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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: tekramrepus]
    #1788957 -

>>>He's just trying to prove himself as intellectual and basically boosting his ego. If anyone needs soul work, its him.<<<


Oh that wasn't pretentious at ALL.


--------------------
https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-for-renee-goods-wife-and-son

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1789481 -

Don't know if I'm in the wrong thread ... but ... I love the phrase ... "LSD, a word that brings out an acute psychotic reaction in people that have never taken it"

NewbieHardcue


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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: BillyHardcue]
    #1789508 -

this doesnt have much to do with the topic either but .. this whole thread is jacked
anyways, a girl in my class asked a question in psychology and she kind've had a point
she asked about how when people are depressed it can make them physically sick sometimes if they're so upset and stuff..
so she asked what if people are very well balanced and happy, could it help them physically

the teacher answered itd kindve be impossible to be well balanced since theres too much going on in your head.. but who knows, theres times you can totally clear your conciousness on enough drugs ;x

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: Ori]
    #1789543 -

And I think to myself ... "What a wonderful girl"

SlightlyHardcue

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: Ori] * 1
    #1789760 -

Quote:
theres times you can totally clear your conciousness on enough drugs ;x 



For me thats what psychedelics do under the right dosages and conditions. Having no thoughts or desires. Free from your ego you slpash into the moment and disslove into eternity. It doesn't last ,but when you come back you see the world and your involvement in it differently. After see'ing the light from were we came its like a new faith. Your not enlightend, but you have a perspective of what it is.
To be able to leave the physical plane and dissovle into the spiritual world and come back is a true gift. We should all be greatful of these substances that allow us to do that. Used properly the potential for psychedelics in healing us and our culture is breathtaking. :heart:
Just my viewpoint on it.

 


--------------------
Some rise
Some fall
Some climb
To get to Terrapin!!!

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: tekramrepus]
    #1789895 -

It's laughable that you think I try proving myself as an intellectual as an anonymous poster on a site dedicated to psychedelic mushrooms. Even if this is truly what you believe about me, does this mean that you can dismiss my views?

Quote:
To be honest, pretty much all illnesses have their roots in past lifetimes, genetics, or emotional turmoil. That is a fact.


You clearly don't understand the meaning of the word "fact." There's no evidence whatsoever that people live past lives. I'd like to see you cite a scientific source for that bullshit fact. All you've done is demeaned yourself and this thread by attacking my credibility and destroying your own.

BTW, are you a scientologist?

Western medicine tells you to get excercise. Western medicine is responsible for curing and treating the majority of diseases that have been or are treated. Ever heard of polio? Ever heard of penicillin?

Sorry man but what you're saying is total nonsense. If you want to believe that LSD is good for your soul, that's totally fine, but don't try passing it off as a "fact" that LSD is more useful than all of Western medicine.

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: HarveyWalbanger]
    #1789900 -

HarveyWalbanger said:
What exactly is your beef against acid?


I don't have a beef against acid. LSD was always a lot of fun. I think LSD should be legal for everyone to enjoy if they chose to do so. Just because I don't think LSD has magical healing powers doesn't mean that I dislike it. What's with these attempts at discrediting me?

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: Phencyclidine]
    #1790300 -

DOOOD doncha know Phencyclidine will make yer brain bleed? :wink: j/k
you got everyones brains bleeding all over the net man! You need to cut that shit it's too pure for the G/P :smile:(an even worse j/k)
WR:rasta:


--------------------
To old for this place

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: whiterasta]
    #1790412 -

What's "G/P", mang?

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: Phencyclidine]
    #1790481 -

General Population?


--------------------
https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-for-renee-goods-wife-and-son

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1790525 -

Duh, I'm a smartie pants.  Thank you, Hitler. :wink:

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: Phencyclidine]
    #1790975 -

Quote:
Western medicine tells you to get excercise.  Western medicine is responsible for curing and treating the majority of diseases that have been or are treated.  Ever heard of polio?  Ever heard of penicillin?


For what it's worth, quite a lot of Western Medicine was, for a large portion of its existance, rather harmful to its patient in general.  Only since about 1900 has it really matured and, even so, I don't think it's near where it should be at.

Western Medicine is also stealing at a rapid pace from Eastern Medicine.  :smile:  Turns out there really is a basis for thinking some of those odd herbs have certain beneficial properties.  *grin*  Not to mention that Eastern medicine tends to focus equally on treating both the body and the spirit, as it were.

...Did you know that the once-a-day birth control pill originated in ancient china?  It was made with a similar process to how the pill was made through most of the 20th century -- boiling down the urine of pregnant mares.  :smile:


--------------------
"Do we want the stars? We can have them. Can we borrow cups of fire from the sun? We can and must and light the world." --"On the Shoulders of Giants", Ray Bradbury

All of my posts are full of fiction and blatant lies.

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: Phencyclidine]
    #1791058 -

Sorry if I'm covering things people have allready said. This is a long thread and I just saw it and I wanted to throw my two cents into the pot.

Quote:
Psychiatry on the other hand I admire. It looks for illness. It searches for biological causes. It searches for ways to treat disorders. It has it's problems but it's not like psychology.



That's my main beef with pyschiatry-it's become applied neuropharmacology,and nothing more. I think biological concepts are important in the understanding of mental illness and medication (btw,I'm very interested in neuropharm),but these claims are overly reductionist and with our poor understanding of the brain:over simplied. I've meant a lot of arrogant psychiatrists who think they know everything.If I hear another doctor say "you must have low serotonin levels or too much chemical X",I'm going to get violent. (Just look at those ridiculous chemical flow charts on pathology). As China pointed out,psychiatry actually means something like "soul doctoring". In my experience,psychological explanations are totally overlooked by most psychiatrists. Most are just experimental med checkers.

And as far as LSD having no use in medicine,I think that's totally wrong. It's hard to conduct studies when something is in C1,so I'm only pointing out anectdotal evidence,but there is a lot of information out there that LSD might be useful for cluster and related headaches and possibly even OCD.


--------------------
People think that if you just say the word "hallucinations" it explains everything you want it to explain and eventually whatever it is you can't explain will just go away.It's just a word,it doesn't explain anything...
Douglas Adams

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: Sev]
    #1793996 -

Sev said:
Quote:
Western medicine tells you to get excercise.  Western medicine is responsible for curing and treating the majority of diseases that have been or are treated.  Ever heard of polio?  Ever heard of penicillin?


For what it's worth, quite a lot of Western Medicine was, for a large portion of its existance, rather harmful to its patient in general.


Huh?  Give me a little bit more information about these nonsense claims.  Some medications will have nasty side effects, including harmful ones.

Quote:
Only since about 1900 has it really matured and, even so, I don't think it's near where it should be at. 


Since 1900, yes, Western medicine has started kicking ass.  LOL.

What system of medicine is more advanced than Western medicine today?

Quote:
Western Medicine is also stealing at a rapid pace from Eastern Medicine.


Stealing?

Quote:
Turns out there really is a basis for thinking some of those odd herbs have certain beneficial properties.


And how is this "stealing"?  Do you expect doctors to say, "Oh, well, we can't use that medicine because another culture uses it."  The reason herbal remedies don't get huge investments is because they can't be patented.  Western medicine can't steal them because they don't belong to anybody.

Quote:
Not to mention that Eastern medicine tends to focus equally on treating both the body and the spirit, as it were.


Western medicine won't concern itself with treating the "spirit" because the spirit is outside the realm of science.  If the mind needs treating, Western medicine has a specialized branch to deal with it.  Some treatments that are oriented around physical treatments could use better integration with counselling and support services though.

Quote:
...Did you know that the once-a-day birth control pill originated in ancient china?  It was made with a similar process to how the pill was made through most of the 20th century -- boiling down the urine of pregnant mares.  :smile: 


That's an interesting footnote to the fact that the great majority of useful medications have their origins in Western medicine. 

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: monoamine]
    #1794005 -

Just because a substance may have a possible use doesn't mean that it is known to be useful. When I say that LSD is currently useless to medicine, that's because it has no known use. If they found a use for LSD tomorrow, then the fact that today I said that LSD is useless to medicine would be correct.

Regarding the other issues, I've made a few posts about anthropological psychiatry above.

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: chinacat72]
    #1810380 -

chinacat72 said:
Quote:
theres times you can totally clear your conciousness on enough drugs ;x 


For me thats what psychedelics do under the right dosages and conditions. Having no thoughts or desires. Free from your ego you slpash into the moment and disslove into eternity. It doesn't last ,but when you come back you see the world and your involvement in it differently. After see'ing the light from were we came its like a new faith. Your not enlightend, but you have a perspective of what it is.
To be able to leave the physical plane and dissovle into the spiritual world and come back is a true gift. We should all be greatful of these substances that allow us to do that. Used properly the potential for psychedelics in healing us and our culture is breathtaking. :heart:
Just my viewpoint on it.

   


I completely agree with that.  Whenever I trip, im able to feel things i've only dreamed about. Like when I can just sit in the middle of the woods or by a river for hours, just taking in the beuty of life. Or at a show, just dancing to the music and everything goes away except for me, the band and the music. Psychedelics are a sacrament. When thoughts can be so simple but yet so complex.  When life can be so perfect and beutiful how can one put a price on that or have a law against that. 

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: chinacat72]
    #1811982 -

chinacat72 said:
Quote:
theres times you can totally clear your conciousness on enough drugs ;x 


For me thats what psychedelics do under the right dosages and conditions. Having no thoughts or desires. Free from your ego you slpash into the moment and disslove into eternity. It doesn't last ,but when you come back you see the world and your involvement in it differently. After see'ing the light from were we came its like a new faith. Your not enlightend, but you have a perspective of what it is.
To be able to leave the physical plane and dissovle into the spiritual world and come back is a true gift. We should all be greatful of these substances that allow us to do that. Used properly the potential for psychedelics in healing us and our culture is breathtaking. :heart:
Just my viewpoint on it.

   


fucking right on! 


--------------------
Work like you dont need the money.

Love like you never been hurt.

Dance like nobody is watching.

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: Phencyclidine]
    #1812205 -

The problem with western science and medicine is that it often totally discounts subjective experience. I understand the whole point of being objective in science,but in psychiatry and a lot of other medicine, taking subjective expreriences seriously is key. For example,I don't think SSRI antidepresants are nearly as effective as doctors believe. I think in a lot of instances,they just makes people complain less and make people outwardly look less depressed,but truly they don't feel any happier.

Quote:
Just because a substance may have a possible use doesn't mean that it is known to be useful.



But it is known to be useful (maybe not to mainstream science),but it's so difficult to study,it's nearly impossible to prove.I imagine if LSD wasn't a C1 and didn't have as much social stigma attached to it,it would be proven useful for the treatment of cluster headaches, certain heart conditions,and treatment refractory OCD. Afterall,there is a solid theoretical foundation for why it might work for said conditions.

BTW,many, if not most,of the early, famous "psychedelic idealists" thought that the psychological uses of LSD were beyond the realm of science because these aspects could never be objectively prooven. However,that still doesn't necessarily mean it's not useful for psychological conditions. (BTW,my personal opinion is that LSD is too unpredictable to be used in psychiatry,besides a few special circumstances.)


--------------------
People think that if you just say the word "hallucinations" it explains everything you want it to explain and eventually whatever it is you can't explain will just go away.It's just a word,it doesn't explain anything...
Douglas Adams

Edited by grandmasterfat (08/14/03 02:25 AM)

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: monoamine]
    #1821626 -

grandmasterfat said:
The problem with western science and medicine is that it often totally discounts subjective experience. I understand the whole point of being objective in science,but in psychiatry and a lot of other medicine, taking subjective expreriences seriously is key.


Like I already pointed out though, anthropologically oriented psychiatry already and medical anthropology don't discount subjective experience at all. The placebo effect has been known for decades. That indicates awareness and interest in the patient's subjectivity. Other areas of medicine don't need to address subjectivity. Antibacterial drugs will inhibit enzymes responsible for building cell walls whether you're aware of it or not. On the other hand, anecdotal accounts (subjective reports) of a drug's efficacy can be tossed into the garbage can in many cases, because they're not reliable.

Quote:
Just because a substance may have a possible use doesn't mean that it is known to be useful.



But it is known to be useful (maybe not to mainstream science)


Where is it known to be useful and by who? I don't consider the positive opinions about LSD by people who are obviously pro-psychedelic drug to be worthy of much consideration, just like you don't think SSRIs are as effective as many believe. If there was hard evidence, and LSD was known to be effective, then, well, it would be known. In this case, if there's no evidence, then it's not known. Science has to operate on a broader social level. If only one person knows that substance X causes cancer, then no, it's not known, and if you aren't able to reproduce the data supporting that conclusion then I simply can't take the claim that substance X causes cancer very seriously.

Quote:
but it's so difficult to study,it's nearly impossible to prove.I imagine if LSD wasn't a C1 and didn't have as much social stigma attached to it,it would be proven useful for the treatment of cluster headaches, certain heart conditions,and treatment refractory OCD.


The simple fact is that right now LSD has no medical use. It was studied for decades. There are volumes of books documenting medical research with LSD. Nothing comes to any conlusion. It looks like LSD can't be used for any known disorder at this point. Maybe one day it will. I have no objection to that. What I do object to is people claiming that it is a medical fact that LSD is medically beneficial. It's not.

Quote:
Afterall,there is a solid theoretical foundation for why it might work for said conditions.


Any references to literature about this?

Quote:
BTW,many, if not most,of the early, famous "psychedelic idealists" thought that the psychological uses of LSD were beyond the realm of science because these aspects could never be objectively prooven.


Anthropological sciences have grown a lot since then. I think you would be genuinely and pleasantly surprised if you picked up a book about medical anthropology.

Quote:
However,that still doesn't necessarily mean it's not useful for psychological conditions.


I would disagree with the initial assessment of LSD's effects being beyond science.

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Re: ChinaCat, Its getting sickening [Re: Drummer]
    #18685472 -

Drummer said:
Is there any real family touring with the dead, or did they just turn the keys over to a bunch of kiddies who are driven by greed and have a "holier than thou" air to them.
Maybe I just have not had the pleasure of meeting any of them, but the ones I did meet left a bad taste and really give me doubts about the future of any type of movement (which for the life of me I would love to see happen again).



Pretty much yeah, but Chinacat72 was a part of that since he was very low on the totem pole and would just sell doses at shows just to fund his addiction to coke and heroin.

The whole GD "scene" has been going downhill since the late 70s and it was really bad when Chinacat72 came along and just got worse and keeps getting worse.

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