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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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mushrooms as cure for the foolishness
    #347803 -

I believe that magic plants and shrooms are the cure for our actual madness.
they cancel the residual effects of the kundabuffer (have you ever seen Gurdjieff?) and let us see out of our fucking limits.
maybe it is the reason of their prohibition as if you understand that there's no fear to have ,no hell but your ignorance,no people that can really command you,nothing but the simple searching of the peace..there would not be wars and nobody could sell his weapons,no funds for police and soldiers,no possibility to steal anything.
we're governed by fools...and this foolishness make them afraid of the sanity!!!
I'm almost sure that the economical reason is not the more important formthe drugs prohibition!


Ax



--------------------
Love in the name of the Lord
      JAH RASTAFARI!!

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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Alexander]
    #348129 -

Just realise 85% of people are fuckin idiots.

peace


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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Scarface]
    #348264 -

85% of people *are* fucking idiots, (although that might be a *little* cynical)
and most people can't use drugs responsibly, that's prolly why they're banned.


Take off every 'zig' ...for great justice

Edited by Faaip_De_Oiad on 06/25/01 12:46 AM.


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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Faaip_De_Oiad]
    #349001 -

I'd slightly modify Scarface's statement like so:
90% of the people I've encountered have idiotic tendencies.



--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Scarface]
    #349537 -

They do not cure madness but depresion. They move you from statics and it is the best cure for many kinds of neurosis too. But again got to remember that you should consider them as tools, so mechanic is pretty important too.

____________________________________
Friend to PGF, the Last Resort of lucidity in Western Hemisphere (sp?)

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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Crobih]
    #350054 -

I have found with my experience that the psychedelic experience just breaks down all the barriers our culture has made for us. No longer am I a product of the media, but nothing more than a human. I was stripped of everything I have learned to be true, it was as if I had just been born. The prohibition of drugs is a completely different subject. The bottom line is, no matter what the govt. does we can still have psychedelic experiences, and the law is what keeps us responsible. Why do you think people act so stupid when they're drunk? Cause they can. Seeya.



--------------------
We are ghosts to ourselves as soon as we take the moment for granted. Troydank

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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: conphormant]
    #350139 -

> I have found with my experience that the psychedelic experience just breaks down all the barriers our culture has made for us.

The barriers tend to come back after you're done tripping.

> No longer am I a product of the media...

whether you like it or not you're still highly influenced by the culture you live in, even if its an reactionist movement against some aspects of the culture you were raised in.

I think psychedelic drugs can induce mystical/religious experiences, but their staying power is limited.




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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Kid]
    #350155 -

Not too true. Just remember that curanderos training contains drugs at the begining, to induce "higher" perception. After that training they use them rare or not at all any more. So this fact can be argument for permanent change.


____________________________________
Friend to PGF, the Last Resort of lucidity in Western Hemisphere (sp?)

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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Crobih]
    #350298 -

What does Curanderos training do ?

I don't doubt that psychedelics can cause permanent changes, but they're not always going to be religious or mystical or emancipating.


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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Kid]
    #350547 -

The barriers tend to come back after you're done tripping.
Before the psychedelic expereince these barriers exist in your subconscious, and you are not aware of them. Through the experience you are able to exist for a brief period of time without the barriers. This allows you to become conscious of your barriers, and you can then work to break them if you so desire.

I think psychedelic drugs can induce mystical/religious experiences, but their staying power is limited.
The insights and lessons learned through the experience can then be integrated into your life, if you choose to do so.


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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Phyl]
    #350640 -

> Before the psychedelic expereince these barriers exist in your subconscious, and you are not aware of them.

Sure, you can be aware of them. Anyone should realize that they're limited to the cultural assumptions imposed on them simply because they're a native English (or whatever language) speaker. As for the subconscious, how do you know what's down there? Just because something comes up when tripping, meditating, or dreaming doesn't mean it's been stewing around in the subconscious.

> The insights and lessons learned through the experience can then be integrated into your life, if you choose to do so.

I remember most of the insights I've had while on psychedelic journeys, so that in a way is integration, but it's failed to change me because I'm too skeptical of these insights. I guess it's a matter of faith, but I *did* go into the psychedelic journey with faith and came out a skeptic. I'm not more religious because of psychedelics; I question things more.

Y M M V


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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Alexander]
    #351034 -

I had thought about this for a while before realizing it was totally unfeasible:
What if there was some sort of license to do drugs! as crazy as it sounds, it may as well work. There can be maybe a 5 hour course on safety and such(based on the 5 hour course where attendance is required in New York State to obtain a drivers license, although 5 hours is a bit much for drug safety), and at the end, there would be a test given. It would be fairly indepth and moderately diffiuclt, obviously to weed out those who do not deserve a license.
After getting the license, a person would be completely exempt from all laws pertaining to consumption and possession of an amount of a drug acceptable for a personal use.
For some reason I thought it would work.


I have achieved peace in our time.


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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Kid]
    #351260 -

It depends on regions of Mexico. Mazatecs use Salvia in their first trainings, as the best techer. Then they do morning glory, and after all they finish with mushrooms. After their intensive psychedelics course, they turn toward other techs such as druming, dancing and simmilar.
This all leads me to conclusion that the use of entheogens can show you how to enter those states and once you are fammilar to them, you can enter these states much easier .........because afterall those states are natural ones //just have to find way to them//.
Do not forget that psychedelics are not intoxcants, but inducers....and you have to threat them that way. Remember when you first time approached to the girl. It is now much easier isnt it?

____________________________________
Friend to PGF, the Last Resort of lucidity in Western Hemisphere (sp?)

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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Alexander]
    #352678 -

The psychedelic EXPERIENCE opens our eyes to the undeniable certainty that b4 your eyes were as OPEN as they are at THIS moment
they were 99% closed, this is the first EXPERIENCE ever. But the truth remains whether or not you turn your back on it after you trip; you know there really isnt any choice
to be made, its more like accepting or ignoring, which isnt really a choice so much as a
wierd ego-position..:tongue:

....___^___
...(_______)
........|.|Free
...__ /../..Spore
...|__ / ......Ring


--------------------
.....___^___
....(_______)
........|...|Free
...__ /.../..Spore
...|___ / .....Ring

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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Alexander]
    #352922 -

the friends i used to do acid with (do shrooms with now) have decided that we are going to somehow change this idiotness of everything. ive decided to use my talents of growing shrooms to change the way people think. whether its buy selling some shrooms for cheap to someone i dont know too well and then explaining things to him while hes under the influence or me talking to him while im under the influence. it is so easy to get into an idiot's mind! if they start to make fun of the way youre talking then you start scaring them to death with the truth about everything. if they dont make fun of you then tell them in detail of all the problems. dont let an idiot know youre doing this, just make it seem like a conversation. its a slow process but my friends did it to me without knowing and now that i am an intelligent person i noticed what they were doing. my friends are geniuses!!!

hey, you got to be genuine thats the name of this game. if you're real, then you aint got nothing to worry about, but if youre synthetic then starting tomorrow you're balls come off!


--------------------
the little kridders of nature; they dont know that thyre ugly!


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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Crobih]
    #352967 -

> Do not forget that psychedelics are not intoxcants, but inducers

I think psychedelics are intoxicants. They are a foreign chemical that enters your body and alter the way you behave. You take enough psychedelics and you won't be able to walk straight or talk properly. It just so happens that people are more willing to get to that state with alcohol than with LSD. If roles were reversed and people got smashed on LSD or shrooms (to the point where they can't walk) but only had a drink or two (to relax and enliven conversation), you'd probably call alcohol the psychedelic and shrooms/LSD the intoxicants.


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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: aluminum_can]
    #352968 -

you sound like a fucking retard.


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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Kid]
    #355016 -

--- it is well know thing that every cure can be toxin in higher amounts. When you take small dosage of shrooms----> dosage that is 1000s times lower of LD, you can deffinitelly not make ii consider as toxin.
It is that same thing as sayin " I will take some intoxicants to cure myself from asthma*".
* I hate making paralels of this kind, but basicaly that example sounds good to me.

And do not forget that brain chemistry will be changed, but again calling those substances toxins, you make them sound bad. You make that sensation you have be lower state of mind, intoxicated mind.
And that is not true.
The only truth is that your brain works differently, and afterall you should know that sensations you have in intoxicated states are not the same as when you take some appropriate dosage of some halucinogen.
The only problem is when you express yourself ---> literature or any other form of communitaction can not show the "slight" but very important difference among those chemicals. when you read sympthoms of peyote intoxication, LSD intoxication, it is the same thing. Pretty simmilar to others intoxications such as alchocolic delirium. But we know that is far from the same. Dont we?

____________________________________
Friend to PGF, the Last Resort of lucidity in Western Hemisphere (sp?)

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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Kid]
    #355554 -

In reply to:

The barriers tend to come back after you're done tripping.



Psi experiences act as a catalyst, allowing you to step out of your thinking box to see what's outside of it.

Offtopic:
I have noticed that Psi experiences are quite similar to kundalini experiences. The difference is: one is the intoxicated user, the other is a dedicated sober practitioner.

Another difference is: one is induced [not controllable], while the other is produced [very controllable].

Kundalini is a fire-based energy form originating from the Root Chakra, the perineum - right near the sex organs. Its a self-generating energy phenomenon, where the practitioner harnesses it from the inside, not the outside of his or her body.

All of you have it. The degree of activeness is dependent of the level of experience. The exception is spontaneous kundalini awakening, where the recipient involuntary activated the Root chakra. It's not a pretty experience if the person is not an experienced practitioner. The symptons range from psychosis to depression.

In reply to:


I think psychedelic drugs can induce mystical/religious experiences, but their staying power is limited.



A cynic speaks. A skeptic would love your company.

If Tibetan's coveted word, "Liberation", was that easily attainable through psi experiences, we'd all be Lamas by now.

In most cases, psi experiences are temporary but very insightful. For others, who are destined for kundalini, it's permanent.

Who here wants to grow the wings of Freedom? Who wants to truly taste the Fury of Enlightenment? Whoever does, look at your handwriting. When you're intoxicated, write and see how different it is from your sober writing.

When you're sober, attempt to duplicate the intoxicated style and see how bloody difficult it is to do it. When you can actually duplicate that style, you will certainly see perceptual, cognitive changes in your thinking. With any spiritual cultivation, it takes practice. This technique looks easy but is increbible hard to accomplish. This method [known as Graphotherapy] accomplishes these:

1. Pinpoint where your barriers are
2. Changing style causes changes neurologically and psychologically

In epigenetics, it theorizes the possibilities of new neuro pathways being created from certain practices like: hand formations [mudras], various mediation styles, telepathy practices, etc al..

So graphotherapy is the point of ground zero, where all barriers can be determined and modified. Be warned, whoever decides to attempt this should be a little conversant on subject matter. Graphology is a good start before one attempts to applied the knowledge of making changes to one's handwriting.

Kid, your skepticism and mentality will shift if you decide to do graphotherapy. The only barrier is you in the end. How much you want to break those barriers is how much fury you have inside you.

graphology sites:
www.iihs.com
www.karohs.com

Peace


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Re: mushrooms as cure for the foolishness [Re: Crobih]
    #355655 -

> The only truth is that your brain works differently, and afterall you should know that sensations you have in intoxicated states are not the same as when you take some appropriate dosage of some halucinogen.
The only problem is when you express yourself ---> literature or any other form of communitaction can not show the "slight" but very important difference among those chemicals.

Calling something an intoxicant sounds bad yes. Calling something a psychedelic sounds better. The "sounds bad" is just a matter of pragmatics in language. The semantics dictate that alcohol and LSD are both psychedelic and both intoxicating. It's a matter of word choice.

when you read sympthoms of peyote intoxication, LSD intoxication, it is the same thing. Pretty simmilar to others intoxications such as alchocolic delirium. But we know that is far from the same. Dont we?

Yes, they are very different. In the DTs (delerious tremens, from alcohol), it is the absence of alcohol that induces the mental state. It is the product of addicted brain chemistry. The effects of LSD, peyote and alcohol intoxication are not.




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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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