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Invisiblewizard2k
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Registered: 05/26/03
Posts: 74
Loc: NRW
Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw
    #2250203 - 01/18/04 12:20 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Hi,
because my English is not that good, I copy and paste some information from Stamets "The Mushroom Cultivator - A Practical Guide to Growing Mushrooms at Home". For me, the Shaggy mane is at the moment one of the most interesting mushrooms, not only because of the medicinal properties. If only one could stop them from liquification...

//Quote from the book:
Like many other species in this genus, Coprinus comatus is a thermotolerant
mesophile that often appears in compost piles. This mushroom was first grown in quantity at the
Dutch Mushroom Research Station using the same compost, casing and environmental parameters
as for the cultivation of Agaricus brunnescens. The authors have grown this species on compost
prepared for Agaricus and on straw alone, although fruitings appear more substantial on the former.
Coprinus comatus is edible and choice. However, the crops are difficult to keep because of the
early onset of deliquescence. By submerging mushrooms in water, deliquescence is slowed and
mushrooms remain in good condition for several days after picking.
Extracts from fresh specimens of this species has been shown to have antibiotic properties,
similar to those from Lentinus edodes.
//End of quote.

And because I did not find a thread in this forum where someone has grown this Species at home, I want you to take part at my testgrow.
- Spawn: Rye-Grain.
- Substrate: Straw (pasteurized with boiling water, soaked several hours).





- Casing: Potting Soil



That's it, for cubensis this tek worked great and I hope to get good results with C. comatus, too.
There is one bag full of fluffy fresh comatus mycelium left, any ideas for experiments?


--------------------
Looking for: Volvariella volvacea, Panaeolus Cyanescens and rare edibles. Trades are welcome!


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Invisiblespores
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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: wizard2k]
    #2250232 - 01/18/04 12:37 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

cool!

I cloned a shaggy mane on some agar a while back, I'll be giving them a try soon as well :smile: .  Good luck and keep us updated :thumbup:

DH


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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: wizard2k]
    #2250330 - 01/18/04 01:27 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Interesting experiment !
I like shaggy man very much. Keep us updated !


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Invisiblewizard2k
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Registered: 05/26/03
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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: ragadinks]
    #2250623 - 01/18/04 04:06 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Thanks for the motivation!
What would you do with the remaining bag of substrate?
Maybe wood chips (beech) mixed with pine bark compost is worth a try.
Any ideas welcome. Something experimental, maybe :wink:


--------------------
Looking for: Volvariella volvacea, Panaeolus Cyanescens and rare edibles. Trades are welcome!


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OfflineBasidiocarp
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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: wizard2k]
    #2250628 - 01/18/04 04:07 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

You might also try a substrate that is about half pastuerized compost and half pasteurized straw. Here in the US you can get pre-pastuerized compost from High Mountain, or you can buy various bagged forms meant for gardening and pastuerize in an oven bag before mixing with the straw. Good luck!


--------------------
"...if the mind is actually part of a continuum, a labyrinth that is connected not only to every other mind that exists or has existed, but to every atom, organism, and region in the vastness of space and time itself, the fact that it is able to occasionally make forays into the labyrinth and have transpersonal experiences no longer seems so strange."

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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: wizard2k]
    #2250809 - 01/18/04 05:13 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

A would try out a mix between straw and worm casting and/or wood chips and worm castings.


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Invisiblewizard2k
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Registered: 05/26/03
Posts: 74
Loc: NRW
Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: ragadinks]
    #2267835 - 01/24/04 10:28 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Hi,

the mycelium has grown through the casing layer. If it is going to produce pins, I will post new pictures.
Worm castings is a great idea. I hope I can get that substrate here anywhere.


--------------------
Looking for: Volvariella volvacea, Panaeolus Cyanescens and rare edibles. Trades are welcome!


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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: wizard2k]
    #2267922 - 01/24/04 11:59 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I have some worm castings. PM me if you want some ...


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OfflineBasidiocarp
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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: wizard2k]
    #2268418 - 01/24/04 04:13 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Hallo, can i ask what environmental parameters you are using for primordia formation?  Stamets recommends 16 - 21 C.  Are you able to provide that temperature drop?  I've had some trouble fruiting species that require pinning temps around 17C because there really isn't any place in my home where I can provide that.

Good luck, I can't wait to hear/see how it goes...


--------------------
"...if the mind is actually part of a continuum, a labyrinth that is connected not only to every other mind that exists or has existed, but to every atom, organism, and region in the vastness of space and time itself, the fact that it is able to occasionally make forays into the labyrinth and have transpersonal experiences no longer seems so strange."

Visit the Psychonautical Society


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Invisiblewizard2k
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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: Basidiocarp]
    #2270843 - 01/25/04 07:47 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Hi, Basidiocarp
this might be a problem and maybe could cause failure. The temp in the room is ~20?C. Do you think it works to place them in the fridge (like you do with Enoki) for some hours or days? I will give that a try, if they don't form primordia at roomtemperature (I still hope they will). An other idea is to grow them on substrate-blocks and soak them in cold water like shiitake-growers do, although the shrooms don't seem to have anything in common at all, besides the low primordia-formation temperature. this would be a great way to control harvesting.
At least for spawn run, they are quite thermotolerant:
Spawn Run:
Relative Humidify: 90-100%.
Substrate Temperature: 76-78 ?F. Thermal death limits have been established at 96 ?F. but
damage can occur as low as 90 ?F.


--------------------
Looking for: Volvariella volvacea, Panaeolus Cyanescens and rare edibles. Trades are welcome!


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OfflineBasidiocarp
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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: wizard2k]
    #2271771 - 01/25/04 03:51 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Some oyster growers recommend a "cold shock" in the fridge for 24 hours or so, although for that genus it's usually not required. Maybe that could work in your case. And who knows, maybe shaggy's don't really require the drop to fruit. Either way, if I were you I'd stick with one approach this time and make it an experiment. Maybe just leave them at room temp and see if you can get fruit. If not, then next time try a cold shock in the fridge, or some other method of cooling.

As far as the shitake soaking: The cold water soak is a great way to control fruiting cycles, but I don't think that really would be an option with shaggy mane's. They are poo lovers, not wood lovers, and are probably cased as well. I don't see how you would soak your cased poo/straw without turning it into a big mess. IT works well with shitake because by the time you soak them, you have creataed a sawdust/chips "log" that holds up no matter what (you can even throw them around the room).

Good luck, keep us informed...


--------------------
"...if the mind is actually part of a continuum, a labyrinth that is connected not only to every other mind that exists or has existed, but to every atom, organism, and region in the vastness of space and time itself, the fact that it is able to occasionally make forays into the labyrinth and have transpersonal experiences no longer seems so strange."

Visit the Psychonautical Society


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InvisiblePinback
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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: wizard2k]
    #2272211 - 01/25/04 06:32 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

IME, they will not fruit at app. 20C to ~26C (68F to 79F). I don't have the means to try them at any lower temp (at least not easily), but I'm currently cold shocking a small box of cased straw/millet. I'll share the results.

I too am interested in the results you get, both with and without cold shock if you decide to do so.


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Invisiblewizard2k
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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: Basidiocarp]
    #2274852 - 01/26/04 04:04 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)


Dunk a cased poo straw grain mix in cold water would not work, that's right. There is not much information out there on growing shaggy manes but I know that there already have been experimets to commercialise the culture of these shrooms. With small success, as you can imagine (no storable strain found). I really would like to read more about this species. What kind of effect does the cold-shock cause chemically and how long does this effect last? I think it is reversible, but it takes quite some time.
Good luck with your culture, Pinback! It seems to be a good idea to surprise them with a cold-shock.


--------------------
Looking for: Volvariella volvacea, Panaeolus Cyanescens and rare edibles. Trades are welcome!


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InvisiblePinback
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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: Pinback]
    #2296592 - 02/03/04 08:55 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Lost mine to green mold. No pins visible. If you want to repeat the failure, here's how I did it:

T+ 0 days: inoculated millet with a clone on agar.
T+15: spawned to straw. High rate of millet:straw.
T+23: cased with verm/peat/CaCO3.
T+33: put the box in the fridge.
T+38: got it out.
T+43: mold.


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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: Pinback]
    #2296825 - 02/03/04 10:50 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I have found a table with the growth parameter of edibles and there it says following about the Shaggy Main:

Latin Name: Coprinus comatus

Common name: The Shaggy Mane

Substrate: Dung-based Compost, Pasteurized Straw etc.

Temperatures:

Spawn: 70-80 F ( 21.1-26.6 C )
Birth-Knots: 60-70 F ( 15.5-21.1 C )
Knots-Pins: 60-70 F ( 15.5-21.1 C )
Pins-Fruits: 65-75 F ( 18.3-23.8 C )


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OfflineBasidiocarp
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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: Pinback]
    #2297847 - 02/03/04 05:17 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Pinback said:
Lost mine to green mold. No pins visible. If you want to repeat the failure, here's how I did it:

T+23: cased with verm/peat/CaCO3.

T+43: mold.




I've given up on using peat as a casing: green mold nearly every time! Now I use simply a thin layer of vermiculite with some gypsum mixed in. Haven't had any green mold since! Cobweb mold, however, is somtimes still a problem, but nothing a dash of salt won't fix.


--------------------
"...if the mind is actually part of a continuum, a labyrinth that is connected not only to every other mind that exists or has existed, but to every atom, organism, and region in the vastness of space and time itself, the fact that it is able to occasionally make forays into the labyrinth and have transpersonal experiences no longer seems so strange."

Visit the Psychonautical Society


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Invisiblewizard2k
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Registered: 05/26/03
Posts: 74
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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: Pinback]
    #2299703 - 02/04/04 07:31 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Hi,
@Pinback: Will you try again? I made two new glasses of WBS-Spawn for more trials. No mold but no pins also :-(

I will place the tray with the cased comatus-straw-substrate outside now, we have temps around 5-15?C (41-59?F). You're not able to grow them in summer then, but nothing is proven from failure. I will keep on trying to grow them indoor.
have a nice time :cool:


--------------------
Looking for: Volvariella volvacea, Panaeolus Cyanescens and rare edibles. Trades are welcome!


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Invisiblewizard2k
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Loc: NRW
Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: wizard2k]
    #2341043 - 02/16/04 02:28 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Hi again!
The first try found its way into the wastebin. No pins. :crying:
Now I did the following:
Straw substrate with a casing layer of bark mulch in a deeper tray.
I'll keep you updated (only a few days and I will have a good digicam). Has anyone from this forums sucsessfully grown Shaggy Mane indoors?
Thanks, bye


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Offlineragadinks
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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: wizard2k]
    #2341591 - 02/16/04 04:22 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

It seems to quite difficult to grow them indoors. Please keep us updated.

P.S.: I think in GGMM it says that they are grown on rich compost very similar to the white button mushrooms. I think worm casting must be ok for that ?!


Edited by ragadinks (02/16/04 05:28 PM)


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Invisiblewizard2k
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Re: Shaggy mane indoor grow experiment on straw [Re: ragadinks]
    #2344701 - 02/17/04 09:01 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Hi raga,
wormcastings will do a great job, I think. They contain high nitrate (ammonium?) like compost does. It is a kind of rich compost IMHO. Yesterday I ordered 1000 worms to produce wormcastings from used substrate blocks and other biological waste. I like the idea of recycling. You can grow a lot of shrooms then and recycle the substrate (worms will reduce the input more than 70% by weight and produce 30% high quality "output" :wink:).
Maybe bark-mulch will work, because it is kind of composted, too.
All the best...


--------------------
Looking for: Volvariella volvacea, Panaeolus Cyanescens and rare edibles. Trades are welcome!


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