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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: budmanman] * 3
    #29672513 -

budmanman said:
Enlil said:
We definitely should.  People should be free to come and go as they please.  As long as they abide by the law here when they are here, everyone is welcome.


Euro countries should do this too so I can go there in and out freely without vetting and tracking so I can jack the ripper 2.0.


Weird how your fantasies involve killing women, but you channel it into hatred of immigrants.

Have you tried being normal?


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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: AlChemicalResearch] * 1
    #29672520 -

AlChemicalResearch said:
Enlil said:
No.  You quoted a law that you either didn't read, didn't understand, or simply wanted to misrepresent.  It is not a criminal offense to be in the united states illegally.


it is a misdemeanor to
  • Enter or attempt to enter the United States at any time or place other than designated by immigration officers;

  • Elude examination or inspection by immigration officers; or
  • Attempt to enter or obtain entry to the United States by willfully concealing, falsifying, or misrepresenting material facts.



So if you come on vacation and happen to stay a few days extra. Not a misdemeanor. If you come through a legal port of entry, then set up a life where you are working, raising a family, paying taxes, yadayadayada that is a misdemeanor. You willfully falsified your intent to leave after a certain date. If ICE agents attempt to detain you and you try to elude them, that is a misdemeanor if you are an undocumented immigrant. If you hopped the border and make it 5 years without being caught, but then you are caught, that is a misdemeanor. No one would call someone who stayed a few days extra on vacation an undocumented immigrant. The literal word "immigrant" is what makes it a misdemeanor. A traveler is not an immigrant. Someone who leaves their home country to permanently settle in another place is an immigrant. If you gained entry, even through a legal port, they wouldn't let you in as an IMMIGRANT without the proper paper work. If you got through, you concealed, falsified, or misrepresented facts. Which makes it a MISDEMEANOR.

You sir, are just wrong.


But ok, if you're like smuggled into the USA against your will, and you are undocumented, that probably isn't criminal, just a civil offense. I guess you're right on that point.


You have successfully shown that you are unworthy of further respect. Thank you.


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Censoring opposing views since 2014.



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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: AlChemicalResearch] * 1
    #29672526 -

AlChemicalResearch said:
Enlil said:
No.  You quoted a law that you either didn't read, didn't understand, or simply wanted to misrepresent.  It is not a criminal offense to be in the united states illegally.


it is a misdemeanor to
  • Enter or attempt to enter the United States at any time or place other than designated by immigration officers;

  • Elude examination or inspection by immigration officers; or
  • Attempt to enter or obtain entry to the United States by willfully concealing, falsifying, or misrepresenting material facts.



So if you come on vacation and happen to stay a few days extra. Not a misdemeanor. If you come through a legal port of entry, then set up a life where you are working, raising a family, paying taxes, yadayadayada that is a misdemeanor. You willfully falsified your intent to leave after a certain date. If ICE agents attempt to detain you and you try to elude them, that is a misdemeanor if you are an undocumented immigrant. If you hopped the border and make it 5 years without being caught, but then you are caught, that is a misdemeanor. No one would call someone who stayed a few days extra on vacation an undocumented immigrant. The literal word "immigrant" is what makes it a misdemeanor. A traveler is not an immigrant. Someone who leaves their home country to permanently settle in another place is an immigrant. If you gained entry, even through a legal port, they wouldn't let you in as an IMMIGRANT without the proper paper work. If you got through, you concealed, falsified, or misrepresented facts. Which makes it a MISDEMEANOR.

You sir, are just wrong.


But ok, if you're like smuggled into the USA against your will, and you are undocumented, that probably isn't criminal, just a civil offense. I guess you're right on that point.


this is very simple:

the vast majority of illegal immigrants in the USA are people that came here 100% legally and overstayed.  those people are potentially guilty of a civil infraction as they have no legal immigration status.  if they snuck across the border, thereby entering illegally, they are potentially guilty of a criminal misdemeanor.  why potentially?  because due process is a thing (or was before MAGA fascists took over immigration enforcement).

instead of running to google/AI to think for you, try using your meat computer and actually reading/comprehending whats being presented to you in the discussion you're taking part in.

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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: Enlil]
    #29672665 -

Enlil said:
No.  You quoted a law that you either didn't read, didn't understand, or simply wanted to misrepresent.  It is not a criminal offense to be in the united states illegally.


Now you're just splitting hairs.  This stinks of (dare I say) sophism.


--------------------
Amanita86 said:
Sui is trying to mod right now.  Kinda like a newborn calf tryin ta stand fer the first time ain’t it..

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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: dinosaurs]
    #29672720 -

dinosaurs said:
AlChemicalResearch said:
Enlil said:
No.  You quoted a law that you either didn't read, didn't understand, or simply wanted to misrepresent.  It is not a criminal offense to be in the united states illegally.


it is a misdemeanor to
  • Enter or attempt to enter the United States at any time or place other than designated by immigration officers;

  • Elude examination or inspection by immigration officers; or
  • Attempt to enter or obtain entry to the United States by willfully concealing, falsifying, or misrepresenting material facts.



So if you come on vacation and happen to stay a few days extra. Not a misdemeanor. If you come through a legal port of entry, then set up a life where you are working, raising a family, paying taxes, yadayadayada that is a misdemeanor. You willfully falsified your intent to leave after a certain date. If ICE agents attempt to detain you and you try to elude them, that is a misdemeanor if you are an undocumented immigrant. If you hopped the border and make it 5 years without being caught, but then you are caught, that is a misdemeanor. No one would call someone who stayed a few days extra on vacation an undocumented immigrant. The literal word "immigrant" is what makes it a misdemeanor. A traveler is not an immigrant. Someone who leaves their home country to permanently settle in another place is an immigrant. If you gained entry, even through a legal port, they wouldn't let you in as an IMMIGRANT without the proper paper work. If you got through, you concealed, falsified, or misrepresented facts. Which makes it a MISDEMEANOR.

You sir, are just wrong.


But ok, if you're like smuggled into the USA against your will, and you are undocumented, that probably isn't criminal, just a civil offense. I guess you're right on that point.


this is very simple:

the vast majority of illegal immigrants in the USA are people that came here 100% legally and overstayed.  those people are potentially guilty of a civil infraction as they have no legal immigration status.  if they snuck across the border, thereby entering illegally, they are potentially guilty of a criminal misdemeanor.  why potentially?  because due process is a thing (or was before MAGA fascists took over immigration enforcement).

instead of running to google/AI to think for you, try using your meat computer and actually reading/comprehending whats being presented to you in the discussion you're taking part in.



what is the context of their overstaying? if when they got here initially and had no intention of leaving before their stay was up, then they wouldn't be here when their stay is up. If they are here after their stay is up, then they misrepresented, concealed, or falsified facts to an immigration officer. Which makes it a misdemeanor.

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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: AlChemicalResearch] * 1
    #29672732 -

Or they "intended" to renew their visa or pursue some other form of proper documentation and legal residency or intended to leave but their circumstances changed or they simply changed their mind.

Regardless, they are entitled to due process, and I think you'd have a helluva time proving your accusations in court.

What precedent are you basing your argument on?

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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: Holybullshit]
    #29672735 -

Holybullshit said:
Or they "intended" to renew their visa or pursue some other form of proper documentation and legal residency or intended to leave but their circumstances changed or they simply changed their mind.

Regardless, they are entitled to due process, and I think you'd have a helluva time proving your accusations in court.

What precedent are you basing your argument on?


so you need a precedent to enforce the law? you dont just need the law?

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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: Psilynut2]
    #29672746 -

Psilynut2 said:
Quote:
No, dude. It's a crime.


  What would you call my pics ?


Mine are bigger...


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"No my dog won't bite you, tho it had the right to. You ought to give him credit, cuz he knows I woulda let him" - Modest Mouse (And Wooof!)
Every one of you should see this video.
"Facts are chiels that winna ding, and downa be disputed" - Robert Burns


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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: AlChemicalResearch] * 1
    #29672785 -

AlChemicalResearch said:
Holybullshit said:
Or they "intended" to renew their visa or pursue some other form of proper documentation and legal residency or intended to leave but their circumstances changed or they simply changed their mind.

Regardless, they are entitled to due process, and I think you'd have a helluva time proving your accusations in court.

What precedent are you basing your argument on?


so you need a precedent to enforce the law? you dont just need the law?


If no one has been prosecuted criminally under your wacky theory, that's a pretty good sign that your theory is bunk.


--------------------
Censoring opposing views since 2014.



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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: Enlil]
    #29672786 -

Enlil said:
AlChemicalResearch said:
Holybullshit said:
Or they "intended" to renew their visa or pursue some other form of proper documentation and legal residency or intended to leave but their circumstances changed or they simply changed their mind.

Regardless, they are entitled to due process, and I think you'd have a helluva time proving your accusations in court.

What precedent are you basing your argument on?


so you need a precedent to enforce the law? you dont just need the law?


If no one has been prosecuted criminally under your wacky theory, that's a pretty good sign that your theory is bunk.



You mean the wacky theory that is laid out in US law? The one where people who had every intention of overstaying their visa/stay and lied about it upon entering the US and that scenario is covered in US law.

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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: AlChemicalResearch] * 1
    #29672814 -

How is that in any way relevant to your original claim which was "being an undocumented immigrant is a crime in and of itself?"

Can you defend THAT statement?  Because what you're doing now is talking about lying on a visa application, which is not "being an undocumented immigrant."  Stealing a candy bar on your way to a cock fight while being an undocumented immigrant is a crime, too, but the undocumented immigrant part of it is irrelevant. What does "in and of itself" mean to you?

Do you have even the slightest inkling of the difference between what you claimed and what you're talking about now?  Or is this some sort of diversion bullshit you learned as a coping mechanism?  Everyone in here is saying the exact same thing:  You're wrong about your ORIGINAL CLAIM. 


Either defend THAT CLAIM or admit that you are wrong.


--------------------
Censoring opposing views since 2014.



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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: lowbrow] * 1
    #29672835 -

lowbrow said:
Enlil said:
No.  You quoted a law that you either didn't read, didn't understand, or simply wanted to misrepresent.  It is not a criminal offense to be in the united states illegally.


Now you're just splitting hairs.  This stinks of (dare I say) sophism.


If we're going down that road, then let's be consistent.  The original sophism in this discussion is the claim that "all illegal immigrants are criminals because being an illegal immigrant is a crime."  That is sophism.  That is using the word "illegal" and equating it to "criminal" and then labeling a group of people as criminals based on that technicality.

But, of course, that sophistry is based on a false equivalence.  "Illegal" and "Criminal" are not synonyms.  One is a subset of the other.  All crimes are illegal, but not all illegal things are crimes.  Failing to pay your phone bill on time is illegal.  It's not a crime.  The difference matters

This difference matters even more when the false equivalence of the two is the very foundation of your argument that illegal immigrants are criminals.

See, most illegal immigrants aren't criminals, in truth.  They are people who have done something illegal, of course, but so is every single american adult and most american children.


--------------------
Censoring opposing views since 2014.



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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: Enlil] * 5
    #29672854 -

"Yeah but I can't just go ahead and understand that, because then the foundations of my being an actual piece of shit takes damage."


--------------------
* Smarts videos :teacher:
* :thumbup: Planet of the APES:thumbup:
 
I'm a fungal white supremacist.

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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: feevers]
    #29672916 -

feevers said:
Being a Nickelback fan is a crime


Nickelback called, when I told them about you they said you're just being rude.

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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: Enlil]
    #29672921 -

Enlil said:
How is that in any way relevant to your original claim which was "being an undocumented immigrant is a crime in and of itself?"

Can you defend THAT statement?  Because what you're doing now is talking about lying on a visa application, which is not "being an undocumented immigrant."  Stealing a candy bar on your way to a cock fight while being an undocumented immigrant is a crime, too, but the undocumented immigrant part of it is irrelevant. What does "in and of itself" mean to you?

Do you have even the slightest inkling of the difference between what you claimed and what you're talking about now?  Or is this some sort of diversion bullshit you learned as a coping mechanism?  Everyone in here is saying the exact same thing:  You're wrong about your ORIGINAL CLAIM. 


Either defend THAT CLAIM or admit that you are wrong.


how do you become an undocumented immigrant?

I edited a post back there to give you weird situations where people come in against their will and not have a visa, etc. The entire concept of IMMIGRATION is leaving your home to PERMANENTLY resettle somewhere. If you are an undocumented IMMIGRANT not a temporary worker, student, etc, you said on your application you were going to leave, and you didn't. That is LYING to an immigration official.

Furthermore, the vast majority of undocumented immigrants come in via the US border and aren't vetted, this means that its reasonable to determine if an undocumented immigrant is found there is a reasonable chance they came in via the border. So if you're an undocumented immigrant and you elude immigration officials from determining that you didn't come in from the border, that is a misdemeanor. If they found that you came here in a vetted manner but then set up a life, bought a house, etc, that is reasonable to say you lied on your visa application and you intended to immigrate to the USA. That is a misdemeanor. The entire concept of undocumented IMMIGRANT speaks to the criminal law on coming through a legal port of entry and LYING to an immigration official and carries a potential jail sentence and a fine. And then it takes on the further civil penalty that requires not being allowed to come back to the USA again for a further period of time.

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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: AlChemicalResearch]
    #29672934 -

Your post only makes sense if you are scared to death of people or afraid of being replaced.  The law is not based on your fear.  You not understanding that does not change the law.

Federally, they could have legislated what you say but they did not.

Edited by gww (09/19/26 12:10 PM)

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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: Enlil]
    #29672993 -

As far as I know entering the country illegally is a crime.


--------------------
Amanita86 said:
Sui is trying to mod right now.  Kinda like a newborn calf tryin ta stand fer the first time ain’t it..

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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: lowbrow]
    #29672996 -

Being an undocumented immigrant is a civil offence.

AI
Criminal law is not based on reasonable chance.

Edited by gww (09/19/26 02:14 PM)

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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: gww]
    #29673004 -

gww said:
Being an undocumented immigrant is a civil offence.

AI
Criminal law is not based on reasonable chance.


Illegally entering the country is a federal criminal offense.  Softening the language doesnt change that:teabird:

Theyre called illegal aliens.


--------------------
Amanita86 said:
Sui is trying to mod right now.  Kinda like a newborn calf tryin ta stand fer the first time ain’t it..

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Re: TRUMP 2020 [Re: lowbrow]
    #29673006 -

Entering being the key word there.

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