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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Gourmet and Medicinal Mushrooms
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Re: Agaricus bisporus - indoor growing from supermarket clone [Re: Chtouxhu] * 1
    #28666339 -

February 18th - Here's an update about the indoor shoebox.
Fruits are finally mature so it's time for harvest.



The pinset was a bit underwhelming, but that might have been my fault, pouring water on the casing may have caused a few aborts. It's important to remember primordia usually form more superficially when growing indoors, in this case they were less than 1 cm below the casing's surface. In the outdoor box they formed at more than 1 cm under the surface.

Interestingly enough, this shoebox actually had a higher spawn ratio (< 0.750 : 5) than the one I fruited outdoors (1:20). Obviously I don't have yet sufficient data to support the following theory, but Agaricus species seem to do great with very low ratios or without grain at all, as many growers in Europe have obtained good results from using pieces of cardboard as spawn material.










Anyway, this is a really easy species to grow indoors in terms of fruiting induction. I expected this to be a lot harder honestly. I need to figure out how to increase yield, but overall I'm pretty satisfied.


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Re: Agaricus bisporus - indoor growing from supermarket clone [Re: Chtouxhu] * 2
    #28672189 -

It's 2nd flush time already for the outdoor shoebox! Gnats won't stop the inevitable :rockon::rockon:



Honestly the pinset looks amazing for such a small box. Hopefully they'll be large and meaty too like they were in the first flush.


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Re: Agaricus bisporus - indoor growing from supermarket clone [Re: Chtouxhu]
    #28679383 -

Awesome thread!

I've been looking at getting into agaricus species, going to order a warm weather culture once it's warm enough to ship.  (Almond portobello, I forget the soecies name).

Do you think they'd fruit on a mix of worm castings and composted manure?  And in hindsight is there anything you would do differently next time with your pasteurization process?

The phase two composting is something I'm trying to figure out.  Both how necessary it is and how to pull it off with what I have on hand without running my pasteurizer for several days.


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And if I only could
I'd make a deal with God
And I'd get him to swap our places
I'd be running up that road
Be running up that hill
With no problems

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Re: Agaricus bisporus - indoor growing from supermarket clone [Re: tree frog]
    #28679772 -

Glad you appreciate the thread!

tree frog said:
Do you think they'd fruit on a mix of worm castings and composted manure?


Definitely yes, I would just be sure to use a high composted manure:castings ratio, since worm castings are usually very high in mineral nutrients and low in fiber (this results in a sticky, sometimes muddy consistency).


tree frog said:
And in hindsight is there anything you would do differently next time with your pasteurization process?


Well, in my first experiment I pasteurized at 50-60°C for 90 minutes, while in the second one I went for 60-65°C for 90 minutes. I used this tek in both cases.
The 50-60°C range sometimes results in a few hitchhiker spores surviving pasteurization (in my case it was probably due to the upper corners of my oven bags not reaching adequate temperature). Usually those spores belong to fungi that evolved to germinate after being ingested by a ruminant (eg: Pilobolus sp., which can actively grow at 40°C and survive 50°C for brief periods of time), so the sudden increase in temperature triggers their growth.
I've come to the conclusion that both methods work, since my Agaricus culture has obliterated all the fungal "contaminants" it encountered. But right now if I had to choose between the two, I'd opt for the 60-65°C. At that range, compost proved to get colonized just as fast, without the appearance of other fungi, which is undoubtedly an unconventional occurrence for an indoor grow (where we usually try to keep everything as species-specific as possible).


tree frog said:
The phase two composting is something I'm trying to figure out.  Both how necessary it is and how to pull it off with what I have on hand without running my pasteurizer for several days.



You don't have to do phase two at all; my compost pile is extremely small, it never reaches more than 30°C (86°F) in the winter. Microbial composition before pasteurization doesn't matter, you are still going to heat-treat your substrate so you're going to favour thermophile organisms (eg: Actinomycetes) anyway. Obviously phase two allows for much faster decomposition and certainly reduces the amount of pests in your compost, but it's not a necessity at all since you're going to pasteurize in any case :smile:.


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Re: Agaricus bisporus - indoor growing from supermarket clone [Re: Chtouxhu]
    #28679834 -

Thanks, I appreciate the encouragement.

I've also been using a lot of recycled substrates in ny active grows recently.  First experiment was a success so I'm expanding it into other grows.

Just repasteurizing at 160f for two hours.  I'd probably run Agaricus this way too with 50:50 new compost:recycled substrates.


--------------------
And if I only could
I'd make a deal with God
And I'd get him to swap our places
I'd be running up that road
Be running up that hill
With no problems

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Re: Agaricus bisporus - indoor growing from supermarket clone [Re: tree frog]
    #28680558 -

That's a very interesting approach, just saw your thread over at mush cult.

I think it could work with Agaricus too; in their natural habitat, species such as Panaeolus decompose fresh manure, which gradually makes it way into the soil and gets consumed by other species such as Agaricus once it mixes with other nutrient sources in the rhizosphere.

One thing I can tell you for sure is that Agaricus species really love a nitrogen-rich substrate (that's why their compost works so well with minimal spawn ratios) and I don't know how much of it gets depleted after two flushes of Panaeolus. You could always adjust it by increasing nitrogen content in the new compost, but for the sake of experimenting I think it would be interesting to try it at least once with a 50/50 ratio, using regular compost.

I was going to say leftover grains could be a problem, and it would be a good idea to let the spent substrate decompose with new compost for a while (as opposed to using it right away after repasteurizing), but considering you use poo spawn for your Pans, grain content is probably negligible.


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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Gourmet and Medicinal Mushrooms
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