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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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Re: Transcendance. [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #3670786 -

What about fighting, fighting, fighting anything that would destroy the interconnectedness of all life?

What about destroying the death machine of capital and the spectacle because it's destroying the only true temple?

What about the spiritual practice of the struggle to be connected to ourselves and our land? What about tangible freedom?

To me, this is holy.

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #3670793 -

Why is so many people's concept of spirit about *climbing,* being higher, being above, hierarchy, better than, beyond?

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #3670808 -

It's not about being better than or beyond; anyone who approaches spirituality with this attitude would be better off to become a snobbish rich intellectual if all they want is to feel superior. An earnest spiritual practice can begin by stepping back from the rest of the world to find the Self, or by finding the Self in others. One is not superior to the other.


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"I'm afraid of losing my obscurity. Genuineness only thrives in the dark. Like celery."
- Aldous Huxley

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: Xygyg]
    #3670813 -

Xygyg said:
I don't crave it, it's more like i'm drawn towards some sort of inevitable transformation.


I am drawn powerfully towards transformation as well, I think it's inherent. Life is transformation, endlessly. Stagnation doesn't exist in a functional ecosystem. My transformation is non-hierarchical. My transformation is horizontal. Like walking and walking deeper down a forest path, and finding new insight, new living companions I never saw before. Building deeper relations with everything.

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: TinTree]
    #3670818 -

TinTree said:
It's not about being better than or beyond; anyone who approaches spirituality with this attitude would be better off to become a snobbish rich intellectual if all they want is to feel superior. An earnest spiritual practice can begin by stepping back from the rest of the world to find the Self, or by finding the Self in others. One is not superior to the other.

I agree, however in the concept of transcendance, in the language of it and in it's practice I see a lot of higher than thou hierarchical nonsense.

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #3670841 -

Perhaps because the post-transcendental state cannot be compared to the pre-transcendental one? I do not know. Also, the people who doing the talking about transcendence aren't the ones who have achieved it. :smirk:


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"I'm afraid of losing my obscurity. Genuineness only thrives in the dark. Like celery."
- Aldous Huxley

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: TinTree]
    #3670859 -

Why is the concept of transcendance necessary to your spiritual practice? And what are you transcending? What are you becoming? Is your concept of transcendance interchangeable with the concept of building interconnectedness?

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #3670975 -

I am trying to transcend the delusions that cause suffering; it is not necessary to my spiritual practice, it is my spiritual practice. I am becoming me (realization that there are no static states of form, form is necessarily in constant flux). Interconnectedness is not the same as transcendence, as far as I can tell. Transcendence would be a transcendence of interconnectedness as well, where interconnectedness is a conception for healthy social relationships. When one realizes that there is nothing that is not the Self, there is no need for "healthy social interaction". There is no need for anything. It is all there.

Sorry, this explanation fails somewhat. Too many big words, I guess. :shrug:
Delusion's a bitch, ain't it?


--------------------
"I'm afraid of losing my obscurity. Genuineness only thrives in the dark. Like celery."
- Aldous Huxley

Edited by TinTree (01/24/05 02:22 AM)

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: TinTree]
    #3671001 -

That was disrespectful. I really don't appreciate it.

If you think I'm suffering from delusion you can go ahead and believe whatever you like, but it's really just an uninformed opinion. Too many big words? Low blow there. I must say, i wasn't expecting it. I thought we were having a good conversation until you threw that one out there.

I agree with, and relate to your concept of becoming yourself, as in the realization that nothing is static and that everything is in constant flux. I am not a materialist by any means, materialism is a pile of philosophical crap in my opinion. But my concept of interconnectedness is not necessarily only about healthy social relationships, although I recogize the need for such things. Interconnectedness, to me, is about recognizing the inherent oneness of all life, and existing in that place.

Language is so insufficient. Fuck it. I should be outside, not sitting in this dank room in front of this inane machine.

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #3671017 -

Oh no! I'm so sorry! :gassho:

I did not mean that you were deluded! I meant that my own explanation was too intellectual in nature, and failed to describe things adequately. I am the deluded one. Again, my apologies.


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"I'm afraid of losing my obscurity. Genuineness only thrives in the dark. Like celery."
- Aldous Huxley

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: TinTree]
    #3672224 -

Oh damn, sorry. I didn't mean to be super defensive, I realize what you meant now. Funny, again... the english language is totally inadequate and is prone to causing misunderstanding and unintended conflict. I should have asked you what your intentions were rather than assuming you were trying to insult me. I guess i'm just used to having my ideas attacked constantly, so I always assume it's right around the corner when it's not.

At least this misunderstanding has been cleared up!

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #3672352 -

There are many ways to attain truth. :smile: Mine I feel is the way of knowledge. Perhaps for you it's the way of proper action, physically contacting and getting to know the land for example.

Transcendence and spirituality do necessarily involve a hierarchical structure. I speak of transcending the ego, that is, regarding the world from a universal, as opposed to individual, perspective. The more universal your perspective, the farther along you are on the path. You speak of connecting with nature, of branching out into the glory of the universe, and the more you are one with nature the farther along you are. Both methods come down to the same thing. Note that, as you become one with nature, your ego must consequently dissolve. So perhaps I focus more on the act of transcendence, and you on its result?

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #3672505 -

We all want to be in the NOW, but not just yet...  :cool:


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: Swami]
    #3672937 -

Pheonix: The issue for me, as an anarchist, is that I know that NOTHING necessarily requires a hierarchical structure. I see it the other way around, hierarchy is an imposition, an abstract illusory system of some asshole placing himself above everyone else and finding some elaborate excuse for it, whatever it is... be it the will of God, the supreme awesomeness of the empire, the "nature" of reality or whatever. It's all lies.

Also, what is with duality? Can't it be possible to view things through a "universal" and an individual perspective simultaneously?

I also understand and respect that everyone has different methods at figuring out the same inherent urge to understand.... However I consider it one of my roles to challenge everything all the time. We all need to take our own ideas with a grain of salt, and laugh at the insufficiency of intellectualizing something that has no language.

And Swami: heheh, nice one. So true! We all like to talk about being in the moment, rather than just doing it. bla bla bla bla bla. It happens in every circle.

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #3673031 -

DIO"T SLKJ YDOU USE SIGN LANGUGE J


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Evolution of Time.

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: Droz]
    #3673040 -

do the didi dhlks di won't sod hfeof sndify eonif forf ite sureh dnldkfyso iunfoeyoifsnefoi nsfeo


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Evolution of Time.

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: Droz]
    #3673048 -

apache fix hole in earth crust


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Evolution of Time.

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: Droz]
    #3673075 -

do the didi dhlks di won't sod hfeof sndify eonif forf ite sureh dnldkfyso iunfoeyoifsnefoi nsfeo if yoru mefnsoy lnl dfhoyu onsfoeiy oinj


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Evolution of Time.

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: Droz]
    #3673081 -

i've been to the shroomery meetings shroomsim is my deckj sofy uj


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Evolution of Time.

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Re: Transcendance. [Re: Droz]
    #3673084 -

i see your women control you


--------------------
Evolution of Time.

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