both of these are slower to evaporate than water (especially xylene bp=140C).

All of these are readily available, but I wouldn't trust paint store xylene or toluene, so re-extract with acetic acid or dilute hcl before recrystalizing. You should do this anyway because the product (acetate or hcl, whatever) will be more stable.

--
Micro


--------------------
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Invisiblemicro
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: micro]
    #3522671 - 12/20/04 12:45 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

BTW -- all of the non-polar solvents are flammable. Don't do something stupid like smoke while you're working with them (or in the same room).

--
Micro


--------------------
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(Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)


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Offlinegryphix
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: micro]
    #3525849 - 12/21/04 12:02 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

micro said:
BTW -- all of the non-polar solvents are flammable. Don't do something stupid like smoke while you're working with them (or in the same room).

--
Micro




this also goes for all of the polar solvents also


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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: gryphix]
    #3526530 - 12/21/04 04:21 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

>this also goes for all of the polar solvents also

Water?


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Invisibleryan
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: shirley knott]
    #3527655 - 12/21/04 02:27 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

shirley knott said:
if i trip on the residue, does that make it a good solvent?




It simply means that the active compound is at least partially soluble in that solvent. Ideally we will find household solvents in which:

1)psilocybin is completely insuluble (but many other fungus components are soluble)
2)a solvent in which psilocybin is readily soluble but other fungus components are not
3)a solvent in which psilocybin is readily soluble when warm but insoluble when cold

Quote:

what about correction for substance tested, user sensitivity, set and setting?
bagsy not one of the freezing cold (dud extract) experiments.




These experiments are far from scientific and should be undertaken with great care. You should first evaporate any test solvent and make sure there is no residue left over. As far as correcting for differences between users its not that important as we are only after yes or no results and not so much degrees.


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Invisiblemicro
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Anno]
    #3529975 - 12/22/04 01:33 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Anno said:
>this also goes for all of the polar solvents also

Water?




lol I think he means dipolar aprotic :wink:


--------------------
Any research paper or book for free
(Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)


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Invisiblefreakygurl
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project *DELETED* [Re: ryan]
    #3532614 - 12/22/04 07:11 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Post deleted by freakygurl

Reason for deletion: .



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OfflineShadyPackage
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project *DELETED* [Re: ryan]
    #3533103 - 12/22/04 09:30 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Post deleted by ShadyPackage

Reason for deletion: v



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Offlineprgmdfalt
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ShadyPackage]
    #3538856 - 12/24/04 12:47 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

If all these listed chems above can do the job.I would try Butaine
a lot of people use this for THC extraction in WEED but I am sure
any HYDROCARBON, with minimal trace once its simmered down, will
work, but I think butaine will work well since no heat is require to
boil, it boils at room temp. In pure THC extraction it is 8oz's butaine to 28-29 grams of weed, it is put inside 1" PCV pipe with one end with a filter, other end caped and a small hole drilled in the center of the cap to fit butaine attachment. Turn pipe with the cap up and start spraying let it run in to a jar and the let it boil until gone.


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Offlinefungophiliac
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: prgmdfalt]
    #3539459 - 12/24/04 03:24 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

has anyone ever done a search for which solvents work best. these experiments have been done! crystals can be schieved by why would you want them? they breakdown very quickly. and btw, grain alcohol works just fine. you may have to filter it a few more times than some others but it works. if your unsatisfied, do a test for alkaloids. even you want pure psilocybin(no baestyicin nor psilocin) you can use some chromatography chemicals (I hear) but really you guys should look outside the shroomery for your knowledge. these tests have been done


--------------------
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if you can't duck it, fuck it.
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OfflineLun4e
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: fungophiliac]
    #3539960 - 12/24/04 07:01 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Try VM&P naptha found in the paint section, great nonpolar solvent. Evaps clean and everything. Engine starting fluid (look for prestone) containing only ethyl ether and heptane is also a good bet, just make sure it does not contain anything but ethyl ether, heptane, and CO2. Both are exceedingly good solvents. The engine starting fluid is very volatile however (ether) so unless you know what your doing, dont mess around with it. It also will not evaporate as quickly as one might expect - the heptane's boiling point is near that of water. Hope this helps, and good luck!


--------------------
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http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=6519162&page=0&vc=#Post6519162


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InvisibleSoopaX
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: freakygurl]
    #3542001 - 12/25/04 01:40 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Or obtain the MSDS and make sure that hte product you are using has a 100% volatility rating.


--------------------


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Offlinejeff01
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: SoopaX]
    #3563756 - 12/31/04 01:41 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

extract in your stomach :wink:


--------------------
"impossible to walk in this muck"


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Invisibleshroomgirl
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ryan]
    #3571606 - 01/02/05 05:49 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

i had 2 questions...first: what would be a good alternative to vermiculite, and second: where can i find "white gas"?

i'm an experienced grower, but since vermiculite was made illegal i have had no idea what else i can substitute for it...atleast nothing as good. and i would really love to make a more pure form of psilocybin for a much better potency...so i could seriously use some advice from a fellow expert.


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OfflineChrisHippyLoser
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: shroomgirl]
    #3572165 - 01/02/05 07:27 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

1) verm made illegal? what now? i'm confused....

2) white gas is commonly used as a lantern fuel...you can find it at sears, outdoors/camping stores...probably most places that have a good camping supply or lantern section...



Edited by ChrisHippyLoser (01/02/05 07:37 PM)


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OfflineKaptKid
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: shroomgirl]
    #3573707 - 01/03/05 01:41 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

shroomgirl said:


i'm an experienced grower, but since vermiculite was made illegal




This is how rumors get started. ITS LEGAL. JUst bought a bag yesterday.

Welcome to the Shroomery,shroomgirl


--------------------
Child of the 60's, Tripping ever since.


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OfflineChrisHippyLoser
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: KaptKid]
    #3574764 - 01/03/05 01:15 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

outlawing vermiculite would be like outlawing perlite, or peat moss, wood chips, miracle grow, or soil....

i wonder where she got such an idea from...please tell us, because i think a lot of us are probably scratching our heads over that one...


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Invisibleshroomgirl
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: KaptKid]
    #3579852 - 01/04/05 04:42 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

thank you for welcoming me now i just have one question for you i need to kno where to get some vermiculite for cheap    kno anywhere? the only place i can find some to get for cheap is online at a place called 7 springs farms  heard of it?  does anyone you kno have any good dealings with them? :mushroom2:  if you do let me kno thanx


--------------------
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Invisibleshroomgirl
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: shroomgirl]
    #3579868 - 01/04/05 04:45 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

as far i as i knew in michigan you couldnt get thats where we used to live now we are in atlanta and its i guess not so uncommon at least it was illegal the last time i looked for it there but that was a while ago when all that shit went around about it having asbestos in it but thanx for setting me straight lol thanx


--------------------
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Invisiblemicro
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: shroomgirl]
    #3590981 - 01/06/05 11:19 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I've heard this rumor for years. Vermiculite is not illegal. The rumor started because of some asbestos in the mines, but this has nothing to do with the vermiculite, itself, and they still sell it.

When I was growing there was a hardware/garden store next to our apartment. They didn't carry it so my roomate asked them for it and they ordered some.

If you're in Atlanta it has to be around somewhere. Otherwise use peat moss, which works better, anyway IME (read my old posts as to how to use it properly).


--------------------
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InvisibleCorporal Kielbasa
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: shroomgirl]
    #3597798 - 01/08/05 12:07 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I have been told this for 8 years now. I was at a pet shop getting some for a breeding project I had going on. The man was like if you dont care about it killing you I would buy a lot of it because this is the last time we are carrying it. You wont be able to get it any more soon. 8 years now and I still can get it.


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Invisibleshroomgirl
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Corporal Kielbasa]
    #3612829 - 01/11/05 03:12 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

thanx for letting me kno has anyone heard of using coffe to possibly double or triple the flush or splitting the cake in two to do the same let me kno if you have heard anything i would like to try these but some of them are still in the experimental phase let me kno if you kno anything thanx


--------------------
i am the rarest of orchids


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: shroomgirl]
    #3623128 - 01/13/05 01:58 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

AS I pointed out in a similar post in this forum:

5 dried grams of psilocybe cubensis is 5000 milligrams of powder.

In those five thousand milligrams, only 15 to 25 or so are the actual psilocine crystals obtainable from the five thousand milligrams. And only psilocin is water soulable. You will not get any psilocybine. And then your body converts through amination, psilocine to psilocybine.

And methanol is what has been used to eextract before in laboratory research. It works. Would never use naptha.

mj

However, the dose is a minute amount of crystals.

Good luck

and if the material is not evaporated completely of the cleaning solvent, it can cause medical problems.

mj

And vermiculite is as available as poppy seeds are throughout the USA. It has bnever been illegal.

Whoever told youi taht probably thought it was something illegal to begin with and was just not knowledgable about vermiculite.
mj


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InvisiblePinback
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: mjshroomer]
    #3623376 - 01/13/05 03:01 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

And then your body converts through amination, psilocine to psilocybine.




Surely you must mean that psilocybin is converted to psilocin by dephosphorylation (ester hydrolysis)...

I am a bit curious about the solubility data, do you have any reference for that? Merck index states that psilocybin is soluble in 20 parts boiling water, and that psilocin is "very slightly sol in water".


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Offlinemidway
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: micro]
    #3631504 - 01/15/05 04:50 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

I found glacial acetic acid on E-bay (be careful):



GAA can be found at photography supply stores.
Id really like to read a successful extraction. Please post if you have.


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Offlinefungophiliac
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: midway]
    #3633123 - 01/15/05 11:23 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

has anyone ever read the "psilocybin producer's handbook"?
this outlines very detailed lab reports on this topic.


--------------------
why are there so many more horses asses than there are horses?

if you can't duck it, fuck it.
-the makers of duck tape



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OfflineAwesomepossum
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: fungophiliac]
    #3710178 - 01/31/05 10:43 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

OK. I am an oldhead who stumbled upon a no-tech, no-risk method for extracting psilocybin / psilocin from phresh phungus YEARS AGO, but I not going to reveal. What I will say, is that, with a blender and the proper liquid (NO TECH, remember!), you will be able to separate your mushroom stuff into a three-layer stratum; heavy organic material will settle to the bottom, a thick layer of inactive ingredients will be in the middle, and a thin layer of raw blue liquid will rise to the top. Sifon oph with eyedropper, turkey baster, hypodermic syringe, add to grain alcohol for preservation and enjoy psilo extract! Tricky, tricky, tricky!

PLEASE don't fuck around with toxic solvents. If you really want to enjoy chemmy stuff that will hurt your head, spray clear aerosol paint finish into your drawers and inhale until you fall over! My aunt never knew the diference. It's life just live it, it's cool, you'll enjoy it, thank you, good-bye.


--------------------
Here's part of a poem!!

I looked into my palm and saw what we had feared the most
The mouse had gnawed into the frond while they had sought the GHOST
The blender's better blunder blurred the butter's bluish hue
My sugar cube exploded, tiny shrapnel blinded YOU!

Don't panic! There's more. Just ask!


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Offlinescooterpop
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Awesomepossum]
    #3714771 - 02/01/05 07:55 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

awww c'mon possum, what's the magic liquid??


Edited by scooterpop (02/01/05 08:06 PM)


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Offlineestimatedprophet
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: scooterpop]
    #3715004 - 02/01/05 08:27 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

is it ether?


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OfflineShroomtakular
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ryan]
    #3723662 - 02/03/05 08:48 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

I've been reading up on extracting psilocybin... Found this interesting link somewhere on a post.
d-e-l-i-r-i-u-m
I would love it if something like this would work to be able to store psilocybin in a stealthy way. Maybe for traveling but I wouldn't recommend it. I will try this as soon as I can. :thumbup:


--------------------
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OfflineDarkie
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Shroomtakular]
    #3811751 - 02/21/05 05:44 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

It's not true is what it is. "A thin layer of blue liquid"? I dont think so. You just made that up. psilocin nor psilocybin are blue and not when oxidized either. The blue comes from another enzyme in the fruits only when they fruit itself is damaged. The extract is not blue. People just makin shit up posting it on the forum like they are experts...yea, experts like shroomgirl who doesnt even know what vermiculite is and hasnt even gone to the hardware store to look for it. Stop posting crap on the forum.


--------------------
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InvisiblePinback
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Darkie]
    #3812246 - 02/21/05 06:41 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

You just made that up. psilocin nor psilocybin are blue and not when oxidized either. The blue comes from another enzyme in the fruits only when they fruit itself is damaged.




Psilocin and psilocybin will oxidize into something blue when incubated with various mammalian tissue homogenates. This is in a mixture free from fungal enzymes. So if you have a reference regarding that enzyme, please post it.

Quote:

People just makin shit up posting it on the forum like they are experts...




:rolleyes:


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OfflineBoffsun
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ryan]
    #3812381 - 02/21/05 07:00 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Ok, i don't know anything about chemistry, but what about mush tea? That shit definitely works. I mean soak the shrooms in hot water, take the shrooms out, drink the water, get really high. Therefore psylocybin MUST be soluable in water, no? in fact sometimes i get higer with tea than with dried. So I'm going to make some tea, and let it evaporate. Any predictions?


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Boffsun]
    #3815981 - 02/22/05 10:16 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Actually, pure psilocin will react with oxygen slowly at room temp to produce a blue compound which is believed to be some kind of diquinone. The blue color may be enhanced by the enzymes (not sure thought), but pure 99% psilocin will turn a bluish green on decomposition at room temp after about a month. Also, for those interested, I have posted a fairly simple psilocin extraction on another board (pm me for info) which uses many readily available chems. It only extracts psilocin, but any psilocybin in the mushroom is dephosphorolated into psilocin with good yields.

Triptamine


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ryan]
    #3822014 - 02/23/05 01:52 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Hi, I'm new on this form, although i don't know a whole lot about shrooms themselves, i have a unique knowledge of chemistry ....arrested for manufacturing of illegal high explosives (hobby). i found manufacture high explosives close to the power of nitroglycerin (dynamite) from scratch... In these synthesis' I've done i most commonly used acetone as my solvent. Acetone is a very easy to get household solvent used to strip paint and a paint thinner. so it would work just as good as pure denatured alcohol. In my experiments with it, it tends to work better by having bigger yields and i think would do the same with any soluble substance. ***only use pure acetone, so don't use it if it has other chemicals in it for they might not evaporate as quick, and you don't wanna to be ingesting some toxic chemicals when tripping***


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ero1287]
    #3822352 - 02/23/05 03:11 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

go to college


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: jc_illenium]
    #3822369 - 02/23/05 03:13 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

so the blue on my rice cake is pure goodness, not badness?
i dont want to eat no nasty badness.


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: jc_illenium]
    #3823278 - 02/23/05 06:25 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Blue on cakes is goodness which has decomposed into an inactive chemical, but usually the bluing is only on the surface, so much goodness remains.

Triptamine


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: triptamine]
    #3823371 - 02/23/05 06:46 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

I looked for the specific information and have not yet found it. BUT, you can tell that the magic is not the source of the bluing because there are look a like shrooms in fields all across Florida (and i would imagen elsewhere)that also blue when damaged but are in no way psycho-active.
I just dont like people disseminating disinformation on this forum (which i like very much and feel kinda protective over). We have the DEA to spread lies about drugs.


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Darkie]
    #3823629 - 02/23/05 07:42 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Here is a better explanation:

Psilocin will decompose at room temp (and faster at high temp) by combining with oxygen to form a diquinone which has a greenish-blue color. Psilocybin however does not decompose significantly and thus has no blue color. This is the primary reason why cubensis (which has both psilocybin and psilocin) will turn blue when brused, but semilanceata (mainly psilocybin, trace psilocin) usually does not blue significantly. Other mushrooms do blue, but by different mechanisms.

Triptamine


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: triptamine]
    #3825596 - 02/24/05 01:37 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

I've made a crude extract of 7g of cultivated amazonian cubensis. I ground into a powder and soaked in denatured alcohol from Lowes for more than 12 hours. I filtered and evaporated the solvent and scraped the thick honey colored residue up with a knife.

I consumed the whole thing in a gelatine capsule and was incredibly disappointed! I got a huge body load, nausea, minimal visuals, was restless and had much trouble sleeping. It was like a bad trip without the trip! LOL! Even had a hangover the next day.

I've heard of techniques which take the initial residue and dissolve it in hydrochloric acid. Basify that solution with NaOH (Lye) and mix with non-polar solvent. Seperate solvent with seperatory funnel and evaporate. Consume remaining residue.

I haven't tried this meathod yet, but when the season comes I'm gonna go picking like crazy and extract a shitload! All that glassware is READILY available on Ebay! I bought a whole mini lab for only a few hundred dollars (but haven't really had the chance to use it for anything).


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: dr0mni]
    #3826170 - 02/24/05 06:26 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Hmmm... I wonder how albert hofmann synthesized it?


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: triptamine]
    #3834713 - 02/25/05 10:12 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Do you have any references on that? Just curious...


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: triptamine]
    #3834719 - 02/25/05 10:14 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Interesting... Any references on that?


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Darkie]
    #3834761 - 02/25/05 10:32 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

you can tell that the magic is not the source of the bluing because there are look a like shrooms in fields all across Florida (and i would imagen elsewhere)that also blue when damaged but are in no way psycho-active.




That makes no sense.

Quote:

I just dont like people disseminating disinformation on this forum (which i like very much and feel kinda protective over). We have the DEA to spread lies about drugs.




Then why don't you be one of the few to post references to support your theories instead of just pulling them out of your ass?


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ChuangTzu]
    #3834923 - 02/25/05 11:29 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I found this technique in a number of places. I think from erowid and lycaeum, and maybe even from the shroomery... I haven't tried this yet, but I'm pretty sure it works. It's the same technique used for Cacti extraction and can supposedly be used for many psychoactive alkaloid containing plants.

The bluing of shrooms is NOT from psilocybin. It is caused by the oxidation of another compound which is also found in many poisonous shrooms. Any color change is a sign of a chemical reaction. If this was psilocybin reacting it would mean that it was undergoing chemical change and becoming something other than psilocybin.

This is very dangerous misinformation because if a newbie hears that blue-bruising shrooms make you trip they are likely to eat some deathcaps by accident!


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: dr0mni]
    #3835872 - 02/26/05 07:12 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Yeah man, I wasn't talking to you. That procedure, even though it gets out lots of other stuff too, undoubtedly works. But nobody has yet put my mind to rest on the topic of bluing.

I agree that the bluing is a sign of chemical change. But how do you know that such a change isn't occuring in either the psilocin or the psilocybin, or both? Psilocin and even psilocybin both oxidize readily in air. The fact that another, non-active, mushroom also blues suggests, but isn't solid evidence, that the bluing comes from the same source. I'm not convinced either way at this point.


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ChuangTzu]
    #3845692 - 02/28/05 09:42 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Deathcaps don't blue. The bluing is not from psilocybin - since it is stable and does not significantly decompose. The psilocin is responsible for the bluing in P. Cubensis and many other psilocybe mushrooms. Of course, a newbie should not eat a mushroom based only on the bluing reaction, as this alone does not identify psilocin or mean it is safe to consume.

Triptamine


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: triptamine]
    #3846384 - 02/28/05 01:44 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I notice you edited your previous posts : ) I'm starting to see some logic in what you're saying now. Can you point me to where I can read about the supposed "diquinone" oxidation product and the supposed stability of psilocybin? My impression is that although psilocin is much more reactive, psilocybin is also rather easily oxidized in air. I'm having trouble accessing the library databases right now or I'd try to dig up some info myself...

I feel bad about hijacking this thread, everyone go back to talking about extraction : )


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ChuangTzu]
    #3850211 - 03/01/05 03:01 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

I've heard psilocybin is stable in air, sooo....If the blue is coming from the oxidation of psilocin/psilocybin then it is mainly coming from the psilocin, right? Studies have shown that in the mycelia there is only psilocin and no psilocybin and in the fruits there is both but mainly psilocybin. Thus, logic would say that if the psilocin is the source of the bluing, then it would be much easier to blue the mycelia than the fruits themselves; which we all know isnt true. Fruits for me have always turned blue just from being dried quickly, mycelia wont do that.
QED, the bluing is not the oxidation of magic. Just because a lot of people have been wrong for a long time doesnt make them right.
SCIENCE HAS IMPROVED, move on.


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Darkie]
    #3850232 - 03/01/05 03:08 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Back to the subject of extracting magic. If one were to under take a large extraction project, odds are they would be doing them for commercial ventures because the fruits' edibility make eating them by far the easiest thing for personal use. And if one were to be doing this commercially they would probably be extracting from the mycelia, much easier. BUT, mycelia extractions would only yield psilocin, which oxidizes in the air, and thus wouldnt keep as well as the psilocybin would. So, how would one go about getting around this hurtle?


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Darkie]
    #3850963 - 03/01/05 09:25 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Darkie:

Hopefully this will answer some of your questions....First, the reference which describes the oxidation (and dephosphorylation) into some kind of quinoline is here:

The enzymatic dephosphorylation and oxidation of psilocybin and psilocin by mammalian tissue homogenates, Biochemical Pharmacology, Vol. 7, pp. 47-54, 1961

This paper can be found on the Erowid site under the "Hoffman collection". In addition, I have seen pure psilocin crystals turn blue, so I know this to be true.

As far as preserving psilocin, it can be combined with an excess of ascorbic acid (vitamin C) in a water or water/alcohol solution which effectivly stabilizes the psilocin. Stored with this method in a refrigerator, it will retain most of its potency for many months (and maybe longer).

Triptamine


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Darkie]
    #3851078 - 03/01/05 10:28 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

according to Stamets Lycaeum when they grew azurescens they "detected psilocybin and in some cases baeocystin and psilocin in the mycelium from agar depending on the concentration of malt extract" (STAMETS & GARTZ, 1995).

so taking this into consideration, if someone was to go into commercial production for the purposes of harvesting their psychoactive properties, someone can extract all three. You still pose a valid question concerning their stability because after using methanol someone was left with a hash-like substance after completely evaporating the methanol. do u think maybe the methanol might have picked up moisture since Miami is known for its humidity? I'd like to know if anyone has modified the Producer's Guide to come up with a more stable product. one, keeps


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: keepsdv8nu]
    #3851131 - 03/01/05 10:54 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Table IV
Variation of the amounts of alkaloids in the mycelium of Psilocybe azurescens depending on the concentration of malt extract in solidified agar (1,5%)after 3 weeks of colonization.

1% Malt Extract:
0.31% Psilocybin dry weight, 0.12% Psilocin, 0.12% Baeocyst.
2% Malt Extract:
0.25% Psilocybin dry weight, 0.09% Psilocin, 0.08% Baeocyst.
3% Malt Extract:
0.28% Psilocybin dry weight, 0.08% Psilocin, 0.05% Baeocyst.
4% Malt Extract:
0.27% Psilocybin dry weight, 0.04% Psilocin, 0.03% Baeocyst.
5% Malt Extract:
0.25% Psilocybin dry weight, 0.02% Psilocybin, 0% Baeocystin
6% Malt Extract:
0.18% Psilocybin dry weight, 0% Psilocin, 0% Baeocystin
8% Malt Extract:
0.05% Psilocybin dry weight, 0% Psilocin, 0% Baeocystin
10% Malt Extract:
At and above 10% malt extract, the mycelium is non-blueing.


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: keepsdv8nu]
    #3852870 - 03/01/05 05:26 PM (16 years, 1 month ago)

Thanks for clearing that up for me Trip, and thanks for the idea Keeps.

FYI: I was recently down at a friend's and got to see "Psilocybin Goo" which is what it was being marketed as. It came as a brown semi-translucent extremely thick....goo(techinically a liquid). It came as a spot in a dime bag about 1 inch in diameter and maybe 1mm-3mm thick. That much would be a very strong trip. They consumed it by splitting open the bag and licking it out. They said it produced a much "cleaner" trip.


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: keepsdv8nu]
    #3855590 - 03/02/05 04:01 AM (16 years, 1 month ago)

keepsdv8nu: I'm sure it did, unless the procedure was done under a dry atmosphere. Methanol sucks water out of the air freely.


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ChuangTzu]
    #8664414 - 07/21/08 09:01 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Psilocin and Psilocybin are very polar molecules, which means that they will dissolve in solar solvents (such as water, alcohols, some acids. It will probably be insoluble in non-polar solvents such as Ether, Chloroform, White/Mineral spirits, Toluene, and the like.


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Greenport]
    #8665438 - 07/22/08 12:20 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Now why would you want to bring back a 3 year 4 month old thread?

:confused:

They obviously finished their discussion long ago.
Not to rag on ya or anything.......:tongue:


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: KaptKid]
    #8674269 - 07/24/08 01:16 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

:nothingtoadd:


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: trikki]
    #8697850 - 07/29/08 04:44 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

i kinda do want to bring it back as well. shroom seasons coming up soon and ive read through all of the posts on extraction and their not clear at all. i came across this idea with the old alexander shulgin question, and the guys doing that extraction just threw in some dried shrooms with high % ethanol. how hard can it be?


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Greenport]
    #8699255 - 07/29/08 10:11 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Greenport said:
Psilocin and Psilocybin are very polar molecules




not exactly, they just have polar ends.
psilocybin is actually amphipathic (a zwitterion); the terminal amine has a slightly positive charge, while the phosphoryloxy group is slightly negative. the overall molecule is neutral.


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Edited by piracetam (07/30/08 10:56 PM)


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: KaptKid]
    #8731272 - 08/05/08 11:41 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

.


Edited by Jestr (05/31/14 08:20 AM)


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project (moved) [Re: ryan]
    #8739290 - 08/07/08 04:14 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

This thread was moved from Advanced Mycology.

Reason:
off topic in advanced mycology


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ryan]
    #14937882 - 08/17/11 05:28 PM (9 years, 8 months ago)

Just wondering if anyone ever tried any of these experiments. Sorry I'm not more helpful myself, but I don't actually use shrooms very often (once a year or less).

We know that psilocybin is soluble in hot water. I've tested this.


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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ryan]
    #15013930 - 09/01/11 09:51 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

i did alot of extractions with 70% isopropyl alcohol. i would let the shrooms soak for 24 hours in mason jars,then let the jar sit in some hot water(not boiling) to heat up the mix then i would pass all the alcohol and shrooms through a coffee filter squeezing all the juice out of the shrooms.then i would re- filter the golden amber liquid. i would place the liquid in a flat circular cooking pan. and cook the alcohol at very low heat if you see bubbles comming out its too hot. the alcohol must not boil just evaporate alot faster. once all the alcohol is gone you will have a sticky red brown goo looking just like isopropil cannabis oilbut with the smell of shrooms lol. you can cook it to a pretty solid consistency. and is very potent with an ounce of dry cubensis i would get like 5-6 grams of that extract.it will dissolve in warm water quite easly.you can also fit quite a good dose in a pill capsule each capsule being a + easly.eat 5 and you're there.


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