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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tregar]
    #27303431 -

This whole thread is super interesting: many thanks. I'll re-read it a few more times.

One simple question: how do you arrive at your recommendations for THH doses? I might have missed an explanation, but I have seen a whole bunch of estimates here. I also checked TIHKAL as well and it says 300mg. Just wondering what your thinking is here.


--------------------
Knowledge is finite, ignorance is infinite.

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: LeafRaker]
    #27303893 -

Thanks for comments natureboy and leafraker. My apologies natureboy, the page is #28 of the bluelight thread and not page 25 like I noted.

I understand your psychonaut apprehension natureboy, 30mg is a great starting sublingual under tongue for 15 minute hpbcd dmt dose, 10mg is too weak.

Leafraker, arrived at tetrahydroharmine doses after reading section in tihkal just as you note. 250mg is amazing, 300mg even of just thh on its own results in around 2 hours of continuous dream like visions like slow and high speed movies in monochrome color. The combo of 250 to 300mg thh + 30mg on up sublingual hpbcd dmt resembles true Ayahuasca or high dose cactus tea, wait till u hear music on it...incredible.

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tregar] * 1
    #27304667 -

Glad you have all the materials Natureboy! :cool:

Thanks for reading LeafRaker.

Tomorrow I will be hitting two elves with one stone. I will take not only 70mg of HPBCD DMT orally with 200mg harmine + 250mg tetrahydroharmine orally all dissolved into a hot tea with some crushed vitamin C to dissolve the harmalas, and report back to see if the experience is similar to using an actual Hawaiian psychotria brew (which is always VERY kick ass super strong, all encompassing & very neon colorful with tracers that go onto infinity)...but after it wears off I will then take 30mg on up of sublingual HPBCD DMT to extend the trip, and bring back 60 to 90 minutes of DMT activity.

message to me:
Quote:
What is the point of that procedure anyway to make an edible version of dmt?


This thread shows how to make in 30 seconds what is called HPBCD DMT, using only a spoon, some HPBCD powder, some DMT, and drops of water.

When you for example make a hot tea with some crushed vitamin C to help dissolve the harmine and thh, and add 180 to 230mg harmine to the tea, along with 150 to 250mg of tetrahydroharmine to the tea, and also add 70mg of HPBCD complexed DMT to the hot tea, it could give you a powerful Ayahuasca experience that is VERY similar to using an actual hawaiian psychotria brew, far more powerful and all encompassing than using 70mg of freebase DMT or 70mg of freebase salt formed from fumarate or DMT salt made by dropping DMT freebase into coca cola or orange juice, etc.

What we are beginning to discover is this: The HPBCD "encapsulated and trapped DMT" theoretically could be forming enhanced modes of transport and delivery of DMT similar to how oral psychotria leaf gives an experience that is much more powerful and all encompassing and colorful than using normal plain DMT crystals.

The experiences from the Hawaiian psychotria brew Ayahuasca tea are always +4 to +5 on the Shulgin scale for myself in over 70 Ayahuasca sessions, while multiple experiments with several people in the Clearlight sessions found the DMT extracted crystals gave only mild experiences (+3 max) even when using doses up to 100mg.

I myself even used doses of oral dmt crystals at doses from 70 to 120mg, and found them all mild as well (+3 Shulgin scale) compared to the VERY strong Hawaiian psychotria experiences (30 to 35 gram tea), just like mind-blowing Jungle Ayahuasca.

Clearlight:
Quote:
Experiments that involved several people found the leaf brew form superior to extracted actives, the leaf brews were very strong and powerful & clairavoyant (+5 Shulgin scale), while the extracted actives were mild (+3 Shulgin scale) at best, even up to 100mg. Again, this is poorly understood.


However, the HPBCD complexed DMT seems to greatly alter the transport, absorption & digestion of DMT freebase crystals, resulting in powerful experiences sublingually so far, perhaps even resulting in oral powerful Ayahuasca similar to those brews using actual Hawaiian psychotria leaf in them.

downwardsfromzero wrote:
Quote:
This combined with the HPBCD complexation results (which we really ought to replicate and confirm) makes me wonder whether there are saccharides in leaf brews which perform a similar effect to HPBCD. There is still so much scope for really interesting research here -thanks for posting.

This is indeed fascinating downwardsfromzero, thanks for that keen observation on the sacchardies, perhaps they do function similar to HPBCD? Note: this procedure will work with any freebase molecule that is poorly water soluble, it does not work with already water soluble compounds or salts.

Jagube said:
Quote:
I've seen anecdotal reports of quidded D. cabrerana leaf being active.

Excellent observation Jagube.

69ron posted 8/12/2009:
Quote:
People are getting pleasant DMT effects from sublingual Virola calophylla resin. I don't think it has that much DMT in it. So why does the resin work so well when DMT is so hard to use sublingually?


HPBCD DMT is very strong...I even used 30mg of it sublingually under tongue for 15 minutes and experienced rapid heartbeat & pulse, tryptamine body rush & buzz, dilated pupils, music sounded incredible, had cev's and open eyed euphoria and profound beauty. I took 250mg of tetrahydroharmine 1 hour earlier so it was more like a true Ayahuasca experience, but no nausea.

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tregar]
    #27304799 -

Eagerly awaiting your report, tregar!

This thread has rekindled my interest in this area. I'm now wondering about reviving my old oxidized freebase and some furmate. It seems I might have been right to conserve them all these years.


--------------------
Knowledge is finite, ignorance is infinite.

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: LeafRaker]
    #27305223 -

LeafRaker said:
Quote:
Eagerly awaiting your report, tregar!

This thread has rekindled my interest in this area. I'm now wondering about reviving my old oxidized freebase and some furmate. It seems I might have been right to conserve them all these years.

Thanks LeafRaker, I say go for it! FYI: on page 2 on post ##27301722 (the post with the 3 pics) I give simple no mess instructions for a yield of 1.5g DMT from 150 grams powdered bark.

I bought my 1kg tub from a supplier of sports supplements 12 years ago, as it was sold right along side pro-hormones which converted to testosterone in the body at a rate of 95% compared to testosterone alone, as you guessed, all pro-hormones like 4-androstenediol were all later banned.

I've been a weight lifter/bodybuilder since my early 20's when I was a full time lifeguard on the beach (love the water, water spirit)...currently my bodyweight is 220lbs at 12 percent bodyfat, follow a strict Palumbo high-protein keto-diet daily for years, 1.2 grams protein per lb of bodyweight per day. I get all my meals and 65 gram protein shake within an 8 hour window everyday (6am till 3pm), and fast after 3pm till I wake up the next day. This keeps my bodyfat low yet retains all the muscle. I run on the treadmill during the fasting period once I get home for 20 to 30 minutes at least 3 times a week. I take bcaa's before I hop on treadmill to keep any muscle from breaking down.

Even at this weight, I still find that 200mg of harmine completely inhibits the monoamine oxidase in my body...in all of my 70 Ayahuasca experiences using 200mg harmine + 220 to 250mg tetrahydroharmine over many years, I find the alkaloid amounts to completely activate 30 to 35 grams of Hawaiian psychotria to the full extent.

Later tonight I will take 200mg harmine + 250mg tetrahydroharmine + 70mg HPBCD DMT (490mg HPBCD powder kneaded, crushed & stirred for 30 seconds into 70mg DMT on a spoon with many drops of water forming a sticky complex for the oral use)...I will report back. Several papers I have read indicate that HPBCD complexed pharmaceuticals even when delivered orally out-performed normal oral versions of themselves by many factors.

I always mix everything together into a 2oz hot water tea with a dash of crushed vitamin C to dissolve the freebase harmine and THH, along with the HPBCD DMT, stir all together well in the hot water tea, just as the Shaman's do, take all together at exact same time, works incredibly well, far better than spacing out the DMT from the harmalas, I should know, I ran several experiments years ago, and the tea where ALL was mixed together outperformed all the other trials consistently.

Edited by tregar (05/12/21 06:01 AM)

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tregar]
    #27305462 -

Here is the HPBCD DMT solution ready to go for tonight

1. Materials: 70mg DMT for oral use, 490mg HPBCD, 1ml pipette, 0.25 to 0.50ml VERY HOT water from a nearby microwaved coffee cup of hot water.

2. Made a 1:1 molar ratio (1:7 mg ratio) of host drug DMT to HPBCD by adding 70mg of DMT onto spoon, added 490mg of HPBCD on top DMT, add 0.500 ml of VERY HOT near boiling water (10 drops) drawn up with pipette from microwaved water in coffee cup. For sublingual use don't overdo the drops, 0.250ml of water (5 drops) is plenty...if you accidentally add too much water then run a fan over spoon to evaporate some of it off.

Knead, mash and stir it all together for 2 minutes using the end of a spoon, notice the two separate powders turn into a homogenous transparent solution when done mashing.

3. For oral use, add the spoon of HPBCD DMT water to 2oz of hot water (120 degree F), it will all dissolve instantly into a totally clear homogenous solution (bottom left photo), take PH of water, it is safe to drink, reads ph = 8 to 9.

4. Store in fridge till later, when ready heat water back up in a pyrex dish on stove to 110 degree F or so, add 200mg harmine + 150 to 250mg tetrahydroharmine, add 150mg pure ascorbic acid (vit C) to help dissolve harmine & THH if they are in freebase form.

Stir all together and consume in dreams, just the way the Shaman's do it, take it ALL mixed together at the exact same time, works incredibly well this way, have over 70 experiences with Ayahuasca over many years.

5. Several papers I have read indicated that HPBCD complexed pharmaceuticals even when delivered orally out-performed normal oral versions of themselves by many factors.

490mg of HPBCD powder may look like alot when laid out, but when even just a few drops of hot water is added to it, it shrinks into a small sticky clear liquid mass as it is derived from a sugar molecule.

With the Ayahuasca journey, she guides you to the existence of a higher spiritual plane...recognized to which insight can and must be gained, yet it does not reject the mundane reality as inferior or empty. This joyous embracement of the world of form leads to words like profound pleasure, beauty and joy. This loving reappraisal of the worldly forms leads the way to higher divine planes.

Last pic: beautiful Shaman woman

Edited by tregar (05/14/21 05:51 PM)

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tregar]
    #27305992 -

The experiment was a success...I took the 70mg DMT complexed to 490mg of HPBCD all kneaded/crushed using end of another spoon...and mixed on a spoon for 2 minutes with 0.500 milliliter of VERY HOT near boiling water (around 10 drops of water). What I do is heat up a bit of water in a coffee cup in microwave & draw up drops of it using pipette. I read using hot water speeds & aids the mixing of the HPBCD to host drug.

I added the 0.5ml spoon full completely clear HPBCD DMT solution to 2oz of 120 degree hot water...this then immediately turned into 100% transparent water when it hit the hot liquid in the pyrex cup...This was stored in fridge until use...then when I was ready, the 2oz clear transparent liquid HPBCD DMT water solution, once re-heated up in pyrex pot on stove, to this was then added 200mg harmine + 250mg THH and also 150mg of pure ascorbic acid (vit C) to help dissolve the freebase harmine + thh.

I gulped it down in one shot...there was virtually no taste! I think the HPBCD completely masked the taste of the nasty DMT...I was shocked...took it all together at same time at 3:30, I'm writing this 3 hours later.

It came on exactly like 30 grams of hawaiian psychotria! there was no difference between this and the leaf brew, again I was shocked...it gripped me powerfully, heavy tryptamine buzz and high frequency. The THH already imparts a body frequency buzz + DMT tryptamine buzz = amazing amplified body frequency.

A vibrating neon colored fortress like a magnetic field surrounded me in the room, it shined off of every object similar to a UV blacklight glow...this neon visual vibration appeared all around me, given off by everything around me. The vibrational frequency field reminded me of the tractor beam in Star Trek when they would transport. I've experienced this same phenomena with past journeys involving 30 to 35 grams of potent Hawaiian psychotria...but never with plain freebase DMT or DMT salts before, only again with this HPBCD DMT.

I had to remain in one spot sitting as it was so strong for 1 hour straight, the walls in the room filled with 3-D ish like honeycomb orange & brown geometrics that appeared to bulge slightly off the surface, like the inside of a bee hive, neon colors were abundant, heavy tracers...the beauty all around me was infinite, beautiful CEV's (spinning and dancing or constantly morphing geometrics) and OEV...I was amazed to say the least.

In conclusion, I am impressed with this route of administration via sublingual or oral.

During the oral Ayahuasca journey (200mg harmine + 250mg THH + 70mg DMT complexed to 490mg HPBCD) for the first hour, all objects glowed or shined as if in caught in a neon colored magnetic transporter beam.

Edited by tregar (05/14/21 05:52 PM)

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tregar] * 1
    #27306258 -

Update at 8pm 5/12/21 around 5 hours later same night, the 250mg 10.5 hour half-life tetrahydroharmine (THH) was still active in my body.

Took sublingual 35mg DMT complexed to 245mg HPBCD on a spoon with less than 0.25ml (only 5 drops) of VERY HOT near boiling water, this was using water that was pre-heated up in microwave in coffee cup, then taken up with end of pipette, and dropped onto spoon with the HPBCD powder/DMT crystals. I kneaded, mashed & mixed it all together using end of a spoon for 2 minutes.

It ALL dissolved into a clear sticky solution after mashing it with end of spoon for 2 minutes--I drew it up from spoon using pipette and placed drops under tongue. It felt like all the DMT dissolved into bloodstream, experienced great effects held under tongue for 15 minutes--sweet taste, as the outer shell of HPBCD is formed from a sugar molecule--no burn! It helped mask the taste of the nasty DMT.

5 minutes after the 15 minute sublingual period, my heart rate & pulse greatly increased, pupils dilated when I looked in mirror, had colored CEV visuals and long CEV lingering after images, open eyed beauty was profound, music sounded incredible once again, felt euphoria and elation. Zero nausea.

Highly recommend complexing DMT to HPBCD for oral use, which simulates actual very strong (+5 Shulgin scale) hawaiian psychotria leaf brew imho, as I've had over 70 hawaiian psychotria + Caapi journeys in the past over many years, or for sublingual use. The HPBCD complexed DMT imho absorbs many factors better than plain DMT freebase or DMT salts in the body, as I have over a dozen experiences with the oral freebase and DMT formed salts in the past for oral use (all only +3 on Shulgin scale). I was blown away by the oral & sublingual HPBCD DMT.

Oral use: 1:1 molar ratio of host drug DMT to HPBCD powder = 1:7 DMT to HPBCD mg weight ratio (70mg DMT to 490mg HPBCD)

SublinguaL: 1:1 molar ratio of host drug DMT to HPBCD powder = 1:7 DMT to HPBCD mg weight ratio (35mg DMT to 245mg HPBCD)

245mg of HPBCD powder may look like alot when laid out, but when even just a few drops of hot water is added to it, it shrinks into a small sticky clear liquid mass as it is derived from a sugar molecule, perfect for "under the tongue" use.

Highly recommend HPBCD complexed DMT. Smile

Edited by tregar (05/14/21 05:52 PM)

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tregar]
    #27308783 -

Amazing orally see post #25, or sublingual, see post #26.

HPBCD is itself very soluble in water (greater than 1000 mg/ml at room temperature). This increases with VERY HOT near boiling water. So now you see how I used 70mg DMT to 490mg HPBCD in 10 drops for oral use...or the 35mg DMT to 245mg HPBCD in 5 drops very hot water I used for sublingual use.

For example, if one were do an experiment to simulate oral Ayahuasca by complexing 670mg of HPBCD powder to 65mg harmine (1/3rd of an oral dose should work fine) + 40mg DMT all together on a single spoon for "under the tongue" sublingual use in order to avoid the dizziness of using say 200mg oral harmine, (but I always take 150 to 250mg THH orally 1 hour earlier which causes me no nausea or dizziness)...

...this may look like alot when laid out on spoon, but once you add between 5 and 10 drops of very hot near boiling water from a pipette taken up from a nearby coffee mug, the HPBCD shrinks into a small sticky clear liquid mass as it is derived from a sugar molecule, perfect for "under the tongue" use. After 2 minutes or so of kneading and mashing all on the spoon using the end of another spoon with the drops of hot water, it forms a TRANSPARENT CLEAR solution.

P.S. I feel great next 2 days. No hangover, cactus trips are great but usually I feel a bit tired the next day, I feel no tiredness from the oral 200mg harmine + 250mg THH + 70mg dmt complexed to 490mg HPBCD oral journey...the trip is strong for 90 minutes, 3 hours total or so...THH leaves a great afterglow next day.

Edited by tregar (05/14/21 05:54 PM)

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tregar] * 1
    #27308800 -

At 9pm that same night, I took another 100mg of THH, for a total of 350mg of THH for the day, before I fell asleep, I watched dream-like monochrome imagery as the THH was still working...for around 30 minutes I viewed mind-blowing vistas--grand architecture and cities, a bookshelf full of ancient books, a view of the gardens in front of what looked like Versailles, France.

I traveled down a street in Midieval period where I saw beautiful women walking along the street, these visions were like slow speed movies, way beyond 4k, highly detailed...true Ayahuasca visions...this always happens when I take at least 300mg or more of tetrahydroharmine during the late evening/night. This is one of the best part of the journey imho.

I've taken 300mg of THH on it's own many times and for hours with eyes closed I view endless dream-like visions, like slow and high speed movies being played for 2 hours...totally unlike normal dreams, she seems to tap into the "Akashic record" of the universe, the ether where all events, past, present, and future are stored...she shows you artwork, architecture, nature, culture, fantasy, history, the future, spiritual, supernatural. The visions are also characterized by the extraordinary beauty that they manifest.

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tregar]
    #27312304 -

This thread is continued here with all trip reports:

https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=96861&p=2

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tregar]
    #27312586 -

the formed complex liquid will remain stable indefinitely in a tincture, it can be frozen. Don't leave in fridge for more than a few days or bacteria could grow.

I'm taking 250mg THH orally one hour beforehand, then will take the 35mg harmine + 40mg dmt (75mg total alkaloids) all complexed to 490mg HPBCD powder (forms a 0.500ml or 10 drop solution after 2 minutes of kneading or mashing the mix on a spoon using very hot water drops using end of spoon) held under tongue for 15 minutes, and report results tonight, along with pics of the process.

This being done to simulate "true Ayahuasca" but hopefully without experiencing "the slight dizziness and heaviness" I experience from using 200mg oral harmine. THH causes me no nausea or dizziness whatsoever at 250mg, so I love to use it in combination all the time, imho 250mg THH is very similar to 250mg of mescaline, very beautiful compound. It combines extremely well with DMT.

Have over several weeks experienced 30mg, 35mg and 50mg sublingually and 70mg orally, trip reports above in this thread. The HPBCD DMT absorbs very well under tongue, but I am trying the above to see if the harmine will MAX OUT the activation of the sublingual DMT, hopefully resulting in maximum powerful Ayahuasca, identical to oral potent Hawaiian psychotria effects, which I have over 70 experiences. The harmine also has nice effects (like being in a relaxing hot tub) on it's own which I wish to include.

This will be my last post, as I need to head back to the gym & water park over the summer.

I will leave it up to the rest of you to experiment should you wish to. I love the HPBCD DMT so much, that I will continue to use it the rest of my life. I'm a very visual person, and love good music, that's why I like to show lots of pics. Ayahuasca is a great way to stay Psychedelic for the rest of your life.

Stay true to yourself. Love, peace and music
http://friskyradio.com
--------------------------------------------
Ready for tonight:

1) 35mg harmine + 40mg DMT + 490mg HPBCD laid out

2) 75mg alkaloids + 490mg HPBCD put in spoon

3) 10 drops (0.500ml) near boiling water added from a nearby coffee cup, used the end of a spoon to knead, mash & stir it all together for 2 minutes, light brownish liquid formed, stored in fridge till ready. Alternately, a mortar & pestal can be used to knead & crush/stir the alkaloids into the HPBCD.

4) Tonight: take 250mg tetrahydroharmine 1 hour before, then place 0.5ml solution under tongue, hold for 15 minutes, 5 minutes later harmine + fully activated 40mg DMT should be felt strongly, for 60 to 90 minutes of strong effects. Re-dose again later if want to.

Edited by tregar (05/18/21 01:54 AM)

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tregar]
    #27312812 -

Results:

1) The HPBCD harmine + DMT sucked really bad, I think the harmine interfered not only with the complexing of the DMT but also the absorption of the DMT under tongue, will never repeat again, effects were very mild.

2) So then, 1 hour later I complexed 60mg of DMT to 420mg of HPBCD, shown in pics, held under tongue for 15 minutes, and it began to come on in only 10 minutes, beautiful strong effects! Now that's more like it, long duration about 90 minutes total. As usual, took 250mg THH 1 hour before. Bad ass!

Experienced PHENOMENAL strength, active for 90 minutes, profound open eyed beauty, maxed out dilated pupils, heavy CEV imagery, music incredible, very euphoric.

3) So my favorites are:

* For oral use: 70mg DMT complexed to 490mg HPBCD using 10 very hot water drops, mashed all together on spoon for 2 minutes, then add this to 2oz of hot water containing 200mg harmine + 250mg tetrahydroharmine + 150mg pure ascorbic acid (vit c) to help dissolve freebase harmalas = 10 out of 10, this gives an experience identical to using 30 grams of potent Hawaiian psychotria, I've had over 70 Ayahuasca journeys using Caapi + hawaiian psychotria, and this was no different! zero nausea and went down in one gulp--taste was pretty much non-existent. All of my dozen 70 to 120mg freebase or DMT salt used orally with Caapi were all only +3 on shulgin scale, all very mild. This on the other hand was a +5 on Shulgin scale, just as strong as the leaf and all encompassing like the leaf. See trip report on post #25.:thumbup:

I'm glad to discover this, as for years all the dried Hawaiian psychotria has been extinct, I think it has all been diverted to the numerous Ayahuasca centers in South America.

* For sublingual use: 60mg DMT complexed to 420mg HPBCD using 10 very hot water drops, mashed all together on spoon for 2 minutes, then pour this under tongue and hold for 15 minutes = 9 out of 10, very awesome strength and zero nausea, it stings a little, but the results are worth it, at the end of the 15 minutes, I spit out all the saliva that's collected in mouth into a cup instead of swallowing...nice long 90 minutes duration. :thumbup:

I just took a strong cactus tea in combination with the still working effects of the 60mg sublingual DMT to enjoy the rest of the evening off.


Edited by tregar (05/18/21 12:54 PM)

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tregar]
    #27313814 -

Many others have joined in the conversation: https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=96861&p=2

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tregar]
    #27315382 -

--------------------------------------------
60mg DMT complexed to 420mg HPBCD sublingual report dosed x 3 times every 2 hours
-------------------------------------------

Full Journey trip report:

Keep in mind using DMT salts sublingually does not work, and the sting is terrible just like you mention Fog. The HPBCD complexed DMT works extremely well, the outer water soluble sugary like tasting HPBCD keeps the freebase DMT trapped inside it's non-polar cone, so as the complex sits under the tongue for 15 minutes...

...you only feel a mild sting for around 10 minutes as the HPBCD releases the DMT directly into the bloodstream from the mucosa membrane under the tongue (only 100 microns thick) as the freebase, only as the freebase will it reach from the bloodstream to the brain with maximum effects. I don't have all the answers, I only know it works extremely well. The tongue is completely fine after, and it's as if nothing happened the next day, 100% no scarring or burning, totally normal.

Be sure to press down with tongue the whole time to trap the sticky complex in the sublingual mucosa.

Give this a try...follow 2 step instructions, 60mg DMT complexed to 420mg HPBCD with 2 minutes mashing on a spoon with 10 drops very hot water and poured under tongue, use your finger to rub any liquid from the spoon under your tongue as well, in case any is left...and hold for 15 minutes, begins to work in only 10 minutes...at the end of the 15 minutes, I spit out any saliva that's collected in mouth into a cup instead of swallowing, for me this has been less than 1/4oz or around less than 15ml saliva.

...and is VERY STRONG...I experienced 90 minutes of very strong effects, pupil dilation maxed out, heavy CEV imagery, open eyed beauty profound, music sounds incredible...feels identical to if I had taken 60mg DMT complexed to HPBCD orally with 200mg harmine with 300mg THH, of course I always take 300mg THH orally any time I do this using the sublingual DMT.

I recommend not using more than 250mg of THH if it is your first time. 250mg of THH causes zero dizziness and ZERO nausea, but 300mg will cause a tiny bit of dizziness for a short time if you are not used to it. I am used to it, so I get no dizziness at 300mg.

The effects were so INCREDIBLE, I RE-DOSED 60mg of DMT complexed to 420mg HPBCD x two more times the same night, every 2 hours...it was the bomb...I was in 7th heaven...:smile:

...never before have I had such insane visuals all night long...all the way till 5am in the morning I was seeing closed eye visions of slow and high speed movies...I saw brightly colored serpents, dungeons I traveled thru, many Mesoamerican pyramids, women of incredible beauty, Japanese landscapes, dancing geometrics, many different animals on a rotating globe, walking on the planet-like globe as it spun, hundreds of visions like slow and high-speed movies over the course of many hours.

I saw the interiors of many magnificent homes, exposed like a camera flash went off, then off to the next home interior, bizarre alien looking creatures, I saw ancient ruins but they were seen as they were before they fell apart. All sorts of architectural wonders appeared that I could not make out exactly what time period they were from.

All the visions were enchanting & manifested incredible beauty. The multi-colored beautiful serpents kept appearing several times in different forms, as if they have some prominence to do with it all, two of them had shining skin covered in gold scales and intertwined like DNA, reminds me of the Aztec quetzalcoatl myth, the "serpent of precious feathers."

...all of these visions were brightly colored due to the DMT and THH combo all night long..it was one of the most powerful psychedelic experiences of my life...and I've taken Ayahuasca x 70 times, cactus 200 times, etc...I have never had over 5 hours of non-stop CEV visions anything close to what I saw the other night...I was blown away, and will be thinking about this for a very long time...this sublingual DMT along with 300mg THH taken orally 1 hour before is my absolute favorite...there is no nausea...I wore headphones and listened to music the whole time, as the music sounded just like if I had taken a very strong cactus tea...out of this world good...I had non-stop closed eye visions all night long, insane visions...totally blown away.

I love the "oral 250 to 300mg THH + sublingual 420mg HPBCD complexed to 60mg DMT administration" as there is a complete lack of "queasiness feeling during the journey", perhaps because there is no harmine/DMT going thru the stomach & intestines...I don't know the answer for sure, but I like it.

Remember, I took 300mg of THH once early on, then every 2 hours I took 60mg of DMT complexed to 420mg of HPBCD sticky liquid under my tongue for 15 minutes held...so I took it x 3 times...

one of the most visionary entheogenic experiences of my life. :shocked:


Edited by tregar (05/21/21 05:47 AM)

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tregar]
    #27315505 -

YES!


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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tyrannicalrex]
    #27315950 -

Tregar,

Do you have a clear preference for sublingual administration over the brew you ingested???


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Knowledge is finite, ignorance is infinite.

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: LeafRaker]
    #27317130 -

Thanks tyrannicalrex.

LeafRaker said:
Quote:
Tregar,

Do you have a clear preference for sublingual administration over the brew you ingested???


Yes LeafRaker. I love the "oral 250 to 300mg THH + sublingual 420mg HPBCD complexed to 60mg DMT administration" over the oral Ayahuaasca as there is a complete lack of "queasiness feeling during the journey", perhaps because there is no harmine/DMT going thru the stomach & intestines...I don't know the answer for sure, but I like it. ZERO dizziness, ZERO nausea, ZERO heaviness feeling.

I recommend not using more than 250mg of THH if it is your first time. 250mg of THH causes zero dizziness and ZERO nausea, but 300mg will cause a tiny bit of dizziness for a short time if you are not used to it. I am used to it, so I get no dizziness at 300mg.

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: tregar]
    #27317169 -

This has all been very interesting. Thanks for your generosity here!

I'm tempted to not just look again at various forms of DMT, but also look at how THH on its own might enrich the mushroom experience. Some of us who have combined mushrooms+MAOis can't seem to agree on how THH impacts the experience, it's probably a good idea to use it on it's own.


--------------------
Knowledge is finite, ignorance is infinite.

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Re: HPBCD complexed DMT made bioavailable sublingually under tongue, also improves oral bioavailability for pharmahuasca & Ay... [Re: LeafRaker]
    #27318109 -

Yes LeafRaker, THH enhances all psychedelics, it brings out their "esssence" to the max.

How to make tetrahydroharmine:

https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=96861&p=1

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