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Offlinechargrt
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Registered: 03/13/01
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Last seen: 13 years, 6 months
Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms?
    #617739 - 04/24/02 10:23 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

is this possible? I haven't been able to find much research inolving this sorta debate but it seems possible. The reason for my concern is that me and my best friend went on a shroom trip together. We each had about 3.5 g of some cubies, potentiated with 5g of syrian rue extract. My level of concern arises from the fact that pretty much after the trip ended...she started to became a changed person. Within a week she thought everyone hated her, began to hear voices in her head, and see ghosts...quite the full plate, eh?

But is it possible that tripping can unlock some sort of latent schizophrenia, or can the experience itself lead to a pyschosis once it's over? I must admit I don't know a whole hell of a lat about MAO inhibitors, but might this have some causal effect?

I was just wondering your thoughts on this and if anyone else has experienced similar long-term effects from hallucinating in general...thanx!

PEACE


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Invoke the One together, so Both may disappear.


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OfflineSherlockDrubu
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Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: chargrt]
    #617793 - 04/24/02 11:36 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

You must not have "researched" very hard...

Mushrooms can make any subsided mental illness emerge, including schizophrenia, depression, and bi-polar syndrome.


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OfflineCatalysis
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Registered: 04/23/02
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Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: SherlockDrubu]
    #617800 - 04/24/02 11:44 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

It is very much possible.


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OfflineskaMariaPastora
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Registered: 03/15/01
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Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: chargrt]
    #617833 - 04/25/02 12:21 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

The interesting question is, does tripping aggravate preexisting mental diseases or does it actually cause them? I don't think we can ever really know because the tripper never had symptoms prior to the trip so you don't know if the psychosis was in fact preexisting. But given the proper set and setting, the instances of permanent psychosis are vanishingly small, so you shouldn't really spend your time worrying about it.


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OfflineWildCardsRevenge
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Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: skaMariaPastora]
    #617998 - 04/25/02 03:59 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Tripping aggravates preexisting mental diseases it doesn't cause them. of course i'm not expert on the subject far far from it.
But if you look at how many people trip and have no lasting mental after effects. If tripping did cause it then wouldn't there be alot more people who experence problems after tripping, and i don't mean feeling funny for a few days but actual lasting problems.
I think the actual number of people who have gone crazy because of tripping can be counted on your hands and feet(I don't really know its just an example)

my two cents on the topic
peace


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OfflineCub
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Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: WildCardsRevenge]
    #618004 - 04/25/02 04:06 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Good call wild card. I agree, I doubt that tripping will cause that sort of mental disturbance in and of itself. It sounds like your friend had some deep rooted mental problems to begin with. I'm sure it's possible that the experience aggrivated them. Either that or it could be unrelated craziness, or a cry for attention.


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Offlinegnrm23
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Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: chargrt]
    #618311 - 04/25/02 12:53 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

hmmmmm...
any super-intense experience can "blow the door off the hinges"... and tripping is right up there in life-experience intensity... and adding the harmala alkaloids may sedate things a bit, but it also may deepen the trip level as well...
if you can get ahold of books by dr abram hoffer, you may find that he has some useful suggestions concerning ways to ameliorate long-lasting halluninatory episodes... (search keywords may include: megavitamin therapy, niacin therapy, niacinamide & lsd psychosis, orthomolecular psychiatry schizophrenics anonymous, hoffer-osmund diagnoistic...)
do not attempt self treatment for schizoid episodes... and do be willing to be open with physician or mental health worker... and do consider purchasing a bottle of niacinaminde (a form of vitamin B3) to help folks come down from trips that don't seem to want to stop on their own...
ymmv...
(oh, and if you each had 5 gm syrian rue EXTRACT on top of 3.5 gm shrooms, well, that is a lot of extract --- heck, 5 grams of syrian rue seeds is probably equivalent to at least 200 g mixed harmal alkaloids, and possibly quite a bit more... and it the extract is like 5x or 10 x, well, that a LOT of harmine & harmaline... and there are other chemes in the seeds besides MAOi chems... it is possible that the anticholinergic chems that are also found in the seeds act similar to belladonna alkaloids...
good luck with helping your friend regaining a "grounded state"...


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old enough to know better
not old enough to care


Edited by gnrm23 (04/25/02 01:26 PM)


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OfflineHBS
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Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: gnrm23]
    #618341 - 04/25/02 01:33 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

I am not fully informed on trips bringing out illnesses, etc., but I will put some input in from personal experience ...

I took a 7g trip on Ecuadors in late December where I went farther into frightening insanity than I have ever gone on a trip before ... there were no more normal concepts, everything in life was a lie ... just the scariest experience of my life, I could never and would never repeat it, even if I were given the shrooms for free. Suicide was more than definitely an option.

For two months after, I felt somewhat mentally scarred. Life looked a lot different, I became horribly paranoid, and I could not look at my room or anything in life pleasantly. That trip completely fucked with me, and I worried I wouldn't "come back" to how I am normally. It passed after a while, but for the time being that was pretty scary.

I don't know, these are just some thoughts from my most intense experience.

HOWEVER though the main aftereffects are gone, some of the things I went through, saw, and learned that night have stuck with me night and day, and most of it is very unpleasant realizations and thoughts about the world and life ...

I am never going above a full-eighth again, those are the trips that really fuck with me ... every time I've dosed high I have had a night of pure hell and after effects which seem to persist for a long time, and some which never go away ....

those who wish to explore the high dose realm better be ready, I know I'm not ...


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OfflineJust a Punk
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Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: HB]
    #619121 - 04/26/02 07:09 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

I personally need a high dose to be satisfied by the experience. (at least 4 grams)

I love being in a deep hallucinogenic state, I feel very "at home". It's weird.

Sometimes I think LSD/Mushroom reality is more real than day to day reality. My theory is that these compounds open a door in your mind. After a while your mind expels the compoudns from your brain and forces the door shut. Maybe some people's brains have trouble shutting the door again.


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:B


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Anonymous

Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: chargrt]
    #619605 - 04/26/02 05:49 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

People are all about some "tripping cant cause mental illness, only bring it out," but I think it might be possible to suffer some form of 'psychosis', after an especially bad trip, I've certainly heard of such things. I'm not sure if schizophrenia or whatever is genetic, or is acquired, but if its the latter, then I'd wager to say if you tripped your balls off and thought everyone you knew was trying to kill you, or something crazy like that.. and believed it to the core of your soul as so many psychadelacized minds can do.. then who knows.. you might end up a paranoid schizophrenic.. Especially if you hear the 'shroom entities' in your head ;D


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OfflineShroominSpradl
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Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: HB]
    #620810 - 04/28/02 12:00 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

i hear you heavenlyblue. sounds like the same thing that happened to me. i'm never venturing over an eighth again! i'd advise not to eat 4.5 g of PR abhorts unless you know what your getting into and have a trip sitter.


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All posts are merely fictional stories that I dreamt. Who woulda thought!

"Reality is a crutch for people who can't handle drugs."


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OfflineSherlockDrubu
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Registered: 04/24/01
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Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: ShroominSpradl]
    #620814 - 04/28/02 12:08 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

It is scary. Everytime I dose high, it always sucks majorly, but I try to learn from it. If there is something bothering me, I try to think of what I can do to fix it and try at it. If I can't think of a way to fix it, I don't worry about it


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OfflineDinoMyc
Ipsa scientiapotestas est
Registered: 11/14/99
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Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: chargrt]
    #620823 - 04/28/02 12:21 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

When you see something that changes your understanding of yourself and the world.. of course "you" will change. If that change made you realize how fucked up humans are and how poorly they treat everything, you will likely abhor with that state.
Think of the effect walking into the concentration and death camps at the end of WWII had on the soldiers.. how it chaned their world..


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If I made affront, I apologize.
If I made affirmation, I apologize.
I merely came to listen, came to say.


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OfflineParanoidSchizoid
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Registered: 04/30/02
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Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: DinoMyc]
    #625707 - 05/03/02 02:40 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Everyone can develop schizophrenia, it just takes something fucked up to trigger it. It can be something that happened long ago. It can happen slowly or quickly. My dad shot himself when i was 5 and I'm 18 now. I went through I complete mental change over the past few months. I think certain drugs(marijuana, shrooms, all the natural ones) can make a person really understand what's going on in the world. They will begin to understand how the government and everything else is a bunch of brainwashing. The government does not want people to understand their fraud so they waste all this money on anti-drug shit for their protection. When I realized what a shitty place humans have turned this world into, I wanted to kill myself and I came pretty damn close to doing it. The drugs really open a new level of thinking. Humans really only use a small percentage of their brains in this society, but I think drugs can help to open the other 90% up. I wouldn't even consider it a problem. It's just a different understanding of things. Those are just my thoughts.


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Growing conspiracy
Everyone's after me
Frayed ends of sanity
Hear them calling
Hear them calling me


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OfflineDoublethink
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Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: Just a Punk]
    #625716 - 05/03/02 02:54 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

This sounds like Aldous Huxley's experience with mescaline.
What he and biopsych people theorize is that we have sort of a consciousness valve.. this valve is closed to let in only the things important to survival (he doesn't say that, but its sort of like how you aren't listening then someone in the room says your name.. and you realize that subconsciously you were listening all along but your brain just closed out everything because it wasnt important) what low does mushrooms (before you hit the cross talk and begin "creating") is twist the valve open a bit... read Aldous Huxley's Heaven and Hell and The Doors of Perception.. great book


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Offlinegrowin
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Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: ParanoidSchizoid]
    #625934 - 05/03/02 07:59 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

"Humans really only use a small percentage of their brains in this society, but I think drugs can help to open the other 90% up. "


i think scienc prooves diffrent. i was in a lecture of a profesor and he was real ampiric and i havnt coght him on a manipulation of facts.
anyway, he showed brain waves and how they were manipulated from lsd usage and it was diffrent, but not more efficiant or MORE in any other way.

that fact that we use only 7% of our brain and we can use the rest and be more smart is bullshit. damn, i even heard some one say that in the future we will use much much more % and we'll be telepathical and we could do what we want with the power of our thoughts. i even heard someone say that albert einstain used 14%.... its just a popolistic myth.

psychedelics do change your way of preception - but it dosnt make u MORE smart - jsut a diffrent smart, depends on what your defenition of smart is.
i think it just messes with your senses for a while + the extreem expiriance during the rtip = emotinal and cognetive changes for a while.

a friend of mine never touched alcohol ( or even a cig) and befor even taking a puff from a joint he took some lsd. he kinda got mad for a while, hearing voices of deamons crawling out his thrught wich he visualized as a huge hellish hole, they called him to write a one word book, but he didnt know what it is.
also he had a thing for digging a huge hole, and he started spending his time digging a hole for a period of his life...

some times people dont take it well because its too much. graduality is the smart thing to doo (lucky me).
although doing psychedelics did change me it didnt do it all at once and the expiriance wasnt traumatic.
the 1st time i took lsd i didnt feel it (it was a real low dose i guess). i forgot about the expiriance and moved along with my life. i didnt realize it changed me for more than 8-12 hours. after about 3 days i went to a see 'amrican psycho' with my dad and when in the parking lot i got to a point wich i thought 'mmm...what if i killed him now?'im not a violent man in and i dont have any issues with my dad - i love him very much, i just go so suked into the movie...
i then went to the park and started running and dancing feeling realy emotionly OD but not knowing why and then i just sat and started to rationlize why am i feeling like this and then i rememberd that trip i took a few days before.

people just need to know what their getting into.

a growin original



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OfflineParanoidSchizoid
Fun Guy With TheFungi
Registered: 04/30/02
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Re: Possible long term psychosis from mushrooms? [Re: growin]
    #625976 - 05/03/02 08:51 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

That's interesting. I am just saying that drugs make people think more and it changes their perception of reality. I'm speaking logically. I guess. Fuck, i don't know. I was talking about natural drugs, too, not LSD, but I guess it doesn't matter if they do the same thing to the same chemicals in your brain. It doesn't even matter anyway, no one will ever know it all for sure. Definitely not in our lifetime anyway. In my opinion, the human mind is the most complex thing ever, so you have to expect anything. And about my definition of smart, it's really hard to put into words. Actually I'm not even going to try to explain it because this is getting off topic. Everyone have a safe trip. Peace.


--------------------
Growing conspiracy
Everyone's after me
Frayed ends of sanity
Hear them calling
Hear them calling me


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