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OfflinePlok
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Mushrooms and spirituality
    #3769080 - 02/12/05 12:23 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Since before my first mushroom trip, I have been greatly interested in the dynamic (or lack thereof) between the psychadelic conciousness and the spiritual world. I have listened to many hours of McKenna's lectures and spent countless hours reading trip reports and hearing people's experiences on mushrooms. What I am truly interested in is whether psychadelics truly connect you to a spiritual realm, or whether it's "all in your head."

On almost every trip I've had, and that's only about 8 or 9 trips, I have felt connected to some kind of spiritual network. Usually it feels as though I am interconnected with many people at the same time on some sort of spiritual or telepathic internet. I can't describe how I feel this.. I just do. Other times I have directly talked to seemingly external entities telepathically.. always some kind of "spirit being" and never a person that I know.

Despite how real this spiritual world feels on psychadelics, I have never been able to convince myself that it is anything outside of what is just going on in my brain. This reason is this: I have tried many times to ask these "entities" or "beings" to somehow prove to me that they are real, and not a figment of my imagination. Inevitably when I ask this question, I get no response. Suddenly the air is dead. Other times I will not feel connected to this "network" or these "entities" and I will ask, or beg them to talk to me. Usually I get no response.

Despite the feeling of interconnectedness or spirituality that I've felt on psychadelics, I have never learned or been told anything that could not have come from my imagination. Therefore in my mind the question of whether psychadelics open a door into the spiritual realm is still unanswered, although the more I trip the more I tend to lean toward the view that it is "all in my head." What are your thoughts?


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Just say NO to the War on Drugs.


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Mushrooms and spirituality [Re: Plok]
    #3769112 - 02/12/05 12:31 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

I see it as a reflection of reality, but not reality itself. Our perception of it may be scewed a little bit, but I still think there's something there. It's just filtered through our subjective consciousness. I can feel this spirit world when I'm meditating, just not as vividly as when I'm tripping. I can never be totally sure that any of it exists outside of my mind, but that goes for everything I experience.


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OfflinePlok
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Re: Mushrooms and spirituality [Re: Silversoul]
    #3769126 - 02/12/05 12:36 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

I would think that if you were truly plugged into a shared or higher consciousness, that that consciousness would be able to prove to your rational, sober mind that it is real by way of sharing knowledge with you that would be impossible to know otherwise. However if that were the case I think the debate over this would be over.


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OfflineGomp
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Re: Mushrooms and spirituality [Re: Plok]
    #3769127 - 02/12/05 12:36 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

asked you me, to prove, whilst in conversation, I am real.
A way to so do, is silence. for as it was not silence you heard before, it proves we spake, for real?

he he (I really, got no clue)


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Mushrooms and spirituality [Re: Plok]
    #3769128 - 02/12/05 12:37 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

I don't think consciousness is the same as memory or thought.


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OfflineGomp
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Re: Mushrooms and spirituality [Re: Silversoul]
    #3769167 - 02/12/05 12:53 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

we are consciously subconscious, consciousness's.. (!?)
:grin: :thumbup:


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OfflineDivided_Sky
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Re: Mushrooms and spirituality [Re: Gomp]
    #3769510 - 02/12/05 02:11 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

First you should consider this: Just because reality is formed of thoughts does not make it unreal or false. Secondly, if you don't have a self, you don't have a mind, so really it is not all in your mind. More like your mind is in IT.

All perception and conceptual phenomena and the feelings and judgements that arise from them are projections, or rather manifestions of the mind. They are of a seperate nature than pure awareness. However, pure awareness, the basis of all thoughts and feelings, which is our consciousness, bodily and mental senses are also Mind. Awareness is one with the mind, so as you experience things at the most subtle and clear level of consciousness you are still experiencing the mind. However, it is pretty obvious from logic that some other external forces trigger the consciousness and give us a common reality. Consensus reality is real, though without consciousness it may be completely imaterial and without form or substance. Life is not a hallucination. Even though the world and the mind that percieves them are one, and perception is projected from within the mind, it's not "all in your head". I am mean, in a way it is, but it isn't. Your mind is but a small piece in a complex tapestry that transcends your own thoughts and identity, so really you aren't living in a fishbowl.

I'm having a hard time communicating this, but consider that perhaps that there is no internal or external.


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1. "After an hour I wasn't feeling anything so I decided to take another..."
2. "We were feeling pretty good so we decided to smoke a few bowls..."
3. "I had to be real quiet because my parents were asleep upstairs..."


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OfflineGomp
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Re: Mushrooms and spirituality [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #3769687 - 02/12/05 03:10 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Mind connects to the rest of the worlds, being the space in between it all, and, in the 'control centre?, we call brain, it attaches to an ego?s identification.
Making you, who you were, in what you are, creating who you are, to become.

The space, in between, overall, is as you as it is I.
We, as space in our spirit, spiritually connect to everything. 

Mind, stretches far beyond the rest of the body, and in dreams we have all experienced it, what we keep in mind individually, and forgetting of what is not yet, to be, ?brought back?, render some, all dream less, forgetting, they forgot, all about it.

Our imagination, so ?strong?, it could imagine, not being able to imagine.


Conscious Mind connected to the rest of the world, being a body. A shape, in the figure in of which you have grown, after birthed by you parents.
Adapting memes all around, consciously having subconscious Mind, unconnected, doing what, you subsequently, need not consciously bear in mind.

Like the air you breathe, and the water you drank, in it was us, our imagination, as real.


:confused:


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Mushrooms and spirituality [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #3769704 - 02/12/05 03:19 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Some interesting thoughts passing through this thread. :thumbup:

Quote:

Divided_Sky said:
. However, pure awareness, the basis of all thoughts and feelings, which is our consciousness, bodily and mental senses are also Mind. Awareness is one with the mind, so as you experience things at the most subtle and clear level of consciousness you are still experiencing the mind.




I'm going to have to think some more on this before I can reply with some thoughts, but I will note that I am reflecting on the mind as an unconscious, dynamic structure that does not need awareness to carry out its processes, and that pure awareness itself precedes the mind in terms of our direct experience in this moment, suggesting that it is possible for experience to be had of pure awareness without the mind at all, and also that the mind can operate without pure awareness at all. :grin:

A similar example would be of breathing... it is possible to breathe consciously, but it is also possible for the breath process to carry itself out completely independant of any need for awareness or of something to be conscious of it happening. Of course, substructures of the mind will be noting that breathing is occuring, especially as these substructures are responsible for the breathing process occuring, but I do not think at this time that pure awareness, at the top of this organization's hierarchy, has to be aware of its happening for it to be happening.

Like I said, I'm still contemplating all of the related aspects of all of this, so don't take these expressions as some formulated stance on the issue. :grin:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


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I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
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Loving every breath of you

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