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InvisibleOsker246
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Mushroom Potentcy
    #2014955 - 10/16/03 04:32 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Well I have a quick question for those who know the answer. Since cubensis come an different sizes and weigh different. I was wondering, say you had 4 grams dried with just 2 mushrooms and had another 4 grams with about 6 mushrooms. Would you trip harder off the 4 grams that had 6 mushrooms? I've heard some where that mushrooms produce the same amount of psilocybin no matter how big it is. I'm sorry if this question isn't very clear but I cant think of any other way to put it. I need to know the answer to this before I dose in a few days. I would appreciate any feedback. Peace.


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InvisibleJohn
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: Osker246]
    #2014967 - 10/16/03 04:35 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

That's a good question, I always heard that when cubenis just rupture there veil is when psilocybin content is highest, but I don't know of any research to back it up=\


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OfflineInfrared
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: Osker246]
    #2015050 - 10/16/03 04:57 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

so let me see if i got this right, you wanna know if the amount of mushrooms determines more potency? well not really, just go by the weight, if both were grown off the same batch they should have equal amounts of psilocin per gram. so pretty much what im saying is, 1 mushroom that weighs 4 grams should equal the same amount of psilocin as 5 mushrooms that weigh 4 grams.


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InvisibleTremor1127
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Post deleted by Administrator [Re: John]
    #2015055 - 10/16/03 04:59 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)



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InvisibleJohn
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: Infrared]
    #2015059 - 10/16/03 04:59 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

So your saying 4grams of aborts are equal in potency as 4grams of big shrooms from the same batch:smirk:


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InvisibleJohn
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: Tremor1127]
    #2015066 - 10/16/03 05:02 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Yeah that's true but you can tell if it was picked near the time the veil ruptured by the shape like if it's really convex then it broke recently or if it's really flat then it didn't.


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OfflineInfrared
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: John]
    #2015091 - 10/16/03 05:07 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

i never said anything about aborts, did I? i was talking about regular shrooms, veil broken or not. if they are from the same batch the psilocin to weight ratio should be the same, or very very similar.


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InvisibleOsker246
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: Infrared]
    #2015101 - 10/16/03 05:10 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Alright that was the answer I was looking for. Thanks Deepblue.


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InvisibleJohn
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: Infrared]
    #2015141 - 10/16/03 05:19 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

:smirk: =  scarcasm

There are to many factors to give an acurate anwser though, I just said I heard the psilocybin content is higher right when the veil breaks then slowly the mushroom loses it with age. Like I said I have never seen solid proof but I have read it in many books. Sooo if it were me I would get the smaller one's just incase even if it's not true they will be the same potency and if it's true then they will be stronger, it's a win win situation. Also if they came from the same batch most of them would be around the same size, except for the aborts, that's what I was gettin at. 


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OfflineInfrared
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: John]
    #2015158 - 10/16/03 05:24 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

ive heard that ,veil broken means they are less potent bull honk too. i dont buy it though, the psilocin production might stop once it reached full maturity, but ive never seen a reson why it would actually start degrading the psilocin its already produced. and ive eaten shrooms that havent broken the veil and ones that have, i havent noticed any difference.


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InvisibleJohn
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: Infrared]
    #2015249 - 10/16/03 05:41 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Judging potency by bioassy is really difficult though, especially with psychedelics because set & setting can play a big factor. I have tripped just as hard off 4 grams as 10 before.

About the degrading though, if it did stop psilocybin production, the psilocybin would slowly degrade just if you left LSD in heat or direct light ya know? That's my opnion anyway. But like you said it's probably pretty minimal but no one can be sure without the proper testing.


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OfflineDiMiTriSouljah
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: Infrared]
    #2015261 - 10/16/03 05:44 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

The only thing that I can think of that might be the reasoning behind this non-broken-veil = increased psiloc(yb)in phenomenon is that it possibly puts more energy toward the reproductive cycle (i.e. the production of spores) rather than alkaloid production while the veil is breaking and afterwards. I don't know, it's just a hypothesis, but this happens in many other entheogens (i.e. cannabis)...though it's certainly possible that fungi follow a completely different set of rules. I don't know when spore production begins/ends.


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OfflineInfrared
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: DiMiTriSouljah]
    #2015296 - 10/16/03 05:52 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

i know it puts its energy to spreading spores once the veil breaks. but once your mushroom's veil break, why would you not pick it then. youll have spores all over the freakin terrarium if you dont. i usually wait till right before the cap starts spreadin out, which is like 24 hours after the veil breaks.


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Offlinebaraka
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: Infrared]
    #2017631 - 10/17/03 12:25 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

From my times eating home grown mushrooms mature mushrooms with flat caps are not as strong overall as mushrooms with just a stretched veil. Aborts can be insanely potent compared to mature fruits too. Ive had 3.5 grams of lipa yai aborts blow me away more then a few 5 gram trips of mature dudes.


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InvisibleTerrapinSunrise
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: baraka]
    #2017731 - 10/17/03 01:26 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

each individual mushroom from the same crop may have differing potencies. for example, your single 4g mushroom may have only 0.3% psilocin. on the other hand, if you eat more quantity (but same weight), four shrooms weighing a total of 4g, you may have a better chance at getting individually more potent shrooms. one could be 0.6% psilocin, another may be 0.8%, another 0.2%, and the last let's say has 0.4%. now, if you average the numbers, you will find that the 4 mushrooms are MORE potent than the single mushroom, even though they weigh the same. do you see how this works? you could get lucky though and your single big-ass shroom could just so happen to be one of the more potent of the individuals. but, overall, it is best to have more smaller shrooms because you can ensure that there is a variety of potencies between them.


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OfflineInfrared
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: TerrapinSunrise]
    #2017765 - 10/17/03 01:40 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

mushroom potency varies so much, its like a box of chocolates you never know what your gonna get.


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: Infrared]
    #2019054 - 10/17/03 10:40 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

yOU CAN MEASURE SAFE DOSAGES BY THE DRIED OUNCE OR THE DRIED POUND SINCE IF YOU CRUSH THEM UP AND PUT THEM INTO DOUBLE-OUGHT CAPSULES THEN THE DOSGAE WILL BE THE SAME IN EACH CAPSULE. iT IS TIME CONSUMING AND COMES ON A BIT FAST, WHICH IS NOT REALLY WHAT THE HIGH IS ALL ABOUT. HOWEVER EACH TO HIS OWN. BUT THE POTENCY DOES, AS NOTED ABOVE BY OTHERS VARIES FROM SHROOM TO SHROOM AND FROM COLLE CTION TO COLLECTION. EACH 3 1/2 DRIED GRAMS OF WHOLE SHROOMS CAN HAVE A DIFFERENT AMOUNT OF CHEMICALS INT HEM FROM COLLECTION TO COLLECTION AND PATCH TO PATCH AND DOSE TO DOSE.

,MJi HATE THAT cAPITAL KEY ON THIS KEYBOARD I HAVE. THE SLIGHTEST NICK FROM MY LEFT FINGER TURNS ONTHE CAPS.

IRRITATES THE HELL OUT OF ME.

HAVE A SHROOMY DAY.

MJ


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InvisibleZen Peddler
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: mjshroomer]
    #2027341 - 10/21/03 01:24 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

I dont agree. The one thing I know is that the veil and whether it has broken or not has ABSOLUTELY NO EFFECT ON THE POTENCY OR ALKALOID PRODUCTION OF A MUSHROOM.
For a start there is NO SCIENTIFIC OR QUANTATIVE ANALYSIS that demonstrates that the veil itself has any effect on alkaloid production, secondly you guys are talking about cubensis which is inherantly a mushroom of LOW POTENCY. Your not going to notice the difference between mushrooms harvested before or after their veil has broken - if you do with a mushroom like cubensis, id suggest placebo is playing its part.
The veil is a membrane - like a skin - sometimes it breaks early somtimes it stays around - doesnt mean that one mushroom who has a persistant veil is any more potent than one that doesnt.
The contention that the development of spores stoping the alkaloid production in the mycelia (coversion of tryptophans into psilocybin related alkaloids) doesnt stand up to any type of biological hypothesis. If we assume that the alkaloids are present to protect the fruitbody until it produces and disperses spores, why would it stop before it has directly been successful in its aim? If we assume that the fruitbodies contain alkaloids to attract human use, again this owould only serve the purposes of the mushroom if the fruitbodies had or were currently sporalating.
Since gartz and others have not even been able to pin-point when or how the conversion of these alkaloids begins or ends, this is all heresay, and even if it was true, with cubensis's potency, is a pointless discussion.
Every time i read this i just cant believe that some bullshit spread years ago by PF - who's level of bullshit was only equalled by Captain Max - is still doing the rounds


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Edited by Zen Peddler (10/21/03 01:31 AM)


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: Mushroom Potentcy [Re: Zen Peddler]
    #2027513 - 10/21/03 02:35 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Nice csite Blue meanie,

can I get those references from you of the Kata and James papers,

mj


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