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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #1301375 -

MarkostheGnostic -

What about spiritual teachers that sell there books ?
Greedy?

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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #1301388 -

Markos - Mushrooms as a sacrament ?

I say that Mushrooms are not special. I say to all, see all things that you ingest into the body as Sacred, Holy and Divine. See all things you do as Sacred, Holy and Divine , including selling Mushrooms.

Edited by StrangeDays (02/12/03 02:35 AM)

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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: flow]
    #1301537 -

I know this old guy that grows pot and when he need somthing
like food, a pressure cooker :grin: ,smokes (eww gross)  clothes
whatever
he gives someone the weed for a trade or get thme to go shoping for him
like for food
that way it doesnt look like he has extra ccash and the heat is "turned down"
and this is in canada!! (where weed isnt the biggest deal to cops, doesnt mean the fucking pricks wont kick your fuckinmg door in ask my older bro! :mad:)
but in the states I see EVEN more reason to copy this great little idea

When I get growing I will trade shrooms to (my friend and their closest one) for
food , weed , and other things (soap toothpaste)etc etc
and that doesnt mean I wont give a bunch away for free! :grin:


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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: flow]
    #1301857 -

I don't see the beef with dealers as long as they don't sell bunk shit or rat poison or some shit. Personally, I consider it a community service. Afteral they bring the supply to the demanders. There's nothing more patriotic or american in the world.


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Molon Labe!

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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: StrangeDays]
    #1302077 -

All things and acts are not intrinsically Sacred. Some can be imbued with sacrality through prayer, benediction, blessing. Others cannot. Lying, adultery, theft, murder, to name some of the most obvious. Sacraments are Sacred 'vehicles,' but like anything else, they can be Profaned. One has to Know the difference between the Sacred and the Profane. If you aren't aware of the Sacramental use of the Mushroom, or of Peyote in the Americas (North, Central and South), then you've got some learnin' ahead of you.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: StrangeDays]
    #1302183 -

I'm spiritual, I'm a teacher, but I'm not a "spiritual teacher." I have also had a Doctoral dissertation published, for which I have received royalties - a wopping $17 and change. The dissertation was of a psychological nature, but it utilized the work of the Tibetan Buddhist Lama Anagarika Govinda, so it was also 'spiritual.' I did not write the dissertation to make money, it is part of the process of receiving a Ph.D. degree. If I re-work the dissertation and publish it under a new title - for profit - that is a legitimate process. I have things to teach, whether at the local university, the middle school I work in, or in a book. I am not acting in a profane way. If I held myself out to be a self-proclaimed 'holy man,' that would be a different story - one of pretentiousness, arrogance and downright fraudulence. And if I tried to sell you on my ego-inflated trip as a "spiritual teacher," which would be a lie since spirituality is characterized by humility, then pride would get together with greed, and you would have the Lucifer-Ahriman situation that Rudolf Steiner wrote about.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #1302479 -

Quote:
Those who sell mushrooms treat the mushrooms AS an illegal drug, rather than as a Sacrament. It depends on what type of mind you have operating...what kind of eyes you have. Catholics do not deny the molecular make-up of wine and its ethyl alcohol content, but they do not regard Communion wine to be a drug, technically or otherwise. Not because the AMOUNT taken is not intended to induce intoxication, but because the physical properties of wine are not 'figure,' they are 'ground' as they say in Gestalt Psychology


Churches don't usually recieve their wine for free.
Are the people who sell the wine to the churches doing the same as those who sell mushrooms? What about those who sell Bible's?
Also, Catholicism is an extreme corruption of true christianity, originally the wine used in ceremonies was heavily fortified with a number of different substances designed to intoxicate those who took it. That is kind of off topic, but i think everyone would agree that the intoxication of the mushroom IS the sacrament.
Also, capitalism rules the day, and no one here is going to change that.
it would be greedy to overcharge in a dry market, but a fair product for a fair price is what makes the world go round.
by your definition, charging someone for anything would be greedy.
if we lived in a perfect world, we would all share everything, however we don't and those who sell shrooms are not "pimps" or "pushers" they provide a valuable service to those who cannot grow on their own, or don't want to.
really, your entire response made no sense at all.

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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #1303204 -

A) buying and selling something doesn't "profane" it, and carrying something around in a golden decanter and cosuming it on certain days of the year doesn't make it "sacred." 

A2) i buy my books from Barnes and Noble. i suppose i have profaned the knowledge therein by paying for the books.

A3) unless your parents provide for you, or you've recently won the lottery, you sell yourself everyday. you sell your labor. you "profane" yourself.

B) you make a lot of ungrounded assumptions....

"Your mentality would see wine as a mere intoxicant, no different than the bottle-in-a-brown-paper-bag-imbibing-bum-on-the-street."

"Those who sell mushrooms treat the mushrooms AS an illegal drug, rather than as a Sacrament."

C) your attempt to make some sort of statement using the Gesalt and Jungian analogies has failed...at least on me. but, you seem to be saying "all people who sell drugs are selling them to people who take them just to "get high", "get off", etc...and thus these people profane the mushroom by abusing its potential as a sacrament.  i have 2 counters: 

1) first, your statement is totally baseless and illogical. a person can buy mushrooms and consume them in order to have a sacred experience. likewise, a person can grow his own mushrooms and consume them to merely "get high."

2) communion is a symbol. we drank grape juice at my church.  and really, i don't see that christians revere wine as sacred. mushrooms are consumed for thier effects....getting high or inducing states of spirituality. wine is a symbol. the whole analogy confuses your argument.

and uh..finally... the whole sacred/profane thing is an issue of morality. and, i think, if you read your Nietzsche a little closer you'll see that morality is the table of a people's over comings. you have a lot of over coming to do. woohoo!! AHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH! BJALKREHRL Ki'm tired. THE END. :smile:


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All refrences to and statements concerning mushrooms, mushroom cultivation, and mushroom related paraphrenalia refer specifically to the cultivation of legal species.

Edited by vaporbrains (02/12/03 03:46 PM)

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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: vaporbrains]
    #1303444 -

He doesn't understand the spirituality of the profane, and seems to have contempt for creation.


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https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-for-renee-goods-wife-and-son

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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #1303780 -

You had a good first argument, but I don't understand what the point was of your last post??? It seems that you just said you wrote the paper to get you PhD, which will lead to money even if the paper doesn't. It's all about what your intentions are. We can't just all go around giving out shrooms to anyone.

I definitely believe in giving to those who will appreciate it, but in the same sense I can't just endlessly give. Growing costs money and more importantly time, and it is silly to think that everyone who wants shrooms should just grow them. This is totally inefficient and unnecessary.

I know I would gladly pay if someone else did the work (but no one can really justify anything more than $100 an ounce). I'd love to go back to the days where everyone in the community had their own job and did something for the good of the community ...but I don't see that happening. If you want to go start a community like this I'm down. Otherwise, I'd say it is fair for people to sell what they grow. They need funding for their project, and the people who buy appreciate the work done and enjoy some shrooms. So what is bad about this?


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"as your attourney I advise you to rent a very fast car with no top, and you'll need the cocaine.."

"well.. why not? I mean if anything's worth doing, it's worth doing right. THIS IS THE AMERICAN DREAM IN ACTION"

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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: flow]
    #1304099 -

Flow and Vaporbrains -
The point here is neither about 'selling' qua selling, or about socially acceptable products like Bibles and wine. The point is about mushrooms, how we regard them, and how our regard is perceived by mainstream society.

Wine can be perceived as a beverage, as a drug or as a Sacrament, depending upon one's intentionality of use. Mushrooms of the psychoactive type are unlikely to be perceived as food, analagously, though they can be seen as medicine by those who know such things. They are certainly seen as dangerous drugs (I'm an addictions counselor, and you'd laugh at the propaganda booklets I receive regarding psychedelics). As to the nature of a Sacrament, this notion is one that I personally cherish, as do members of the Native American Church with their regard to Peyote as the 'Body of Christ.' Politicians and the average Joe, learn that Native Americans retire to teepees on Saturday night for highly structured rituals, during which members are able to freely experience their own individual religious experiences. One doesn't hear of adolescent Indians selling Peyote on the street, or road or whatever. They don't have to because they can join a church that shows them how to use Peyote in the most efficacious way. Legislators have come to recognize the impact of this Church on the reduction of alcoholism, and the development of higher level morality.

So I have a vision for change in society, but the change I envision will never occur without a rather large, positive change in attitude among users of mushrooms. Tim Leary saw this by 1966, only was far too liberal with regard to age of user and his extension to LSD and marijuana. With regard to its dissemination, any student of magickal arts recognizes the value of the construction of ritual items from scratch. The same with any hermeticist or alchemist who weaves prayer throughout the Operation of the Work. The Philosophers' Stone only comes through the working of a Blessed alchemist. Maintaining a magical or mystical identity to mushrooms is going to necessitate a removal from that which is mundane and profane. This will require wisdom and finesse. Impatience, impulsivity, and lack of vision will assure that the Sacred Mushroom never acquires a respectful place in American society and the world.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #1304353 -

keep your religious mumbo jumbo. fuck mainstream society. i'm out.


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All refrences to and statements concerning mushrooms, mushroom cultivation, and mushroom related paraphrenalia refer specifically to the cultivation of legal species.

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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #1304420 -

wow, you really enjoy ignoring the points of the other posters, and trying to make yourself look right by spouting off facts that have nothing to do with the argument.

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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: flow]
    #1304446 -

It all depends on the intention, if you are selling shrooms to anyone or along the lines of high times crap, buy this to get fucked realy cheap $$$ only $90 a gram, trying to make money on people and feeding them with any shit like oh yeah man these shrooms are hydroponicly grown so there stronger then thats wrong.

But if your just selling to close friends or people that can be trusted for a small reasonable amount just to cover costs with no bull shit then thats should be ok.

Shrooms are sacred but sadly you need money to live, and its all these drug dealer that make selling sound bad.


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Fighting the man the best way I can.

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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: flow]
    #1305194 -

Wow, you're really not getting it that someone else's point of view might also be "right" based upon that person's suppositions about reality.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: selling mushrooms=bad?? [Re: vaporbrains]
    #1306098 -

"mumbo jumbo."
"Hocus pocus" - Jack Nicholson [as a 'lesser demon'] in 'The Witches of Eastwick'


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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