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OfflinekronnyQ
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Spores vs. Cloning
    #4053550 - 04/14/05 07:42 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

So if I get a print from a mega monster shroom, am I not guaranteed to get mega offspring from those spores like I would with just cloning a section of stem?

Is the DNA of the spores different than that of the stem DNA? I'm guessing yes because this is why people clone the megas and not just print them.


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InvisibleHolydiver
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Re: Spores vs. Cloning [Re: kronnyQ]
    #4053624 - 04/14/05 08:35 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Multispore is a lottery, you never know what you're gonna get. But with cloning a specific shroom, it's pretty much guaranteed you'll see the same characteristics of the one you cloned.


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: Spores vs. Cloning [Re: Holydiver]
    #4053640 - 04/14/05 08:49 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Spores don't guarantee anything besides strain.


--------------------
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OfflineVertigo6911
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Re: Spores vs. Cloning [Re: Holydiver]
    #4053646 - 04/14/05 08:53 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

mmm i dont like to think of it as a lottery...
theres the element of natural selection present when spores germinate.
the strong outgrows the weak etc...


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OfflinebOemius
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Re: Spores vs. Cloning [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #4053656 - 04/14/05 09:05 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

and with a series of progressive selection of mushroom prints (from the best) people do get mushrooms with specific characteristics (the ones selected)... i think this is the way some big enterprises do, like Somycel, Amycel...


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Offlinerocknliam
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Re: Spores vs. Cloning [Re: bOemius]
    #4053678 - 04/14/05 09:24 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

On this subject - I have heard you can only do g2g three times because the genetics start to deteriorate.

I have a honeywater culture that i took from a clone, so it has gone:

Multispore>Clone>Clone

will this second clone have bad genetics or will it be just fine, and could i keep cloning and cloning indefinatly?

Was what i heard bollocks?


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Offlinescatmanrav
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Re: Spores vs. Cloning [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #4053697 - 04/14/05 09:32 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Vertigo6911 said:
mmm i dont like to think of it as a lottery...
theres the element of natural selection present when spores germinate.
the strong outgrows the weak etc...




Often the strong wont stop the weak from growing, all germinate at the same time because the spores are spread out over the substrate and you can have dozens of spores all starting at once. The mycelium grows out from the spores and when it intersects other mycelium, the stronger doesnt over take the weak, they form a network right there and stop...now you shake it up cause its getting to be that time and you spread around the couple spots of less desirable mycelium..it grows out on uncolonized substrate until it hits more myc so then you have multiple kinds of mycelium mixed around within the substrate...it then gets broken up for casing and mixed up even more...this creates many smaller networks that cant work together as well. Its not as if your mixing in different strains so they still work together "fine"..but compared to an isolate...


--------------------
"life is like a drop of rain getting closer and closer to falling into a lake, and then when you hit the lake there is no more rain drop, only the lake."

Growing with bags, start to finish (including my new grain and substrate prep)
Anyone looking to start bulk tubs/mono tubs/shotgun hybrids? Good tubs to use..
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Turn your closet into a fruiting chamber
Casing layer colonization and overlay


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OfflineVertigo6911
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Re: Spores vs. Cloning [Re: scatmanrav]
    #4053718 - 04/14/05 09:45 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

mmm so then does that mean that all those verieties of strong and weaker mycelium end up competing for moisture and o2?


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Offlinescatmanrav
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Re: Spores vs. Cloning [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #4053731 - 04/14/05 09:51 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

I'm not sure the extent of them not working together...I dont think they actually compete, since it is still the same genetics, even if each spore is so different...but I just think its like putting a task that needs to have a team of strong intelligent people all working together, in the same way, towards a common goal. A group like that could accomplish some crazy shit. Throw a couple of weakling retards in the group though and theres bound to be a little break down in comunication. Not that the less intelligent would be working towards a different goal, or competing...just unable to do as well.


--------------------
"life is like a drop of rain getting closer and closer to falling into a lake, and then when you hit the lake there is no more rain drop, only the lake."

Growing with bags, start to finish (including my new grain and substrate prep)
Anyone looking to start bulk tubs/mono tubs/shotgun hybrids? Good tubs to use..
How I do grain (old still good tips)
Turn your closet into a fruiting chamber
Casing layer colonization and overlay


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OfflineCiv
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Re: Spores vs. Cloning [Re: rocknliam]
    #4053756 - 04/14/05 10:06 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Multispore>Clone>Clone

will this second clone have bad genetics or will it be just fine, and could i keep cloning and cloning indefinatly?




Multispore -> Clone -> Spores off clone -> Clone -> Spores of clone?

Probably using agar every other step to isolate the growth that you like.

I belive thats how you would want do it. If yer trying to pick and choose what you belive to be prime fruits. The clone of a clone can only be weaker or equal to what its cloned from, but not geneticaly better.

I have read that you can hit the spores with strong UV light as they drop to cause random mutations, killing most the spores, but a small % make it and can grow mushrooms with the possibity of mutations.


--------------------
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So, wash it well afterwards & DON'T tell them..."  -Agar


Edited by Civ (04/14/05 10:09 AM)


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Offlinerocknliam
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Re: Spores vs. Cloning [Re: Civ]
    #4053761 - 04/14/05 10:09 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Ah ok, thanks alot.


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OfflineVertigo6911
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Re: Spores vs. Cloning [Re: kronnyQ]
    #4054113 - 04/14/05 12:07 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

ok i got it
thxz :smile:


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InvisibleRoadkill
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Re: Spores vs. Cloning [Re: Holydiver]
    #4054194 - 04/14/05 12:37 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Diver said:

Multispore is a lottery, you never know what you're gonna get.  But with cloning a specific shroom, it's pretty much guaranteed you'll see the same characteristics of the one you cloned.




Quote:

hyphae said:

Spores don't guarantee anything besides strain.




Quote:

scatmanrav said:

Often the strong wont stop the weak from growing, all germinate at the same time because the spores are spread out over the substrate and you can have dozens of spores all starting at once. The mycelium grows out from the spores and when it intersects other mycelium, the stronger doesnt over take the weak, they form a network right there and stop...now you shake it up cause its getting to be that time and you spread around the couple spots of less desirable mycelium..it grows out on uncolonized substrate until it hits more myc so then you have multiple kinds of mycelium mixed around within the substrate...it then gets broken up for casing and mixed up even more...this creates many smaller networks that cant work together as well. Its not as if your mixing in different strains so they still work together "fine"..but compared to an isolate...




:thumbup: :thumbup:

Those are some good posts guys!~

:smile:


--------------------
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Brainiac said:
PM the names with on there names, that means they have mushrooms for sale.



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OfflineMcJosh13
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Re: [Re: Roadkill]
    #4055003 - 04/14/05 03:46 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

edit


Edited by McJosh13 (06/19/07 01:15 PM)


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