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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: pugster] * 1
    #29701213 -

Trump has indeed betrayed Ukraine, but luckily Europe and many other countries have stepped in to back Ukraine.
According to the video posted above it was a proxy war US vs Russia, but seems thats changed. At least until we get a real president in there and toss the fake one.
Also luckily, Ukraine doesnt need Starlink to hit Russian targets.

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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: Icon]
    #29701224 -

pugster said:
usually i'll answer anything aimed at me, but yet again you have posted an incoherent ramble.


Weird, didn't answer my post.

Icon said:
pugster said:
all the article says is that they told ukraine the best place to hit , it doesnt mean they used that intel and they did not supply any weaponry - its common sense that ukraine would see them as a high value target and hit them regardless of what they were told.

lets be honest here, ukraine are at war and will hit anything they can  - you dont try and target one egg in a box of eggs - just hit the whole carton.


Ukraine can’t even keep a drone in the air without starlink, and the only way it knows when a missile is coming is when USA points it out for them with our intel
https://www.nbcnews.com/world/ukraine/ukraine-starlink-restrictions-military-intel-trump-zelenskyy-russia-rcna603412
Ukraine has zero autonomy or ability to strike without USA help. Using our tools to hit what they want to hit isn’t how this works.


Is Ukraine still hitting anything they want to hit? Or did their owners shorten their leash?

Did Ukraine also choose not to use our intel when two ballistic missiles hit Kiev? Speak more on their common sense. Even Vicepope has a better handle on the conflict than you.

Edited by Icon (10/17/26 05:07 PM)

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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: ShroomDad]
    #29701235 -

ShroomDad said:
Trump has indeed betrayed Ukraine, but luckily Europe and many other countries have stepped in to back Ukraine.
According to the video posted above it was a proxy war US vs Russia, but seems thats changed. At least until we get a real president in there and toss the fake one.
Also luckily, Ukraine doesnt need Starlink to hit Russian targets.


Lol already doubling down on Ukraine not needing Starlink, after that exact challenge reaped a speed limit on the service, "hobbling" logistics and operations?

It's still a proxy war, we're just preparing to feed the next proxy (Europe) into Russia. Pete Hegseth called it "Division of Labor" in a speech 18 months ago. Europe increases their military spending, spends GDP on American weapons, and we stand back arming the next generation of Europeans to fight our proxy war.

Weird how the best year Ukraine has had in the war immediately followed signing away the rights to half their minerals. Almost as if... there's a multi-trillion dollar incentive for USA to help now.

All this public bickering between Zelenskyy and USA, USA and Europe, USA giving Russia concessions, is just a puppet show. Even if Trump dragged Zelenskyy by the ear in front of a camera and made him make peace, it would just be to flood the zone with NATO units so we can false-flag Russia into a rematch with the next proxy.

To think Trump has abandoned Ukraine or Europe is retarded. No president can or will ever stop our mission to dominate the rest of the world, including Russia and China. America's survival depends on it.

Edited by Icon (10/17/26 06:00 PM)

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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: Icon] * 1
    #29701314 -

Ukraine uses (was using) a military version of starlink to deal with incoming missiles and communications, not to hit targets in Russia. Starlink doesnt work in Russia.

Abandoned is the wrong word, he's alienated our friends and allies. Trump has shown them we (the US) cant be trusted, and theres a recent video of a press conference of world leaders announcing their support of Ukraine. Its a long list.

btw, Ukraine retains full legal ownership and authority over its natural resources and lands; it did not sign away the physical rights to its mines or deposits.

Edited by ShroomDad (10/17/26 06:26 PM)

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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: ShroomDad]
    #29701339 -

I get offbrand news streams, some of which come from Eastern Europe.

afaic, Ukranian troops are freely broadcasting tactics, that probably ought not to be revealed under interrogation.

As it is straightforward to jam the signal with noise over broadcast channels, drones are being operated by a literal, physical connection in the form of a fine wire.  Russians are incapable of hiding their massive war machines behind windbreaks on the plains.


--------------------
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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: ShroomDad]
    #29701568 -

ShroomDad said:
Ukraine uses (was using) a military version of starlink to deal with incoming missiles and communications, not to hit targets in Russia. Starlink doesnt work in Russia.

Abandoned is the wrong word, he's alienated our friends and allies. Trump has shown them we (the US) cant be trusted, and theres a recent video of a press conference of world leaders announcing their support of Ukraine. Its a long list.

btw, Ukraine retains full legal ownership and authority over its natural resources and lands; it did not sign away the physical rights to its mines or deposits.


I guess you didn't read the division of labor part?

Trump / America has not alienated our allies lol. We're just mobilizing them and restructuring the division of labor, like Pete told them we would. EU are basically states of the union at this point. Whatever friction you perceive publicly is no more relation-ending than the friction between California and the federal government. All western nations are in so much dollar debt, their economies depend on USA primacy not collapsing. It's not that NATO can't count on USA, but that USA told NATO to step up and handle Russia, so we can focus on China. Russia/Ukraine conflict is just one puzzle piece in a global campaign for primacy. A campaign that needs a lot of minerals.

Ukraine's minerals are as good as ours. Just look at the oil "deal" we gave Venezuela. As soon as we decide the bill for all this is due, mines start extracting. Probably Ukrainian labor, just 50% of all the yield goes to US MIC.

Starshield (the offensive, in Russia version) was also experiencing disruptions, not just starlink.
https://www.theatlantic.com/international/2026/10/starshield-ukraine-military-technology-vulnerability/689035/

Imagine the kind of power we'll have over Ukraine once we rebuild their country with the other 50% of their minerals, that eventually also goes to Western countries that are contracted to rebuild it. The same control over Starlink, only power plants, electrical grid, water sanitation, etc. Ukraine was captured, just not by Russia.

Edited by Icon (10/17/26 11:57 PM)

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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: Icon] * 1
    #29701584 -

The US targetedly cutting intel to ukraine isnt a betrayal to Europe?

And can you quote what your referring to from that link?


--------------------
I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.


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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: Icon]
    #29701696 -

Icon said:
pugster said:
usually i'll answer anything aimed at me, but yet again you have posted an incoherent ramble.


Weird, didn't answer my post.

Icon said:
pugster said:
all the article says is that they told ukraine the best place to hit , it doesnt mean they used that intel and they did not supply any weaponry - its common sense that ukraine would see them as a high value target and hit them regardless of what they were told.

lets be honest here, ukraine are at war and will hit anything they can  - you dont try and target one egg in a box of eggs - just hit the whole carton.


Ukraine can’t even keep a drone in the air without starlink, and the only way it knows when a missile is coming is when USA points it out for them with our intel
https://www.nbcnews.com/world/ukraine/ukraine-starlink-restrictions-military-intel-trump-zelenskyy-russia-rcna603412
Ukraine has zero autonomy or ability to strike without USA help. Using our tools to hit what they want to hit isn’t how this works.


Is Ukraine still hitting anything they want to hit? Or did their owners shorten their leash?

Did Ukraine also choose not to use our intel when two ballistic missiles hit Kiev? Speak more on their common sense. Even Vicepope has a better handle on the conflict than you.


are you still trying to say ukraine cant hit anything without u.s help? yes they will take help if they get it and yes they will carry on with the war if they dont,nothing in the quote i said is wrong .

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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: Icon]
    #29701700 -

Icon said:
To think Trump has abandoned Ukraine or Europe is retarded. No president can or will ever stop our mission to dominate the rest of the world, including Russia and China. America's survival depends on it.


lol what the actual...

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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: pugster]
    #29701867 -

pugster said:
Icon said:
To think Trump has abandoned Ukraine or Europe is retarded. No president can or will ever stop our mission to dominate the rest of the world, including Russia and China. America's survival depends on it.


lol what the actual...


It's pretty simple. USA can't allow anyone to be independent of it and present a military threat to it, and it wants its allies to be dependent on it, not treated as equal and individual powers. It's an empire.

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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: Icon] * 1
    #29701879 -

lmao, dude , american allies just saw america turn off a paid for mil system (starlink) on an 'allied' country at war.

do you not think every country in the world is now starting to look elsewhere for just about everything it can and to start looking at making in house anything it cant?

*the main threat to america at the moment is... america

you keep saying trump/america has not alienated its allies  , i live in the UK - trust me you have alienated your allies - everyone i know has already stopped buying anything american whenever possible and will continue to do so.

Edited by pugster (10/18/26 11:35 AM)

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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: pugster]
    #29701940 -

Well good, keep breaking away if you can. Imagine what it's like to have your entire economy shut off when USA sanctions a country. Maybe reconsider Russia's intentions for blocking the empire's capture of Ukraine('s resources).


Edited by Icon (10/18/26 12:35 PM)

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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: Icon]
    #29701954 -

Icon said:
I guess you didn't read the division of labor part?

Trump / America has not alienated our allies lol. We're just mobilizing them and restructuring the division of labor, like Pete told them we would. EU are basically states of the union at this point. Whatever friction you perceive publicly is no more relation-ending than the friction between California and the federal government. All western nations are in so much dollar debt, their economies depend on USA primacy not collapsing. It's not that NATO can't count on USA, but that USA told NATO to step up and handle Russia, so we can focus on China. Russia/Ukraine conflict is just one puzzle piece in a global campaign for primacy. A campaign that needs a lot of minerals.

Ukraine's minerals are as good as ours. Just look at the oil "deal" we gave Venezuela. As soon as we decide the bill for all this is due, mines start extracting. Probably Ukrainian labor, just 50% of all the yield goes to US MIC.

...

Imagine the kind of power we'll have over Ukraine once we rebuild their country with the other 50% of their minerals, that eventually also goes to Western countries that are contracted to rebuild it. The same control over Starlink, only power plants, electrical grid, water sanitation, etc. Ukraine was captured, just not by Russia.



Wow, thats a lot to unpack. You’re making a lot of assumptions and leaping to conclusions.

First of all, its a mistake to confuse Hegseth with some sort of military mastermind, or Trump with being any sort of genius. Trump cant even stay awake in meetings because he’s up all night posting images of himself being Jesus, or wrestling tigers, or attacking the people he currently hates.

Its a mistake to confuse Trump with being America, he’s just a guy we hired for a short term gig and has the lowest approval rating I've ever seen. And he has alienated TF out of most the world, but luckily as I said, America isnt Trump. We can be forgiven.

We are not the only country manufacturing arms or aircraft or whatever, its foolish to think we are in control of any markets. In other words, we arent holding all the cards.

Even our best friend Canada is buying and trading with other countries instead of us, and I've seen predictions that the US Dollar is about to go tits-up. World economies are already making adjustments that don’t include the US.

btw, even with Halloween being right around the corner, there is nothing scarier than the thought of having Pete Hegseth and Donald Trump ‘focusing’ on China.

Hegseth has fired all the admirals and generals who knew how to fight wars because they were loyal to the Constitution, and the troops respected them. He wants testosterone-driven troops loyal only to him, I know you wont understand the significance of that.

Anyway, I cant speak to all that conspiracy stuff you believe, or why you would want ‘power over Ukraine.’  Sounds creepy.

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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: ShroomDad]
    #29702009 -

This country was founded on colonization, genocide, slavery. It's arguably never been a free people's republic. I'm not condoning anything the government does, I don't support Trump or praise the administration. I think the only difference with Trump is he doesn't try to hide the shady stuff America does to enforce it's alpha role.

Red and blue is just bad cop / good cop. Trump is effectively applying maximum pressure, but a blue president isn't going to magically reverse everything. Probably a lot of the cultural stuff will get reversed, something they can present blue voters as a victory. But key policies that advance the empire in foreign and domestic politics will remain. They'll find one democrat senator waiting in line to sell out and abstain so any substantial repeal vote fails.

The economy is not going to get better as we continue to get eclipsed by China. Trump's attempts to rally and wield the empire probably wouldn't even be enough. Can definitely blame him for gas prices, but if we're being honest we've been ripping off the rest of the world in a lot of ways. The increased prices we're seeing now is still far from fair trade.

Take Venezuela for example. A democrat president is not going to let Maduro go and rip up the contract that gives us tons of their oil. They're not going to stop undermining Iran, or destabilizing Russia. Many countries are paying far more than $5 per gallon, most of Europe is paying $10 - they're paying the cost of the war while we rip off Venezuela. Blue or Red, that isn't changing. America is corrupt, period.

Americans are corrupt because at the end of the day, they don't really give af about any of this as long as they can afford to roleplay middle class. No one's going to vote for someone to release all the power that keeps us from paying fair price. They'll vote for the status quo party; then suddenly not changing anything Trump's done, just to keep gas from continuing to rise past $5 per gal, will be hailed as virtuous.

Next administration isn't going to grant Ukraine their mineral rights back, or ask less of NATO countries.

Edited by Icon (10/18/26 02:53 PM)

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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: pugster] * 1
    #29702101 -

pugster said:
Icon said:
To think Trump has abandoned Ukraine or Europe is retarded. No president can or will ever stop our mission to dominate the rest of the world, including Russia and China. America's survival depends on it.


lol what the actual...


Bro thinks Trump gives a fuck about the survival of America :laugh2:

Trump is a dying degenerate "global elite"... born with a silver spoon in his mouth. All he cares about is maximizing his bank account while he is in office, in whatever ways possible.

Trump's grand children are currently learning to speak Mandarin, if that tells you anything about the future world he envisions :lol:


--------------------
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Every one of you should see this video.


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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: Bigbadwooof] * 2
    #29702143 -

i forget that most americans were bought up getting brain washed into thinking that its the greatest country in the world and everyone wants to be them/ live there and that a large proportion have never left the states and experienced other countrys and cultures.

im not trying to stereotype all americans with the above as i know its not true , but fuckinell they make it hard work with the ignorance of the world outside the u.s.

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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: pugster] * 2
    #29702217 -

If you are like me and a momma's boy, america is best.  Maybe not even all america, but missouri is best.  Maybe not all of missouri but the four hundred person town I live by.  Maybe not the town but my four closest neighbors and family with in driving distance.  I lived a year in korea and I have no doubt some that have come over here and went back think korea is better.

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