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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
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Incest
    #2202026 - 12/26/03 01:04 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

For the purpose of this discussion, let of us NOT include parent / child incest due to the possibility of psychological damage.

According to the Judeo / Christian faiths; incest must have been part of early man's procreation as there were only one set of progenitors.

I believe that this practice (brother / sister, cousin / cousin) marriage was encouraged early on in Europe in certain families to keep the royality lines "pure" and only later made unacceptable due to the enhancement / continuation of genetic diseases from inbreeding.

*Flash forward to today*

Is it unethical or damaging for a man to "sleep" with his sister or cousin as long as he "double-bags" it (Will that be paper or plastic?)? If the real issue is genetic and no offspring are produced, is this type of play harmful (other than social disdain)?


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleTheHateCamel
Research &Development -DBK
Registered: 01/31/03
Posts: 15,738
Re: Incest [Re: Swami]
    #2202030 - 12/26/03 01:09 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Do other primates practice incest?


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Incest [Re: TheHateCamel]
    #2202035 - 12/26/03 01:15 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Do other primates practice incest?

*see my thread on "Using Animals as Moral Models"*

WARNING: no veering off into bestiality either! :mad2:


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Incest [Re: Swami]
    #2202042 - 12/26/03 01:20 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Well, I can't think of anything morally wrong... except that you might fall in love with your sister and decided that you do want to have a baby, which would be bad. Of course, you could adopt.

The other problem is that you'd be socially shunned if you decided to shack up (alliteration!), so you'd have to run off and start a new life somewhere.

I know this is one of those issues where a lot of people are going to come in and say "NO! THIS IS PLAIN WRONG!", but when you remove the negative consequences, you remove the "wrongness" of the act.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Incest [Re: Phluck]
    #2202047 - 12/26/03 01:22 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

...except that you might fall in love with your sister and decided that you do want to have a baby

Can't one fall in love without first having sex?


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleTheHateCamel
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Re: Incest [Re: Swami]
    #2202049 - 12/26/03 01:23 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

We are animals, and I want to use primates as modles for primal instinct.


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InvisibleTheHateCamel
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Re: Incest [Re: TheHateCamel]
    #2202051 - 12/26/03 01:24 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Or do you have a thread banning that also?


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Invisiblepsyka
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Re: Incest [Re: Swami]
    #2202052 - 12/26/03 01:24 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

bah...*deletes*


--------------------
As the life of a candle,
my wick will burn out.
But, the fire of my mind
shall beam into infinite.



Edited by psyka (12/26/03 01:25 PM)


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Incest [Re: Swami]
    #2202058 - 12/26/03 01:27 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

"Can't one fall in love without first having sex? "

Yeah... I suppose, but once sex gets into the picture emotions start flying. It seems like it would be pretty rare for anyone to fall in love with their sister, it's probably pretty rare outside of isolated communities.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Incest [Re: TheHateCamel]
    #2202059 - 12/26/03 01:28 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Animals do practice incest.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
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Re: Incest [Re: Phluck]
    #2202081 - 12/26/03 01:37 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

But do they get emotionally involved?


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleTheHateCamel
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Re: Incest [Re: Phluck]
    #2202086 - 12/26/03 01:41 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I know, but what about chimps?


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Incest [Re: TheHateCamel]
    #2202090 - 12/26/03 01:43 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Bonobos definately practice incest.

*Edit*... and they're chimps.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


Edited by Phluck (12/26/03 01:43 PM)


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InvisibleTheHateCamel
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Re: Incest [Re: Phluck]
    #2202098 - 12/26/03 01:49 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Okay, so I'll give up on this chimp thing.

Incest is just a bad investment, BUT as long as it is not largely practiced I think that there are no negative effects aside from plucks list.

I wouldn not have sex with my sister or cousin.


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OfflineFrog
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Re: Incest [Re: TheHateCamel]
    #2202110 - 12/26/03 01:54 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Since my comments are usually interpreted as being from personal experience, I will have to refrain from commenting on Swami's topic.

There was one variation that I did so want to bring up, though...


--------------------
The day will come when, after harnessing the ether, the winds, the tides, gravitation, we shall harness for God the energies of love. And, on that day, for the second time in the history of the world, man will have discovered fire.  -Teilard


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Invisiblekaiowas
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Re: Incest [Re: Swami]
    #2202112 - 12/26/03 01:55 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

" the real issue is genetic and no offspring are produced, is this type of play harmful "

I don't even know if that's the REAL issue. it depends on the person and their perspective I think.

so what do you mean harm? because you don't know 10 years down the line after you've buried the hatch with your sister hehe you may be thinking a little different about things. then harm may come into play. hey you could have married your sister and someone found oiut and goes psycho because they think your the abomination and kills you. yeah far fetched but still a possibility.

what an odd question


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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InvisibleSwami
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Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
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Re: Incest [Re: Frog]
    #2202125 - 12/26/03 02:03 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

As frog and I are both adopted and near the same age, it it possible... *raises eyebrows*?


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineFrog
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Re: Incest [Re: Swami]
    #2202130 - 12/26/03 02:07 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I thought I felt a certain "kinship".


--------------------
The day will come when, after harnessing the ether, the winds, the tides, gravitation, we shall harness for God the energies of love. And, on that day, for the second time in the history of the world, man will have discovered fire.  -Teilard


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Incest [Re: kaiowas]
    #2202135 - 12/26/03 02:10 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

so what do you mean harm? because you don't know 10 years down the line after you've buried the hatch with your sister hehe you may be thinking a little different about things. then harm may come into play. hey you could have married your sister and someone found oiut and goes psycho because they think your the abomination and kills you. yeah far fetched but still a possibility."

Well, yeah, but if making up imaginary scenarios where someone irrationally hates you and kills you is an argument against something, then absolutely nothing is right.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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Invisiblekaiowas
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Re: Incest [Re: Phluck]
    #2202149 - 12/26/03 02:18 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

it's not about the individual act themselves but rather that harm comes in many forms and how can one tell of an action now, will have consequences later. because swami did say "If the real issue is genetic and no offspring are produced, is this type of play harmful" and I'm like how could even define the "real issue" like that?


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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