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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Offlinefireworks_godS
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History
    #5364941 - 03/04/06 03:25 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

A historic hall of records of every event that has transpired throughout our existance as human beings on this planet is far less important to our development of our species as is the records of the realizations and understandings that have resulted from that history's occurence.

It matters not to know the name "Hitler", but evermore so to grasp the concepts relative to our experience and evolution that result.

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Invisibledblaney
Human Being

Registered: 10/03/04
Posts: 7,894
Loc: Here & Now
Re: History [Re: fireworks_god]
    #5365049 - 03/04/06 04:15 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Definitely! :thumbup: :thumbup:

The fact that Jesus walked the earth is not nearly as important as his teachings and the knowledge that he spread forth. It's a shame more people don't realize this. It's as though they're worshipping his personality instead of the ineffable of which he embodied.


--------------------
"What is in us that turns a deaf ear to the cries of human suffering?"

"Belief is a beautiful armor
But makes for the heaviest sword"
- John Mayer

Making the noise "penicillin" is no substitute for actually taking penicillin.

"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." -Abraham Lincoln


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InvisibleFucknuckle
Dog Lover

Registered: 04/24/04
Posts: 6,762
Re: History [Re: fireworks_god]
    #5365358 - 03/04/06 06:23 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

er....Ok

Yes a " Hall of records " would be " less important " as one impossibly does not exist. And, if such a place was a reality. I am quite sure the pages would show " cause and effect " in all contexts.


What I felt, learned or what ever from Hitler was from the " history " I learned.

History is as important as the lessons it teaches


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Posts: 24,855
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Re: History [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #5365387 - 03/04/06 06:30 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Fucknuckle said:
er....Ok




Great to see that you remain somewhat functional. :smirk:

Quote:


Yes a " Hall of records " would be " less important " as one impossibly does not exist. And, if such a place was a reality.




You find arguement with my allegory that refers to the collective act of recording and teaching the history of events and occurences, as though I was referring to a literal Hall of Records that contains every bit of information pertaining to every single event that has ever transpired within reality? Let's try to comprehend this point on the same level. :wink:

Quote:


I am quite sure the pages would show " cause and effect " in all contexts.




What does this have to do with the discussion at hand?

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Invisibleit stars saddam
Satan

Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 15,571
Loc: Spahn Ranch
Re: History [Re: fireworks_god]
    #5365398 - 03/04/06 06:32 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:
It matters not to know the name "Hitler", but evermore so to grasp the concepts relative to our experience and evolution that result.




I agree, it is important to remember that Jews should be persecuted without mercy.


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InvisibleFucknuckle
Dog Lover

Registered: 04/24/04
Posts: 6,762
Re: History [Re: fireworks_god]
    #5365400 - 03/04/06 06:33 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

There is no discussion at hand.You started a thread with a statement and offered no questions or any real path for such a "talk".So I offered my position if you can't understand what I said....Sorry.


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Posts: 24,855
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Re: History [Re: it stars saddam]
    #5365443 - 03/04/06 06:44 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

itstarssaddam said:
I agree, it is important to remember that Jews should be persecuted without mercy.




Its important to realize the subsequent consequences that result from engaging in such behavior. History is only beneficial to us when it allows us to learn from the consequences of other's actions, the actions that have brought us to this point and time and have formed us into the entities which will further bring forth actions and consquences of those actions.

History is valuable as perspective, perspective through which to view our current state and to realize how we should act to further advance that state. I am stating that the emphasis is on the value that history has encoded within it and the benefit we reap from it, not the literal representation of names, dates, and facts.

Whether or not such an observation is interesting or thrilling is an entirely different matter, but I at least felt to express it in the moment. *shrugs* :grin:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Invisibleit stars saddam
Satan

Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 15,571
Loc: Spahn Ranch
Re: History [Re: fireworks_god]
    #5365456 - 03/04/06 06:47 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I knew what you meant.  :smirk:


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InvisibleFucknuckle
Dog Lover

Registered: 04/24/04
Posts: 6,762
Re: History [Re: it stars saddam]
    #5365465 - 03/04/06 06:49 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Yeah it is the smell of the shit not the size that matters.


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.


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Invisibleit stars saddam
Satan

Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 15,571
Loc: Spahn Ranch
Re: History [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #5365471 - 03/04/06 06:51 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Huh?


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InvisibleFucknuckle
Dog Lover

Registered: 04/24/04
Posts: 6,762
Re: History [Re: it stars saddam]
    #5365495 - 03/04/06 06:56 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

You know..............The nitty gritty is what matters not the millstone


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Last seen: 1 year, 12 days
Re: History [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #5365503 - 03/04/06 07:00 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:
A historic hall of records of every event that has transpired throughout our existance as human beings on this planet is far less important to our development of our species as is the records of the realizations and understandings that have resulted from that history's occurence.

It matters not to know the name "Hitler", but evermore so to grasp the concepts relative to our experience and evolution that result.




Quote:

dblaney said:
Definitely! :thumbup: :thumbup:

The fact that Jesus walked the earth is not nearly as important as his teachings and the knowledge that he spread forth. It's a shame more people don't realize this. It's as though they're worshipping his personality instead of the ineffable of which he embodied.




Quote:

Fucknuckle said:
There is no discussion at hand.You started a thread with a statement and offered no questions or any real path for such a "talk".So I offered my position if you can't understand what I said....Sorry.




No discussion at hand, eh? Seems that the discourse amongst myself, dblaney, and itstarssaddam lie at odds with your suspossed observation of reality. I created a thread as an observation that I felt the need to share, and discussion naturally resulted from such.

It isn't a question of not being able to understand your comments, but rather the fact that I questioned your comments and you choose to assert that there is no discussion, effectively failing to answer such questions. There is no discussion at hand because you do not wish to engage in the discussion of the statements you felt compelled to share with us all.... Wicked deja-vu here...  :eek:

You made a statement in regards to my allegory of a Historic Hall of Records (similar in concept to that of the Akashic records :wink:), a poetic symbol to represent our human behavior of recording events and of teaching the recollection of such events to others, as though it was being proposed as a literal possibillity. :wtf:

No discussion results from my shared insight because you misconstrue my allegory as though it was a statement concerning some literal reality. I just realized that you edited in more to your original post, so I will now address that, as I am actually interested in discussing these ideas. :lol:

Quote:


What I felt, learned or what ever from Hitler was from the " history " I learned.
History is as important as the lessons it teaches




Jada, history is, of course, the encapsulation for the potential understanding that we can develop through it, but what is being questioned is the emphasis on unimportant details being memorized instead of an emphasis on providing tools for one to come to realize the message and meaning that is being represented by history.

Thus, history itself is inevitably less important than that which the history represents and conveys, just as the words we use to communicate, even though necessay in order to communicate, are not more important than the meaning, the thought, the idea it is intended to convey.

The Sun itself is far more essential and "important" than the phrase "Sun" that we utilize to symbolize the associated meanings we have in regards to the Sun. :sun:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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InvisibleFucknuckle
Dog Lover

Registered: 04/24/04
Posts: 6,762
Re: History [Re: fireworks_god]
    #5365535 - 03/04/06 07:13 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

So unless I get involved with one of your threads..with............ I agree.....

Then I can always look forward to such attention............

The sun can not warm my face with out the history of being first start dust. The history is the reality of all things. History is what allows anything to be anything...........

I agree it is what we learn not the chair from which we learned from. But what is less or more important ???? That is your point right ??

I don't agree, simple. Can you handle that ? I think, it is the total facts and lessons that matter, equal and impartial to each other. One can not reflect upon the lessons learned with out reflection of the events.


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: History [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #5365568 - 03/04/06 07:26 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Fucknuckle said:
The sun can not warm my face with out the history of being first start dust. The history is the reality of all things. History is what allows anything to be anything...........




Rather, history is our representation of the events that have transpired in order to bring reality to its current state. History is not necessary for anything to be, reality is necessary for anything to be. We do not need to have a model of what has happened in order to benefit from its occurence.

Quote:


I think, it is the total facts and lessons that matter, equal and impartial to each other. One can not reflect upon the lessons learned with out reflection of the events.




Incorrect. One does not have any need to remember the name "Hiroshima" in order to comprehend or reflect on the implications of destroying an entire city by such devastating means, or to have one's reality affected by the consequences of such an occurence. The fundamental concepts exist by their own right and are represented by the literal aspects of the situation. Such a mindset that focuses on the literal interpretation entirely will not be able to gain a sense of the meaningful, purposeful point of the matter.

The language used to communicate a meaning is less important than the meaning itself in that the meaning exists by its own right without the language, and yet, without the meaning, the language itself is worthless. :wink:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Registered: 05/07/04
Posts: 6,697
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Re: History [Re: fireworks_god]
    #5365608 - 03/04/06 07:42 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

It seems the concepts of name, place and date are strongly interwoven with the deed of a person. Of course it makes no sense to know a name and not know what is behind that name, but if one knows what is behind a name, the name makes a good 'marker' to bring a 'concept' to some point. Also dates and places are from some value as they share the historical and geographic context.
But it would be surely interesting to clean all historical facts from names, dates and places, to see if there is something more of a 'generality' to be found. I don't know if this is possible without loosing important context.


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: History [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #5365626 - 03/04/06 07:50 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I agree with what you have to offer. :thumbup:

I realize the value in reference points to the occurence, in order for us to be able to understand the situation as is necessary to realize the meaning we can derive from it. I simply state that it is the benefits we receive from history, from the way the events have brought us to this point in time, and our understanding of it which gives us perspective with which we more fully realize reality and our experience for what it is.

Something in terms of "history coming alive", perhaps? :wink: I simply promote the realization that history is primarily concerned with the present experience, as the greatest benefit of history is to empower the present experience. :mushroom2:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


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