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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Propaganda - Does it have a place?
    #9347453 -

Maybe this should be in the politcal discussion forum.. but here goes.
I'll start with some questions to discuss. Your answers can be related to anything to do with propaganda really, here are some hot topics: Elections and Drugs.

Firstly a broad one with obvious answers.
Is propaganda (in place of education) an ethical/moral way to sway or convince people of a certain view?

secondly,
Has propaganda affected you in anyway specifically? (i.e swayed your views or angered you)

thirdly,
What is its place in society? can it be a necessary evil for control? or is it just plain evil and people should just exercise education and common sense? (or any other thoughts you have on this..)

The reason I ask this is that propaganda seems to be in a lot of places. Even prime-time slot dramas seem to be uneducated about effects of drugs, and even current events programs get things wrong or tell half the truth. Fear-mongering and such exploit the undereducated on certain topics. I'm sure many of us can relate to situations, especially concerning our elders, where there would be/is disagreement on political views.

Though i must say i do feel privileged to be part of a generation of quite well informed people. The internet is a great source of literature and discussion in which many people can form their own opinions in hindsight about the past and analyse the present and future relatively objectively.
And of course, now, there is great diversity of opinions on important matters. (is there any more today, than in the recent past?) I wonder if there are more ethical/moral disagreements these days than there were in our grandparents days. Anyway ill shutup before i dig myself too deep of a hole.

...now discuss.


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All are lunatics, but he who can analyze his delusions is called a philosopher. - Ambrose Bierce

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Re: Propaganda - Does it have a place? [Re: flangenips]
    #9348046 -

Art too is an expression, and there is also an intended audience.

Maybe propaganda is just a nasty word for art?

Whats the difference?

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Re: Propaganda - Does it have a place? [Re: daytripper23]
    #9348246 -

Good point. maybe its just a nasty word for a political form of art.


Propaganda, of course, employs art to convey a message. It can make a short unattractive fascist dictator look like an authoritive handsome benevolent king. Or a painting portraying the [insert your country here] dream encouraging nationalism (nothing necessarily wrong with that - though one can certainly look in history in how it has supported rascism). Aesthetics are certainly important to propaganda, whether in prose or visual art.

Art can, and also does not have to, convey a message. Sometimes an artists message is different depending on who is viewing. While some art can be pretty blunt and others be 'just for arts sake'. "Art" seems a more broader term.

I can definately see the correlation you're alluding to
However,
'Mass' propaganda generally does convey an easy to understand, right or wrong or in between, message. Whether you agree or disagree with what its saying, it usually is not too hard to understand. It seems rather specific.

Though i can see what you're saying about general propaganda, be it greenpeace posters or election campaigning. Certainly both terms can be used for alot of artists work.

Though i supposed i should've stated more along the lines of 'political propaganda', but for the sake of the discussion i didn't want to limit this to just government stuff, there is plenty of anti-government propaganda and other unrelated propaganda for sure which would be good to include in the discussion.
i.e here and in Aussie there seems to be plenty of rubbish on tv in which a character smokes a joint and has a 'marijuana induce psychosis'.... wtf its quite laughable, but certainly many older people believe that tat. Though acting is an art form, something seems so unartistic about that message.


How has propaganda / or even activist art... whatever, be it from government billboards or in the local art gallery... etc affect you in the past or present? (if at all)


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All are lunatics, but he who can analyze his delusions is called a philosopher. - Ambrose Bierce

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Re: Propaganda - Does it have a place? [Re: flangenips]
    #9348431 -

propaganda is fucking gay and there is no place for it except to control the masses
and its fucked up!


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Re: Propaganda - Does it have a place? [Re: Coaster]
    #9348665 -

damn dude

stop propagandizing this thread with your anti-propaganda propaganda:mad2:

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Re: Propaganda - Does it have a place? [Re: daytripper23]
    #9348672 -

rofl ur hilarous
does that really qulify tho


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Re: Propaganda - Does it have a place? [Re: Coaster]
    #9348831 -

ahhh propaganda


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:brainfart: _ :finger:

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Re: Propaganda - Does it have a place? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #9348864 -



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:brainfart: _ :finger:

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Re: Propaganda - Does it have a place? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #9348873 -



Hey Mikey! I think he likes it...

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Re: Propaganda - Does it have a place? [Re: daytripper23]
    #9348884 -

hah

That made sense before you inserted the weird poster

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Re: Propaganda - Does it have a place? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #9349164 -

redgreenvines said:



Good example of anti-american propaganda.

Quote:
propaganda / or even activist art...


I am glad you included "activist art", as I see this as a form of propaganda in itself.

Any view point, with a clearly defined subjective message, created to provoke the desired emotional response.

I had thought that propaganda had its roots in advertising?

Anyway, this is part of an interesting video I watched a while back...not sure if it has been posted before...



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Goodbye Shroomery.

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Re: Propaganda - Does it have a place? [Re: figmentfragment]
    #9349447 -

L ooo vvv eed that video!!
aahhh propagaaanda


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:brainfart: _ :finger:

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Re: Propaganda - Does it have a place? [Re: flangenips]
    #9351416 -

All philosophy is propaganda at the heart.

One does not read a philosophy textbook without coming away a little changed, nor does one write a philosophy textbook without wanting to change others.


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We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

Edited by deCypher (12/02/08 01:46 PM)

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Re: Propaganda - Does it have a place? [Re: deCypher]
    #9351501 -

Quote:
One does not read a philosophy textbook without coming away a little changed, nor does one write a philosophy textbook without wanting to change others.



Good point, though I would say some philosophers may write merely in order to be understood by others--which doesn't necessarily mean the reader must adopt the philosophy in question.

To my mind, propaganda is more about pursuasion and manipulation than expression. It involves an end goal which requires the actions of others to achieve it. Art seems excluded from this endeavor when it isn't politically charged.

Is porn propaganda? Companies run it, it entices the viewer, delivers a big message, and usually creates an end result (masturbation or gross income). Because it mutually benefits both parties and doesn't involve government immediately, it is exempt?

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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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