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Offlinejc_illenium
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Registered: 01/22/05
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: jc_illenium]
    #3822369 - 02/23/05 10:13 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

so the blue on my rice cake is pure goodness, not badness?
i dont want to eat no nasty badness.


--------------------
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my piss and moans the fuel that
set my head on fire
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Offlinetriptamine
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: jc_illenium]
    #3823278 - 02/24/05 01:25 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Blue on cakes is goodness which has decomposed into an inactive chemical, but usually the bluing is only on the surface, so much goodness remains.

Triptamine


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OfflineDarkie
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: triptamine]
    #3823371 - 02/24/05 01:46 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

I looked for the specific information and have not yet found it. BUT, you can tell that the magic is not the source of the bluing because there are look a like shrooms in fields all across Florida (and i would imagen elsewhere)that also blue when damaged but are in no way psycho-active.
I just dont like people disseminating disinformation on this forum (which i like very much and feel kinda protective over). We have the DEA to spread lies about drugs.


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You gotta wake up to get faded but you gotta get up to get paided.


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Offlinetriptamine
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Darkie]
    #3823629 - 02/24/05 02:42 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Here is a better explanation:

Psilocin will decompose at room temp (and faster at high temp) by combining with oxygen to form a diquinone which has a greenish-blue color. Psilocybin however does not decompose significantly and thus has no blue color. This is the primary reason why cubensis (which has both psilocybin and psilocin) will turn blue when brused, but semilanceata (mainly psilocybin, trace psilocin) usually does not blue significantly. Other mushrooms do blue, but by different mechanisms.

Triptamine


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Offlinedr0mni
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: triptamine]
    #3825596 - 02/24/05 08:37 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

I've made a crude extract of 7g of cultivated amazonian cubensis. I ground into a powder and soaked in denatured alcohol from Lowes for more than 12 hours. I filtered and evaporated the solvent and scraped the thick honey colored residue up with a knife.

I consumed the whole thing in a gelatine capsule and was incredibly disappointed! I got a huge body load, nausea, minimal visuals, was restless and had much trouble sleeping. It was like a bad trip without the trip! LOL! Even had a hangover the next day.

I've heard of techniques which take the initial residue and dissolve it in hydrochloric acid. Basify that solution with NaOH (Lye) and mix with non-polar solvent. Seperate solvent with seperatory funnel and evaporate. Consume remaining residue.

I haven't tried this meathod yet, but when the season comes I'm gonna go picking like crazy and extract a shitload! All that glassware is READILY available on Ebay! I bought a whole mini lab for only a few hundred dollars (but haven't really had the chance to use it for anything).


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InvisibleIntelligentMind
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Registered: 01/27/05
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: dr0mni]
    #3826170 - 02/24/05 01:26 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Hmmm... I wonder how albert hofmann synthesized it?


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OfflineChuangTzu
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: triptamine]
    #3834713 - 02/26/05 05:12 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Do you have any references on that? Just curious...


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OfflineChuangTzu
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: triptamine]
    #3834719 - 02/26/05 05:14 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Interesting... Any references on that?


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OfflineChuangTzu
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Darkie]
    #3834761 - 02/26/05 05:32 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

you can tell that the magic is not the source of the bluing because there are look a like shrooms in fields all across Florida (and i would imagen elsewhere)that also blue when damaged but are in no way psycho-active.




That makes no sense.

Quote:

I just dont like people disseminating disinformation on this forum (which i like very much and feel kinda protective over). We have the DEA to spread lies about drugs.




Then why don't you be one of the few to post references to support your theories instead of just pulling them out of your ass?


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Offlinedr0mni
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ChuangTzu]
    #3834923 - 02/26/05 06:29 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

I found this technique in a number of places. I think from erowid and lycaeum, and maybe even from the shroomery... I haven't tried this yet, but I'm pretty sure it works. It's the same technique used for Cacti extraction and can supposedly be used for many psychoactive alkaloid containing plants.

The bluing of shrooms is NOT from psilocybin. It is caused by the oxidation of another compound which is also found in many poisonous shrooms. Any color change is a sign of a chemical reaction. If this was psilocybin reacting it would mean that it was undergoing chemical change and becoming something other than psilocybin.

This is very dangerous misinformation because if a newbie hears that blue-bruising shrooms make you trip they are likely to eat some deathcaps by accident!


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OfflineChuangTzu
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: dr0mni]
    #3835872 - 02/26/05 02:12 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Yeah man, I wasn't talking to you. That procedure, even though it gets out lots of other stuff too, undoubtedly works. But nobody has yet put my mind to rest on the topic of bluing.

I agree that the bluing is a sign of chemical change. But how do you know that such a change isn't occuring in either the psilocin or the psilocybin, or both? Psilocin and even psilocybin both oxidize readily in air. The fact that another, non-active, mushroom also blues suggests, but isn't solid evidence, that the bluing comes from the same source. I'm not convinced either way at this point.


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Offlinetriptamine
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ChuangTzu]
    #3845692 - 02/28/05 04:42 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Deathcaps don't blue. The bluing is not from psilocybin - since it is stable and does not significantly decompose. The psilocin is responsible for the bluing in P. Cubensis and many other psilocybe mushrooms. Of course, a newbie should not eat a mushroom based only on the bluing reaction, as this alone does not identify psilocin or mean it is safe to consume.

Triptamine


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OfflineChuangTzu
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: triptamine]
    #3846384 - 02/28/05 08:44 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I notice you edited your previous posts : ) I'm starting to see some logic in what you're saying now. Can you point me to where I can read about the supposed "diquinone" oxidation product and the supposed stability of psilocybin? My impression is that although psilocin is much more reactive, psilocybin is also rather easily oxidized in air. I'm having trouble accessing the library databases right now or I'd try to dig up some info myself...

I feel bad about hijacking this thread, everyone go back to talking about extraction : )


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OfflineDarkie
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: ChuangTzu]
    #3850211 - 03/01/05 10:01 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I've heard psilocybin is stable in air, sooo....If the blue is coming from the oxidation of psilocin/psilocybin then it is mainly coming from the psilocin, right? Studies have shown that in the mycelia there is only psilocin and no psilocybin and in the fruits there is both but mainly psilocybin. Thus, logic would say that if the psilocin is the source of the bluing, then it would be much easier to blue the mycelia than the fruits themselves; which we all know isnt true. Fruits for me have always turned blue just from being dried quickly, mycelia wont do that.
QED, the bluing is not the oxidation of magic. Just because a lot of people have been wrong for a long time doesnt make them right.
SCIENCE HAS IMPROVED, move on.


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You gotta wake up to get faded but you gotta get up to get paided.


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OfflineDarkie
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Darkie]
    #3850232 - 03/01/05 10:08 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Back to the subject of extracting magic. If one were to under take a large extraction project, odds are they would be doing them for commercial ventures because the fruits' edibility make eating them by far the easiest thing for personal use. And if one were to be doing this commercially they would probably be extracting from the mycelia, much easier. BUT, mycelia extractions would only yield psilocin, which oxidizes in the air, and thus wouldnt keep as well as the psilocybin would. So, how would one go about getting around this hurtle?


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You gotta wake up to get faded but you gotta get up to get paided.


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Offlinetriptamine
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Darkie]
    #3850963 - 03/01/05 04:25 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Darkie:

Hopefully this will answer some of your questions....First, the reference which describes the oxidation (and dephosphorylation) into some kind of quinoline is here:

The enzymatic dephosphorylation and oxidation of psilocybin and psilocin by mammalian tissue homogenates, Biochemical Pharmacology, Vol. 7, pp. 47-54, 1961

This paper can be found on the Erowid site under the "Hoffman collection". In addition, I have seen pure psilocin crystals turn blue, so I know this to be true.

As far as preserving psilocin, it can be combined with an excess of ascorbic acid (vitamin C) in a water or water/alcohol solution which effectivly stabilizes the psilocin. Stored with this method in a refrigerator, it will retain most of its potency for many months (and maybe longer).

Triptamine


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Offlinekeepsdv8nu
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Registered: 02/28/05
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: Darkie]
    #3851078 - 03/01/05 05:28 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

according to Stamets Lycaeum when they grew azurescens they "detected psilocybin and in some cases baeocystin and psilocin in the mycelium from agar depending on the concentration of malt extract" (STAMETS & GARTZ, 1995).

so taking this into consideration, if someone was to go into commercial production for the purposes of harvesting their psychoactive properties, someone can extract all three. You still pose a valid question concerning their stability because after using methanol someone was left with a hash-like substance after completely evaporating the methanol. do u think maybe the methanol might have picked up moisture since Miami is known for its humidity? I'd like to know if anyone has modified the Producer's Guide to come up with a more stable product. one, keeps


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Offlinekeepsdv8nu
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: keepsdv8nu]
    #3851131 - 03/01/05 05:54 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Table IV
Variation of the amounts of alkaloids in the mycelium of Psilocybe azurescens depending on the concentration of malt extract in solidified agar (1,5%)after 3 weeks of colonization.

1% Malt Extract:
0.31% Psilocybin dry weight, 0.12% Psilocin, 0.12% Baeocyst.
2% Malt Extract:
0.25% Psilocybin dry weight, 0.09% Psilocin, 0.08% Baeocyst.
3% Malt Extract:
0.28% Psilocybin dry weight, 0.08% Psilocin, 0.05% Baeocyst.
4% Malt Extract:
0.27% Psilocybin dry weight, 0.04% Psilocin, 0.03% Baeocyst.
5% Malt Extract:
0.25% Psilocybin dry weight, 0.02% Psilocybin, 0% Baeocystin
6% Malt Extract:
0.18% Psilocybin dry weight, 0% Psilocin, 0% Baeocystin
8% Malt Extract:
0.05% Psilocybin dry weight, 0% Psilocin, 0% Baeocystin
10% Malt Extract:
At and above 10% malt extract, the mycelium is non-blueing.


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OfflineDarkie
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: keepsdv8nu]
    #3852870 - 03/02/05 12:26 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks for clearing that up for me Trip, and thanks for the idea Keeps.

FYI: I was recently down at a friend's and got to see "Psilocybin Goo" which is what it was being marketed as. It came as a brown semi-translucent extremely thick....goo(techinically a liquid). It came as a spot in a dime bag about 1 inch in diameter and maybe 1mm-3mm thick. That much would be a very strong trip. They consumed it by splitting open the bag and licking it out. They said it produced a much "cleaner" trip.


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OfflineChuangTzu
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Re: Psilocybin Extraction Project [Re: keepsdv8nu]
    #3855590 - 03/02/05 11:01 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

keepsdv8nu: I'm sure it did, unless the procedure was done under a dry atmosphere. Methanol sucks water out of the air freely.


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