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OfflineAiko Aiko
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To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS*
    #4633605 - 09/08/05 01:34 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

What's the consensus around these parts? I'm at a loss right now with contam problems. I've used all different lid styles. My oyster+shiitaki  LC'c that I'm doing are all contam free, so I'm certain it's not the syringe. It's got to be somewhere in the WBS prep. Before I started doing WBS I was around 98% successful. So I'm confident in my overall sterile techniques. Would simmering help in the pc'ing process. From everything that I've been reading, this shouldn't be necassary. Please help! :crazy:


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OfflineAiko Aiko
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: Aiko Aiko]
    #4633801 - 09/08/05 02:29 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Anyone?


--------------------
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InvisibleFreedomFight
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: Aiko Aiko]
    #4633867 - 09/08/05 02:53 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I doubt simmering would help with contam problems. Simmering is primarily to supersaturate the grains with water. Grains contam easier than cakes so possibly you will need to move to a glovebox for your work.
FYI - Several people on this forum never simmer their WBS.


--------------------
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InvisibleRoadkill
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: Aiko Aiko]
    #4633882 - 09/08/05 03:01 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I don't simmer my WBS...I soak mine...then rinse it real good...strain it...and then pressure cook it.

I do use a still air box.
I used to do open air inoculations and really didn't have any contam issues back then.

how long are you pressure cooking your WBS?

what does your WBS look like when its done being pressure cooked?
is it dry looking?
is it wet looking?

what tek are you following?

tell us the procedure that you are using...step by step.

how do you know your LC isn't contamed?

we need more information to help you.

tc


--------------------
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InvisibleFooManM
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: FreedomFight]
    #4633886 - 09/08/05 03:01 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I would recommend simmering IF you are experiencing problems with contams. I'm sure you've heard that this helps the endospores germinate so that they are more easily killed during PC'ing. You could maybe up your PC'ing times. With my WBS, I just bring a pot of water to a rolling boil, dump the WBS in, turn off the heat and put the lid on the pot. I'll watch TV, smoke a bowl,etc. Let the seeds sit in the steaming pot for about an hour and don't lift the lid during that time. This seems to saturate the seeds perfectly and kind of "simmers" them also. I'll let the seed drain for about 15min in a strainer, load into jars and PC for about 90min. Haven't had a contam yet doing it this way. GL dude!


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OfflineIGnosticAbhorI
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: FooMan]
    #4633989 - 09/08/05 03:43 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

I would recommend simmering IF you are experiencing problems with contams




Don't you mean it the other way around? :lol:

24hour soak and then a nice simmer will cause all the seeds to burst (also does something to the starch but i dont remeber in full detail), that means that their water capacity has been reached and then supersceeded(sp?), Therefore ya'd have To much water, And over-saturated seeds turns into goo on the bottom of your wbs and that contams Big time.

Anyways, I wouldn't simmer personally, With WBS it isn't necessary, just more of a hassle IME.

Gl

-Gnostic


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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: IGnosticAbhorI]
    #4634128 - 09/08/05 04:31 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah, I'm a soaker.
Maybe a very short simmer after the soak to get a little more moisture in there if you are casing the grain directly and not using as spawn. Soaked WBS is usually on the low end of moisture content. Doesn't matter in spawn, but it can affect cased grains maximum yield potential. Also, this only matters if the rest of your setup and skills will put you near the maxumum yield potential anyway.


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I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


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OfflineAiko Aiko
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: mycofile]
    #4634185 - 09/08/05 04:46 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Im using this tek
I PC for 90 min. The seed looks a little on the wet side. Maybe a slight goo on the bottom. I soak for 12 hrs then drain for an hour. I guess I'm not 100% sure the LC isn't contaminated. Just by looking at it, I dont see any sign of contams. It looks like the same thing the original culture looked like after I got it from sporeworks. I hope that helps some.


--------------------
Man says, "God, show me and I will believe." God says, "Believe and I will show you."


Edited by Aiko Aiko (09/08/05 04:55 PM)


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InvisibleFooManM
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: IGnosticAbhorI]
    #4634202 - 09/08/05 04:51 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

IGnosticAbhorI said:
Quote:

I would recommend simmering IF you are experiencing problems with contams




Don't you mean it the other way around?  :lol:




No, I didn't.  :rolleyes:
He said he doesn't simmer now and he is experiencing problems with contams. I was suggesting IF he is having problems with contams, maybe he should try simmering. The soak alone will cause endospores to germinate, the simmering will kill some of those endospores and really soak the seeds, the PC'ing will finish the job.  The method I use as I stated above accomplishes both tasks of soaking and simmering in about an hour with few bursted seeds.


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OfflineCLUTCH
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: Aiko Aiko]
    #4634235 - 09/08/05 04:59 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

hmmm

12 hr soak. Have you tried soaking for longer period? I usually soak for 24 hrs at the least.

I don't simmer, but bring to a boil real quick before straining. This kills some of the endospores. I then don't have to strain for more than a couple of minutes because the water is all removed by steam after pouring in the strainer. (thanks scatmanrav for this idea)

I had a real problem with stalling/contams before though, I found it was because the jars would dry out too quick. This method seems to work better for me.


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OfflineAiko Aiko
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: CLUTCH]
    #4634261 - 09/08/05 05:05 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Interesting. I read that after about 12 hours you start getting ferementation. I'll give the longer soak a try. I assume that will germinate more endospores?


--------------------
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OfflineHippieChick
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: Aiko Aiko]
    #4634331 - 09/08/05 05:17 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I always soak for at least 24 hours. I also simmer. I know my seed is absorbing more water during the simmer because today I had to add 2 gallons of water to my WBS while simmering. The water was about 4" above the seed after soaking. After I started simmering, I had to add water twice.

Peace,Love,Happiness and Harmony.
:heart: Hippie Chick  :mushroom2:


--------------------
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OfflineAiko Aiko
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: HippieChick]
    #4634361 - 09/08/05 05:23 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

So soak then simmer at the end?


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Invisiblegema
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: Aiko Aiko]
    #4634370 - 09/08/05 05:25 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

i soak for 36 hours without simmering and rinse real well then pc. i knock my jars up in a glovebox. contam free.


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OfflineHippieChick
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: Aiko Aiko]
    #4634429 - 09/08/05 05:41 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

That's up to you. Just letting you know what works for me. But yes, if you're going to simmer I would do it after soaking.

Peace,Love,Happiness and Harmony.
:heart: Hippie Chick  :mushroom2:


--------------------
Peace,Love and Happiness
:heart: HC :mushroom2:

Freedoms just another word for nothing left to lose..............

I LUV My Greenhouse
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5545848#5545848

My First Pans
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/6212058#6212058


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OfflineAiko Aiko
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: HippieChick]
    #4634446 - 09/08/05 05:45 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Cool, thanx for all the input guys, and gal. :grin:


--------------------
Man says, "God, show me and I will believe." God says, "Believe and I will show you."


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InvisibleOldSpice
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: HippieChick]
    #4634457 - 09/08/05 05:46 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I messed my last wbs jars water content up again :mad:, Im not messing with wbs anymore CORN RULES!!


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OfflineHippieChick
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: OldSpice]
    #4634484 - 09/08/05 05:53 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Sorry to hear that :frown:

I'm doing some now that are 25% WBS,25% Rye and 50% Poo.

I'd just as soon sterilize a bunch of jars, inoculate with LC and then case and fruit when colonized. So sick of some of my poo going green while colonizing.

Peace,Love,Happiness and Harmony.
:heart: Hippie Chick  :mushroom2:


--------------------
Peace,Love and Happiness
:heart: HC :mushroom2:

Freedoms just another word for nothing left to lose..............

I LUV My Greenhouse
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5545848#5545848

My First Pans
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/6212058#6212058


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InvisibleOldSpice
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: HippieChick]
    #4634514 - 09/08/05 05:59 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I do mixes like that also but poo doesnt contam on me at all, It colonises really quick iof you mix a bit of verm in it but you allready know that im shure


--------------------
So hard to be ....WDWGFH?
Texas is humongus compared to France
Our Gair, who art in Texas,
Paw Paw be thy Name....
My friends are thirsty


You never see a motorcycle parked outside a Psychiatrist office:biker:


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OfflineHippieChick
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Re: To simmer or to not simmer? *WBS* [Re: OldSpice]
    #4634716 - 09/08/05 06:39 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I use verm with it. Might just be the time of year.

Peace,Love,Happiness and Harmony.
:heart: Hippie Chick  :mushroom2:


--------------------
Peace,Love and Happiness
:heart: HC :mushroom2:

Freedoms just another word for nothing left to lose..............

I LUV My Greenhouse
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5545848#5545848

My First Pans
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/6212058#6212058


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