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Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace
    #10771298 -

http://www.tcpalm.com/news/2009/jul/30/busted-myspace-2-fl-men-face-charges-over-gang-pho/?feedback=1

Quote:
LEE COUNTY — Elvis Rodriguez, 30, flashed Latin Kings hand signals on his MySpace.com page and called himself “King Kamel,” according to his arrest report.

Richard Figueroa-Santiago, 22, used his MySpace page to post pictures of friends making “Eastside” hand gestures, detectives said.

Now, in the first cases of their kind in Florida and in the nation, both Lee County men face five years in state prison for the gang-related content of their Web pages.

Their prosecutions are the first under a state law passed last year that criminalizes the use of electronic media to “promote” gangs.

Attorneys for both are challenging the law as unconstitutional.

“It violates his right to free speech, to associate,” said Joseph Cerino, Rodriguez’s lawyer.

The bill’s sponsor, a retired police officer, calls the law a modern response to increasing gang violence in some Florida cities.

“We have seen from day one until now that none of our freedoms are absolute, and the freedom of expression is not absolute,” said Rep. William D. Snyder, R-Stuart.

The defendants appear to share little in common — Rodriguez has been arrested seven times in the past 10 years for a variety of non-violent crimes. Figueroa-Santiago has no apparent criminal background and, according to his father, was a student at Southwest Florida College at the time of his arrest.

Both were nabbed in November as part of “Operation Firewall,” a slate of arrests by the Lee County Sheriff’s Office that netted 15 people, including a Bonita Springs felon charged with stockpiling weapons, six juveniles with flashy Myspace.com accounts and a pair of middle-aged men accused of recruiting gang members.

Their arrests came weeks after a new anti-gang law hit the state books. House Bill 43, a 95-page bill that created or tweaked some 35 different statutes, stiffened penalties for gang-related crimes, upping certain charges when a documented gang member is involved.

One of its statutes applies to “any person” who uses “electronic communication ... to intimidate or harass other persons, or to advertise his or her presence in the community.” The law covers Web sites, e-mail, faxes and texts, among forms of media.

The Lee County prosecutions appear to be the first in the state, according to officials with the Florida Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers. The law itself is unique across the nation, according to the National Gang Center, a federal program that tracks anti-gang legislation and methods.

Snyder, a former Miami police officer, said he’s watched gang violence grow since leaving the city in 1993.

“It’s increased exponentially since I left Miami,” he said. “We knew there were gangs down there, but the traditional hardcore (Los Angeles)-street gangs had not yet arrived.”

Now they have, he said, and they’ve grown membership in other parts of the state, as well. The new law brings anti-gang efforts into the present day, Snyder said, where members are more likely to post messages and boasts on Facebook walls instead of building sides.

“Gangs are evolving, they’re changing,” Snyder said. “I would challenge that once someone said spraying walls was freedom of expression.”

Becky Steele, director of the Tampa branch of the American Civil Liberties Union, said the statute raises First Amendment issues, and she calls it “guilt by association.”

“The statute is so broad that you could be arrested for something you’re not aware has anything to do with gang activity,” Steele said.

Derek Byrd, a director of the Florida Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers said the law was a “ridiculous” effort that cast too wide a net.

“I’m a member of a gang,” he said. “I coach my Little League baseball team. We all wear uniforms, we flash signs, we all wear the same colors.”

The law reflects a national trend of preventing gang members from associating with one another, according to John Moore of the National Gang Center. He mentioned gang injunctions, in which documented gang members are prohibited from being in the same area together, even when not under probation.

“They’re well-intended,” Moore said. “Some can be, I think, quite effective. Others of them are quite limited by the burden of proof on the state that these kids meet all the tests (of being gang members).”

Ensuring that the right people are being prosecuted — gang members over posers — relies on prosecutors and other court players doing their jobs, he said.

“Authorities have to be judicious in the way they use these laws,” he said. “Otherwise, public resentment will build up.”

Samantha Syoen, a spokeswoman for the State Attorney’s Office, said prosecutors have used the law successfully in at least five juvenile cases from the November arrests. All received probation.

In motions filed before Lee Circuit Judge Ramiro Manalich, attorneys for Rodriguez and Figueroa-Santiago argue that their clients’ postings are protected expressions under the state constitution.

“We looked at the statute and talked with some other defense attorneys about it,” said Robert Gary Hines, who represents Figueroa-Santiago. “It clearly looks to me like it’s unconstitutional.”

Their motions will be heard together in early August. Regardless of the result, higher courts will likely be asked to decide for themselves.

The challenge comes as no surprise to Snyder.

“I fully anticipated that it would be appealed,” he said. “And it should be completely vetted and thought through at the trial level.”




Seriously? Have we really sank this low? This law is so unconstitutional, there should be laws, criminal laws against passing legislation this fucking retarded. The people who came up with this bullshit should be the ones going to prison.


SERIOUSLY, GOD DAMMIT, AMERICA!!!

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #10771391 -

I hate gangs and anything I can do to fight it its cool but regardless these people have their rights just like your or I. Sad to see this.


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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: MHbound]
    #10771574 -

If the case is as described, this indeed sounds unconstitutional. 


Classic content based discrimination.

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #10772202 -

Just when I thought america couldn't get any funnier!

Land of the free?  LOL.


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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: RupturedHernia]
    #10772270 -

HAW HAW!

This is what America has been begging for, for years.

And now we finally have it.  Yay.


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What can we do to help you stop screaming?

Official Mr Shoebat lackey.

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #10772532 -

Laws for gangs are quite questionable in general.  In LA here they have really intense anti-gang laws such as you can't gather in groups of certain sizes if you have been labeled as a gang member.  That said the gang problem here is far and away the worst in the country, its really out of fucking control.  Honestly I am getting fucking sick of walking around even somewhat nice areas of Los Feliz, Echo park and the like and seeing these assholes walking around.  Stay well below the I-10 you fucks. However, I will always vote for the constitution

Edited by Chespirito (07/31/09 05:31 AM)

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: Chespirito]
    #10772654 -

Pretty much how I feel chespirito, though I don't have to deal with any real gangs.  (was in traffic court and some douche ahead of me was charged for disorderly conduct and when the judge asked what happened after he pleaded guilty, he started with "me and my gang were walking around and then my sister....", lol.  The kid was like 16 and a little fat shit..)


What makes a "gang" different from any other group of people?  That difference is what should be charged.


I have no problem with courts ordering people with convictions not to associate with others, or congregate in public, but the problem is when its a prohibition applied to everyone or assesed without due process.

California's justice system seems to be pretty much of a joke anyways, though... Maybe if they got rid of their stupid ass sentencing laws and started putting the violent/thieving assholes in jail, you wouldn't see those retards so much.

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: johnm214]
    #10784504 -

back when i was in high school even having a bandanna would get you a referal(punishment). the kids who got punished for this were trendy white kids who had never seen a real gang in their lives


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"Beyond the viel of the human mind there is a gesalt energy that is a  pure and loving light. It is the source, creation, the one. Some people call it God, but a name cannot describe it. It is the pure energy that gives and connects all life. We come from this place and we return to it. It is the pure energy that gives and connects all life."

-chinacat72

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: pistola321]
    #10785340 -

pistola321 said:
back when i was in high school even having a bandanna would get you a referal(punishment). the kids who got punished for this were trendy white kids who had never seen a real gang in their lives



Isn't guilt by association FUN!

Remember when you had the right to freely express yourself?

Yeah, neither do I.  :lol:


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What can we do to help you stop screaming?

Official Mr Shoebat lackey.

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: TGRR]
    #10800449 -

I use to say we are heading toward a police state but we've been there for a while now. It's like the story about gradually heating the water and the frogs don't know they are being cooked until it's too late. We have been cooked, smoked and done to a turn. Mr "change" is leading the way toward totalitarianism just like shrub did.


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“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: Stonehenge]
    #10800492 -

This has nothing to do with Obama.  It's a Florida law.

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #10805843 -

I didn't say he passed that law, i said he was leading the way to a totalitarian state, which he is.

People hold still for this crap and then when are they going to say enough is enough? The first amendment lies in tatters.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: Stonehenge]
    #10806363 -

Stonehenge said:
I use to say we are heading toward a police state but we've been there for a while now. It's like the story about gradually heating the water and the frogs don't know they are being cooked until it's too late. We have been cooked, smoked and done to a turn. Mr "change" is leading the way toward totalitarianism just like shrub did.



Agreed until you brought up the Obama part. I am absolutely ashamed my fellow Americans, even if they are in one of the most fail states, would ever pass a law this ridiculous.

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: drift]
    #10807224 -

drift said:
Agreed until you brought up the Obama part.



Another Obama cock sucker. While he may have nothing to do with the Florida law, he is responsible for signing into law (and wanting to sign more) the most reprehensible changes to hit this country in a long time. That's saying nothing about all his broken campaign promises.

The man is despicable.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #10807288 -

luvdemshrooms said:
drift said:
Agreed until you brought up the Obama part.



Another Obama cock sucker. While he may have nothing to do with the Florida law, he is responsible for signing into law (and wanting to sign more) the most reprehensible changes to hit this country in a long time. That's saying nothing about all his broken campaign promises.

The man is despicable.



This has nothing to do with Obama. Merely pointing that out makes me an Obama cocksucker? Nice logic you have there, Chief.

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #10814882 -

Fucking Florida man, we have some of the most retarded, brain dead and corrupt political vermin ever seen.  And Lee county is one of the worst counties.  I used to live there, its terrible, the locals find the worst people they can and make them their leaders.

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: Stonehenge]
    #10816077 -

Stonehenge said:
I didn't say he passed that law, i said he was leading the way to a totalitarian state, which he is.

People hold still for this crap and then when are they going to say enough is enough? The first amendment lies in tatters.





The first amendemnt is about the strongest its ever been- certainly within the last thirty years or so we've seen the absolute top, and we're very near that point now.


I was going to make a thread about these kinds of statements...


People constantly imply that we're at a low point in our constitutional rights from the perspective of those that existed at ratification, and I can't see how its true.


The first amendment by no means lies in tatters, and we have probably  have the most respect, or near their, for freedom of speech out of any other country.  Further, it hasn't been tattered, it has continuosly gotten better throughout our nation's history up to this point.


Maybe you didn't mean anything to the contrary, but just a post I wanted to make... I think people should get some perspective.  (I recall another poster laughing at these assertions in a prior thread, and yet he still has not backed up his disagreement).

We're by no means perfect or where we should be, but to suggest the rights we have and the adherence to the constitution is being tattered from any historical perspective, is silly.

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: johnm214]
    #10816124 -

That may be true, but that doesn't mean there aren't some political "leaders" that need a kick in the teeth.

Edited by Baby_Hitler (08/07/09 09:58 AM)

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #10831150 -

Certainly.


The big problem is I think the electorate is woefully ignorant about the constitution and don't think about it.


I don't think its asking to much of voters and people participating in our democratic institutions to know the bill of rights at least, and understand the structure of our government, esp the first three articles.


Maybe its woefully naive, but if people would have some understanding of what the constitution is, maybe they wouldn't be so quick to toss it out.

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Re: Two Florida men arrested for making gang signs on Myspace [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #10863057 -

luvdemshrooms said:
drift said:
Agreed until you brought up the Obama part.



Another Obama cock sucker.




Obama is now president of Florida?  Thanks, genius.  :lol:


--------------------
What can we do to help you stop screaming?

Official Mr Shoebat lackey.

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