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Offlinewillmafingerdo
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question on casing layer depth...
    #4671909 - 09/17/05 12:43 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

everything i read says for cubesenc mushrooms that you should make your casing layer 1/4 the depth of your substrate, so if i put my grain into 6" worth of poo i would need a 1.5" casing layer? dose it hurt to go less/more.. dose it realy make a diff.. i know you dont even have to case poo, but i was just wondering. ty, l8r


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Offlinebuggers
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Re: question on casing layer depth... [Re: willmafingerdo]
    #4671924 - 09/17/05 12:48 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

i tried a 1 1/4" caseing layer on 5 inches of poo and it never colonized after two weeks... its not important how thick the caseing layer is as long as it holds moisture and gives some structure to fruit off of

i've had the biggest flushes by dunking my substrate and then coating the whole thing (including the sides and the bottom) with just enough dry vermiculite that will stick to it... kinda like dunk and roll with cakes... it works really well.


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Offlinewillmafingerdo
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Re: question on casing layer depth... [Re: buggers]
    #4672117 - 09/17/05 01:27 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

kewl ty man:)


--------------------
:scaryshroom: :shitstorm: :mattz: :bongload: :gethigh: :scaryshroom:

I am not lost.. i am going there looking for it.. and when i get there and find it, i will know what it is..

"The way to stop violence is not to go out and let your head be beaten in but to say, you want to take my life risk yours!"

"are you sure u want to eat all them shrooms??"  "yes i want to hear what my mind has to say..."

remember opions are like assholes, everyone has one and they all stink.


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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: question on casing layer depth... [Re: buggers]
    #4672596 - 09/17/05 03:11 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

buggers said:... its not important how thick the caseing layer is as long as it holds moisture and gives some structure to fruit off of




Not true. See TMC p.133:
Quote:

1. DepthThe correct depth to apply the casing layer is directly related to the depth of the substrate, Greater amounts of substrate increase yield potential which in turn puts more stress on the casing layer. Prolific first and second flushes can remove a thin casing or damage it's surface structure, thereby limiting future mushroom production. A thin casing layer also lacks the body and moisture holding capacity to support large flushes. ASA GENERAL RULE, THE MORE MUSHROOMS EXPECTED PER SQUARE FOOT OF SURFACE AREA, THE DEEPER THE ASING LAYER. (emphasis in original)
Agaricus growers use a minimum of one inch and maximum of two inches of casing on their beds. Substrate depths of six to eight inches are cased 1.25 to 1.5 inches deep. Substrates deeper than 8 inches are cased 1.5 to 2 inches deep. Nevertheless, experiments in Holland using casing depths of 1 inch and 2 inches demonstrated that the deep casing layer suppored higher levels of microorganisms and produced more mushrooms. (See Visscher, 1975). To gain the full benefits of a casing layer, an absolute minimum depth on bulk substrates is 1 inch. For fruiting on sterilized grain, the casing need not be as deep as for fruitings on bulk substrates. Shallow layers of grain are commonly cased .75 to 1 inch deep.




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InvisibleHolydiver
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Re: question on casing layer depth... [Re: buggers]
    #4672766 - 09/17/05 03:53 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

buggers said:
i tried a 1 1/4" caseing layer on 5 inches of poo and it never colonized after two weeks... its not important how thick the caseing layer is as long as it holds moisture and gives some structure to fruit off of





Isn't that a little contradictory?  :confused:  If it means the difference between colonizing in two days, and not colonizing after two weeks, I'd say that casing depth is very important.

Anyhow, 1/2" has always worked for me really well.  Anything above 1/2" and you can be in for a long wait, with no real benefits.  Remember to apply it as evenly as possible.


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: question on casing layer depth... [Re: Holydiver]
    #4673137 - 09/17/05 07:40 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Not everything in TMC was written for cubensis, so it must not be considered the final word on cubes. In fact, cubes do very well without a casing layer at all. If you're using manure or compost, you can skip the casing layer completely and get your flush a week or two sooner. Simply dunk between flushes. Dunking is faster than waiting for a casing layer to colonize. Larger substrates can be dunked in the kitchen sink or bathtub by allowing the tap water to run onto and over the substrate overnight. The gently running water will keep circulation in the tub and prevent bacterial growth. Smaller substrates can be dunked in the refrigerator.
RR


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: question on casing layer depth... [Re: willmafingerdo]
    #4673238 - 09/17/05 09:40 AM (11 years, 10 months ago)

1/4 the depth of the substrate is very misleading and simply not the way it should be done as far as experience goes. I recommend anywhere from 3/8-5/8" on any substrate depth, very thin subs won't produce long so you can get by with as little as 1/4" and subs that are 6" could use 3/4" but personally that is as deep as I would ever go and I would never tell anyone to go deeper than 1" which is such a waste of the mycs energy IME.

"Dunking is faster than waiting for a casing layer to colonize."

Your casing layer should be colonized just once all flushes come from this casing run and keeping the casing at "near saturation" through proper water delivery will mean no dunking necessary IME.
I also personally think casings are worth the wait as far as yields are concerned. I may have misread your wording there RR sorry if I did.


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Offlinewillmafingerdo
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Re: question on casing layer depth... [Re: hyphae]
    #4673739 - 09/17/05 01:01 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

kewl ty all for the input.. i was gonna put it at about 1/2" - 3/4" deep, will see how it turns out, this is my first poo grow.. :smile: l8r


--------------------
:scaryshroom: :shitstorm: :mattz: :bongload: :gethigh: :scaryshroom:

I am not lost.. i am going there looking for it.. and when i get there and find it, i will know what it is..

"The way to stop violence is not to go out and let your head be beaten in but to say, you want to take my life risk yours!"

"are you sure u want to eat all them shrooms??"  "yes i want to hear what my mind has to say..."

remember opions are like assholes, everyone has one and they all stink.


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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: question on casing layer depth... [Re: willmafingerdo]
    #4673932 - 09/17/05 01:59 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Yeah, the thing to remember willma is that everything everybody said in this thread is contradictory, but is based on different things people do to get results that make them happy.

Personally, I've never once had a casing layer not colonize, so I like deeper casing layers than most people use. I feel they certainly increase the yield potential of a large bulk tray.

Rodger is right though, you don't even have to case. I think that not casing limits your yield potential, but sometimes, so what? Yield potential isn't everything, especially after you have more than you need.

And he's also right that TMC isn't always right about cubes, I just copy/pasted for ease. Particularly the part in there about "supported higher levels of microorganisms.." that is irrelevant for cubes.

1/2 to 3/4 sounds great for just about any substrate depth.


--------------------
"From a certain point of view"
-Jedi Master Obi Wan Kenobi

PM me with any cultivation questions.

I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


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InvisibleRoadkill
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Re: question on casing layer depth... [Re: mycofile]
    #4673957 - 09/17/05 02:11 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

I'm sorta stuck in the middle on this...

I like casing bulk grows...and I like growing bulk grows without a casing layer.

I like the more even pinsets that you get on casing a bulk grow.
which usually gives me more fruits...and I like that.

I like the large fruits that you can get from not casing a bulk grow.
Most of my largest fruits have came from non cased horse poo bulk grows.
and I really like to see how large I can grow my shrooms.

so its a toss up.


here is a pretty good non cased bulk horse poo grow...

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/636752/an/0/page/0


tc


--------------------
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You wouldn't know what crazy was if Charles Manson was eating froot loops on your front porch!


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PM the names with on there names, that means they have mushrooms for sale.



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InvisibleFooManM
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Re: question on casing layer depth... [Re: Roadkill]
    #4674020 - 09/17/05 02:39 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

I think that I will try my next poo grow without casing after seeing those pics! My last 2 grows had pretty good 1st flushes, but the casing contammed after picking for both of them. I'd rather just eliminate the casing and dunk the whole poo cake between flushes for hydration instead.


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