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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: fireworks_god]
    #8200430 -

I can explain it (in a way that satisfies me).

There is form (body). Body is not "I" because body changes all the time. It is illogical to say my eye is me, or my arm is me, or my hair is me. Rather, it is possible to say these things are part of me, but they in and of themselves are not you.

There is feeling. Feelings change all the time. All feelings can be seen as pleasant/unpleasant. It is not logical to say, I am the feeling of happiness, because happiness rises and falls.

There is thought. We can't even control thought. Thought happens independently of our control and arise based on the conditions we create in our brains (which store memory and is considered part of body).

There is perception. This forum is a good example of how it is illogical to say I am my perception, because our perception of life changes all the time. Perception is based around the idea of a singular entity "self" and/or of impersonal experience.

There is consciousness. Goto sleep. No more consciousness.

All five of these things are present, and none of them are inherently us. Their rising and falling are ignored and we cling to them as if they are permanent and substantial. By doing this we create a "self." So it is important to discern their arising and passing, and to understand the process as it is.


--------------------
As the life of a candle,
my wick will burn out.
But, the fire of my mind
shall beam into infinite.

Edited by psyka (03/27/08 08:50 AM)

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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: psyka]
    #8200444 -

psyka said:
I can explain it (in a way that satisfies me).


That's one of the main reasons I can't take eg* discussion seriously; just like g*d discussion, everyone feels the need to accept the term as being valid and then creates their own meaning for it. I wish that, just once, people would just discard these words that have no real consensual meaning and represent the concepts they are seeking to express for what they are.


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: fireworks_god]
    #8200454 -

But, isn't that the purpose of philosophy and all of these freaking words?


--------------------
As the life of a candle,
my wick will burn out.
But, the fire of my mind
shall beam into infinite.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: For the sceptics... [Re: psyka]
    #8200529 -

I see the purpose of philosophy as seeking to understand the nature of reality. This is a collaborative effort, and there is no reason to continue to propagate memes that are extremely inefficient in representing the nature of reality. The purpose of philosophy isn't to continuously redefine a word that is incapable of representing its own meaning. If there is any valid meaning that an individual is attempting to express through using the term eg*, it would be more expedient, for the sake of philosophy, to express it more effectively.


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: fireworks_god]
    #8200668 -

Can I call it an orbit??
Feels like a distinct layer or circuit to me.


--------------------

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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: backfromthedead]
    #8200790 -

Can you call what an orbit? :shrug:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: backfromthedead]
    #8200816 -

I give up, the people who this question was directed at obviously cant answer it...they will continue to call people egotistical for being spiritualists, which to me is just ridiculously funny!

Someone who transcends the selfishnes of our perceptions & lives with compassion and loving kindness is egotistical???

LOL jesus & buddha were just ego maniacs :crazy2:


--------------------

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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: Chronic7]
    #8200826 -

How do you know when someone transcended "the selfishness of their perceptions"? How do they have to behave in order to recognize them? :strokebeard:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs
:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: fireworks_god]
    #8200841 -

The patterned thoughts and consistent mental model that seem to make up what would be referred to as ego.

Like that.


--------------------

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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: backfromthedead]
    #8200859 -

So this is the reason you wanna call it an orbit?

And since you refer to the ego from psychology, let's see what it means:

Quote:
Proponents of ego psychology focus on the ego’s normal and pathological development, its management of libidinal and aggressive impulses, and its adaptation to reality.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ego_psychology

Why would anyone wanna give that up?


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs
:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: For the sceptics... [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #8200923 -

To temporarily suspend their 'learned reality' to operate from this altered state in the interest of gathering insight into what ever may be presented.
I feel this would be a valuable biannual experience.
Say round the spring and fall equinoxes.
Maybe complete with some crazy stories of transformation.
Death. Rebirth.
I don't know.


--------------------

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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: backfromthedead]
    #8200960 -

LOL wikipedia...

Its like saying "fuck you" to someone and they wip out a dictionary and think you would like to have sexual intercourse with them...




Ego transendence is just getting beyond the attachments of what you love & dont love and just loving everything unconditionally.

Someone who has a low level of ego will have eyes full of compassion and love for all beings as it is only our selfishness that keeps us from doing this, the ego is selfishness, the perception we are separate from everyhting else.

Having a bit of ego is beautiful, love your individuality, every second of it, yet don't hold this to be reality as it is false, this is why we suffer so much we are denying our true nature, which is to love.


--------------------

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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: Chronic7]
    #8201001 -

'Ego transendence is just getting beyond the attachments of what you love & dont love and just loving everything unconditionally.'

In my experience is it purely dose dependent.
Really has nothing to do with 'love' imo.


--------------------

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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: backfromthedead]
    #8201058 -

lol@dose dependant, try a high dose of meditation, say 9+grams :wink:

What does relaity have to do with in your opinion?
(i seriosuly don't mean that sarcastically like id ask OC, i want to know your opinion...)


--------------------

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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: Chronic7]
    #8201085 -

Chronic777 said:
Ego transendence is just getting beyond the attachments of what you love & dont love and just loving everything unconditionally.


Yes, its just that to you, but everyone has their own pet definition. Do you even know why you are attempting to describe aspects of reality through the term eg*?


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: For the sceptics... [Re: Chronic7]
    #8201125 -

Chronic777 said:
lol@dose dependant, try a high dose of meditation, say 9+grams :wink:

What does relaity have to do with in your opinion?
(i seriosuly don't mean that sarcastically like id ask OC, i want to know your opinion...)


Meditation is nice.
17 grams caused me some problems.

Reality??  Conscious biological intelligent organizing self replicating information systems arising at random within and becoming conscious of a chaotic hostile universe.


--------------------

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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: fireworks_god]
    #8201164 -

fireworks_god said:
Quote:
Do you even know why you are attempting to describe aspects of reality through the term eg*?


Because you or mushroom trip (the animals things confuse me!) asked me to describe what i believe ego transcendence is in a few posts higher up... :smirk:


--------------------

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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: backfromthedead]
    #8201184 -

backfromthedead said:
To temporarily suspend their 'learned reality' to operate from this altered state in the interest of gathering insight into what ever may be presented.
I feel this would be a valuable biannual experience.
Say round the spring and fall equinoxes.
Maybe complete with some crazy stories of transformation.
Death.  Rebirth.
I don't know.


To temporarily suspend the "learned reality" does not mean ego death in my book. Ego death is just hippie invented stuff, if you permanently (like some posters suggested here that it's good to do) remove the learned reality (is there any other reality BTW? :sherlock:) means zero brain activity which means that we're unable to operate in any way. :shrug:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs
:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: For the sceptics... [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #8201207 -

I could care less what anything means in your book.
Those that experience this know exactly what the term means.
I suggest you test your theory.


--------------------

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Re: For the sceptics... [Re: Chronic7]
    #8201286 -

Quote:
LOL wikipedia...

Its like saying "fuck you" to someone and they wip out a dictionary and think you would like to have sexual intercourse with them...


No, actually this is also your personal interpretation, one that doesn't have anything to do with what it actually means.
I made that reference because backfromthedead showed a specific graphic that was about the psychological definition of the ego. However, this is not the ONLY definition, hence the confusion it produces.

Quote:
Ego transendence is just getting beyond the attachments of what you love & dont love and just loving everything unconditionally.


You're just talking from books here.
Or are you trying to imply that you managed to permanently "transcend your ego" and you're talking from a place where you already know all that?
From what I have observed, people tend to give all the negative attributes to the "ego", making it look like some sort of evil twin. This all sounds to me like a way of justifying one's failures.

Quote:
Someone who has a low level of ego will have eyes full of compassion and love for all beings as it is only our selfishness that keeps us from doing this, the ego is selfishness, the perception we are separate from everyhting else.

Having a bit of ego is beautiful, love your individuality, every second of it, yet don't hold this to be reality as it is false, this is why we suffer so much we are denying our true nature, which is to love.


I don't buy this, it all sounds like something you just made up.
Please correct me (with evidence if possible) if I'm wrong.


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs
:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
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