Home | Community | Message Board
You are not signed in.
Sign In New Account
Forum Index Search Posts Trusted Vendors Highlights Galleries FAQ User List Chat Store Random Growery


This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.

Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Advanced Mycology
Threaded Mode Threaded  Previous topic Previous  View all topics Index  Next topic Next 

Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Mushroom-Hut Mono Tub Substrate   North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Sporeworks.EU Spores for European Microscopy   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale   MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1
Genetic mandela effect ?
    #29555986 -

Im not sure exactly how to ask the question. But i remember when i used to get prints from fsre back in the day i would get some really good genetics from the prints. I remember several strains from dutch king/lizard king to pink buffalo and a few others would exhibit growth that i dont see mutch of nowadays.
I took a hiatus from the hobby but when i got back into it i noticed mushrooms did not grow as "good" as i remembered. And funny as it sounds i honestly feel like there was mandela effect and im living a different time space.

Its going to be hard to put into words. Its almost as if you had to live my life and have that experience to know what i mean, so i wont bother trying to explain it.

But i wanted to ask if anyone else whos been around 20 or so years feels the way i do?

Edited by LoveOverWar (04/22/26 04:06 PM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Genetic mandela effect ? [Re: LoveOverWar]
    #29566115 -

I could not agree more. There is a notable loss of 'vigor' in MOST strains available today.

I was afraid this would happen and have maintained personal stocks outside of the commercial scene for about the last 27 years.

This is not the mandela effect... this is not just you. This is decades of ignoring well-established best practices in mycology, often enough by folks completely unaware of the damage they are doing, and the resulting degradation of nearly ALL commercially available genetics.

In the pursuit of ever higher mg/g... and a fixation on muties... I fear we have lost much of the 'magic' that got so many of us fixated on these things in the first place.

The Cannabis has suffered a similar fate IMHO.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Genetic mandela effect ? [Re: LoveOverWar]
    #29568366 -

The cultivated cube population is extremely inbred so the loss of vigour you've noticed is likely due to something called inbreeding depression.

"Inbreeding depression is the reduced survival, fertility, and fitness of offspring resulting from mating between closely related individuals. It occurs because inbreeding increases genome-wide homozygosity, exposing deleterious recessive mutations that are normally hidden in heterozygous states".


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Genetic mandela effect ? [Re: Dave Bennett]
    #29572505 -

As someone who is newer to the hobby, are there any ways you can further explain changes you have noticed in mycelium cultures from when you started to the way they are in 2026?

Have you had any experience with cultivation outside of cubensis? Are you talking specifically about senesence, or generally that cultures available today are just less aggressive, or maybe there is less value for sellers to cultivate agressive genetics?

Edited by Gastly (05/10/26 06:17 AM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Genetic mandela effect ? [Re: Gastly] * 1
    #29572717 -

Inbreeding depression affects all living creatures and plants but it isn't the same as senescence.

Inbreeding depression is reduced fitness caused by incestual mating (ie. spores from the same lineage or fruit germinate and mate to form a dikaryon) which causes recessive genes to accumulate in the genome and causes mutations that make the mycelium and fruits less fit for survival.

Senescence is basically aging and the accumulation of cellular damage and genetic mutations caused by continual cell replication and mutagenic factors in the environment over time.

Certain aspects of both can appear identical though. Weak, slow growing mycelium can be caused by bad genes and senescence but as senescence is ageing damage it only affects clone cultures which are repeatedly transferred and kept alive for months or years.

I'm not sure how much you know about dominant and recessive genes in fungi so I got Grok to make me a diagram showing how recessive genes cause inbreeding depression.



Enigma is a good example of inbreeding depression. It used to be a mushroom but it became so inbred and it's genome so corrupted that it became unable to produce healthy reproductively viable fruits and became sterile.

The fact that it can't reproduce and has to be propagated from clone cultures will and likely already has led to senescence. ie. slow growing, weak immune response to contams, takes ages to fruit etc. 

So regarding inbreeding depression in the cultivated cube population, home growers have been inbreeding a very small genetically bottle necked population for over 50 years. That's why all the crazy mutations have appeared in the last decade or so in the most inbred strain lines. Without five decades of inbreeding they'd still look like average brown wild cubes.

Hope all that made sense!


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Genetic mandela effect ? [Re: Dave Bennett] * 3
    #29614543 -

I first started playing with agar in front of the flow in about 2001. Personally I see a lot of stellar genetics compared to what it was like 20 years ago. No lack of magic or character or vigor either, save for a normal percentage of individuals.  :shrug:

I think you folks are just having some bad luck and your memories are more golden than reality. Easy to point fingers at the community at large when there is head trip at risk.


Ignoring established best practices... poofy.


:cookiemonster:


--------------------
Question everything, it's very responsive.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Genetic mandela effect ? [Re: Nichrome] * 2
    #29615187 -

Nichrome said:
I first started playing with agar in front of the flow in about 2001. Personally I see a lot of stellar genetics compared to what it was like 20 years ago. No lack of magic or character or vigor either, save for a normal percentage of individuals.  :shrug:

I think you folks are just having some bad luck and your memories are more golden than reality. Easy to point fingers at the community at large when there is head trip at risk.


Ignoring established best practices... poofy.


:cookiemonster:


I would have to agree. I see even more people doing absolutely amazing grows than ever these days especially with OG varieties. I haven't grown any cubes myself in a while but the community is pumping out ridiculous grows more consistently then ever.


--------------------
Welcome to the Advanced Mycology Forum

Bod's Library    Article behind a paywall? I can try to get it for you

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1

Shop: Mushroom-Hut Mono Tub Substrate   North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Sporeworks.EU Spores for European Microscopy   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale   MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds

Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Advanced Mycology
Threaded Mode Threaded  Previous topic Previous  View all topics Index  Next topic Next 

Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* senescence .. need some answers. Mych 5,134 15 02/22/12 08:50 AM
by OICU812
* Will this work? (grain to grain and senescence) Anonymous 2,903 17 01/31/03 06:46 AM
by Azmodeus
* Post deleted by Administrator Alien 2,025 13 11/01/03 09:28 PM
by Anonymous
* Re: Genetically Mutated Mushrooms
( 1 2 3 all )		 mycofile 15,285 47 12/28/99 02:48 PM
by Anonymous
* Genetic decline.... Prisoner#1 1,053 4 05/06/03 05:16 AM
by Prisoner#1
* another genetic question. Mindzpore 2,281 9 05/30/05 10:43 AM
by Mindzpore
* A couple questions about genetics. pcubmycol 2,370 12 07/01/05 08:48 AM
by pcubmycol
* Genetics of Mushrooms... angryshroom 3,098 17 06/02/02 05:17 AM
by r05c03

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: RogerRabbit, cronicr, Stipe-n Cap, Pastywhyte, bodhisatta
386 topic views. 0 members, 4 guests and 2 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2026 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.028 seconds spending 0.009 seconds on 16 queries.