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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Mushroom Cultivation
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OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar?
    #28926811 -

Ok so I have used some golden teacher grow kits and have taken some spore prints and have them nicely stored in foil.

I am paralyzed with indecision at my next step. Should I make a liquid culture or transfer my spores to agar? Is the agar route possible without a still air box? Is LC possible without a pressure cooker?

Should I go for BNF cakes or should I mix with bulk substrate??

Please help. It's autumn in the UK and I'll go out picking but I also want to grow.

I can't afford any expensive equipment; I was hoping I could just buy some jars, grain, vermiculite and get shrooms.

Please any links to user friendly, first time grower teks would be massively appreciated.

I have grown from kits but these are expensive and I now have some nice spore prints that I was careful to keep clean, despite not having a still air box.

So are cakes better for first timers, or spawning grain and mixing with bulk substrate in a tub?

It's so frustrating as there are so many different teks, so if someone could point me in the right, safe direction I would dedicate my first trip to you!

Many thanks anyone reading!

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: axemaniac]
    #28926816 -

No still air box or FFU? Just buy a tote and cut some holes out. Cost you less than 20.


--------------------
Endlessly endorsing empathy empirically energizing existence™

~Always practice radical kindness~
R.I.P. Betty Boop, greatest mother to ever do it.

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: QuantumZ00]
    #28926831 -

Always agar first

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: RockinRobot]
    #28926837 -

Do I need a still air box for agar? I suppose a plastic box with holes for my arms would work, but would a liquid culture be simpler?

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: QuantumZ00]
    #28926840 -

What's ffu? Are you recommending agar as well?

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: RockinRobot]
    #28926842 -

Hey Axe. Nice job getting prints

Check out the HHG — link in my sig. it will guide you

Looks to me stepping up to PF Tek would be a good path

But, whatever way suits your fancy

Cheers!


--------------------
Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Shroomery “Clean spawn is easily the most critical component of the entire cultivation process.”
Drink the Water of Life and become Paul Muad’Dib.
Remember to surrender.

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: axemaniac]
    #28926843 -

Should I make cakes or mix colonised substrate with bulk substrate and grow that way? Which has better yield?

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: AzureCultivator]
    #28926844 -

Thanks mate, I'll check it out. Happy trails

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: axemaniac]
    #28926845 -

Liquid culture is a more advanced technique. You need clean inoculant to make clean LC, and spores are inherently not clean. So you need agar to obtain clean cultures, and you do need a still air box for it. Once you have clean agar plates, you can use them for inoculation, so you might not end up making LC at all.

However, you need a pressure cooker for both LC and agar. If you can't afford one now, then you can make your own spore syringe and do a PF tek grow.

If you decide to go the spore syringe route, don't put them to grains. PF tek handles contamination better, grains can be easily overtaken by any contaminants in the spore syringes, and you're more likely than not to have some in it.

Edited by LyleChipperson (08/28/24 11:51 AM)

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: LyleChipperson]
    #28926876 -

now you shove spores up your butt spread out

as fast possible

GOOOOOOOO

CULTIVATE


--------------------
*Disclaimer* 

Everything written from this account are meant for amusement purposes ONLY.  Everything written or posted from this account are NOT TRUE.

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: axemaniac]
    #28927015 -

axemaniac said:
Should I make cakes or mix colonised substrate with bulk substrate and grow that way? Which has better yield?


Learn to walk before you run. As previously said Read the Hitchhikers guide and then decide what method is best for you. Whether you do cakes  or grain to bulk will depend on your needs and ability. Cakes are much more noob friendly but lower yield. Grain to bulk first requires you learn agar.

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: RockinRobot]
    #28927045 -

RockinRobot said:
axemaniac said:
Should I make cakes or mix colonised substrate with bulk substrate and grow that way? Which has better yield?


Learn to walk before you run. As previously said Read the Hitchhikers guide and then decide what method is best for you. Whether you do cakes  or grain to bulk will depend on your needs and ability. Cakes are much more noob friendly but lower yield. Grain to bulk first requires you learn agar.


learn to walk before you run

STOPPED THERE LOL

INSTANTLY

THOUGHT HERE COMES THE WISE MUSHROOM SPORE CULTIVATION PROPHET GURU HINDI


BUT THATS SOLID ADVICE IN GENERAL AND WISE SUFFICE TO SAY

LOL KUDOS BRO

KEEP UP THE ANCIENT WISDOM BRAH


--------------------
*Disclaimer* 

Everything written from this account are meant for amusement purposes ONLY.  Everything written or posted from this account are NOT TRUE.

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: Broly]
    #28927597 -

Right, so I should make a still air box and a spore syringe. Would the large guage needles from the exchange work ok? Don't see why not. Also the bacteriostatic water, sterile for injection could also help me save time and ensure it's sterile, right?

On the making a spore syringe Tek he squirts the spores off the foil into a shot glass or into a crease he makes in the foil. Won't this ruin the spore prints for future use since moisture activates the spores? Wouldn't it be safer to scrape them into a shot glass or even into the back of the syringe before sucking up the sterile water? That's confused me a bit.

So I use brf and vermiculite and water in a 2:2:1 ratio in sterilised mason jars to make cakes, then when fully colonised I have to do to dunk and roll thing? I've heard people have more success just misting the cakes with water.

I'm sorry about all the questions just there's so many ways to do it I makes my head spin. And a lot of conflicting advice!

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: axemaniac]
    #28927610 -

Sorry it's 2:1:1 ratio with vermiculite being the 2.

I also noted a Tek using plastic tubs instead of jars. I have a few of these around and they have a nice surface area, looking similar to a grow kit.

If the purpose of the pressure cooker (which is still listed as a must in the PF Tek) is to sterilised, couldn't I just use a large pan with a lid or even a microwave? If I microwaved them they'd be germ free in about 10 minutes or so. Is that possible and if so has anyone written about it here?

Thanks again!

Also I don't think I'm getting anything more from my grow kit. Is there anything I can do with the old cake from that now I've had my shrooms and got my spore prints? I currently have no money at all sadly so will have to wait a while before I can buy anything.

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: axemaniac]
    #28927738 -

You can do whatever you want, but I'd suggest you pick a tek and follow it closely, at least for your first couple grows.

Right now it's obvious that you have a jumble of information in your head, some of it is completely wrong, so any improvements you think you can make to a tek will likely have the opposite effect.

There's not that much conflicting information, at least here most growers are in consensus on the basics. There might be individual differences in what growers like the best, but they all follow the same founding principles. If you get your information from reddit or youtube, you're doing yourself a disservice. There's a lot of outdated and plain incorrect information out there on the general internet. You were lucky enough to come here, so just trust the recommended teks and spend some time reading and learning on the forum.

You can use a pot of water to sterilize pf cakes, but not grains. Microwaves can't do that reliably, if they could, no one would be buying all these pressure cookers. Some instant pot models can be used for sterilizing, so if you happen to have one, you can maybe use it. But until you get a pressure cooker and you can start making agar, your best bet is to do PF tek in jars, make spore syringes and use a pot of water to sterilize your jars.

Plastic tubs will hold more substrate so they will need to be steamed longer, and that's not been tested afaik, so you risk ruining your grows until you figure it out. Small 1/2 pint jars can be sterilized reliably in a pot, so stick to that.

If you have a garden, you can put your old cake outside and lightly cover it with soil. Water it often and maybe you can get more out of it.

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: LyleChipperson]
    #28927777 -

:whatshesaid:

I did the same thing and bought a kit before finding this site. Then I read the Hitchhikers guide and jumped into PF Tek. After my first set of jars I’m set up with at least 6 months of supply, if not more, and just started a second set of jars.

You may have found this already, but this has the answers until you are ready to jump into agar: Updated PF Tek guide

You may already have a lot of the equipment needed if you bought and kit, and this can be done very cost effectively, and get you a stash going while you learn more. You don’t need a pressure cooker (PC) for this, you can use a pot to steam sterilize the jars - just takes a bit longer.

Let us know if you have any questions.


--------------------
Hitchhiker's Guide to the Shroomery


“Once in a while you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right.”

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: LyleChipperson]
    #28927808 -

Ok thanks. Maybe I can get a cheap pressure cooker as they're about £20. I'm in the UK so autumn is fast approaching so cubensis strains won't grow. Thankfully I should be able to go out picking liberty caps soon though, but I haven't got any amazing spots to mind, just a vague idea of the areas they're meant to grow and some knowledge of the best environment and weather.

I have lots of the plastic tubs. They hold half a pint but I have some slightly smaller ones.

I have a large tote I can make a still air box from by heating a metal tin and melting holes so that's no problem.

If I'm understanding this, you sterilise the containers with the BRF, vermiculite and water. Will this cook the flour? Obviously it won't rise but nevermind.

Is the shoe box Tek easier than the pf Tek? Just it looks like I can colonise the plastic containers fully, take the lid off and stick a clear bag with some tiny holes for gas exchange. Or is that wrong?

I'm basically completely skint, so I'm looking for the cheapest and most noob friendly method going. Don't need huge yields just yet, just enough for myself and maybe a few friends.

Oh and the microwave. Would I be able to use that to sterilise the plastic tubs/substrate?

And can I use large guage needles and sterile water for injection to make a spore solution to colonise my substrate?

Thanks.

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: axemaniac]
    #28927862 -

Quote:
I have lots of the plastic tubs. They hold half a pint but I have some slightly smaller ones.


You have 1/2 pint tubs?  That seems really small.  What were you thinking of using these for?

Quote:
I have a large tote I can make a still air box from by heating a metal tin and melting holes so that's no problem.


Great.  Making a still air box (SAB) will help a lot with various techniques (teks) going forward.

Quote:
If I'm understanding this, you sterilise the containers with the BRF, vermiculite and water. Will this cook the flour? Obviously it won't rise but nevermind.


Yes, you mix the vermiculite and water, then mix in the BRF.  Plop this mixture in each mason jar up to the cap line inside the jar, and top with vermiculite to the very top of the jar before you put the lid on.  Cover each jar with foil and pressure cook them (or steam them in a covered pot with water).  This is all spelled out in the link I sent earlier.  It does not cook the flour.

Quote:
Is the shoe box Tek easier than the pf Tek? Just it looks like I can colonise the plastic containers fully, take the lid off and stick a clear bag with some tiny holes for gas exchange. Or is that wrong?


For beginners, no, shoebox tek is not easier than PF Tek.  With PF Tek there is no agar work, no grain jars to sterilize, less equipment needed, and less risk of contaminating the entire grow since you have a number of separate jars.  So, if one jar gets contamination you have all of the others left that are not contaminated.  I have seen people do a version of PF Tek where they use small plastic tubs (like takeout containers from restaurants) instead of mason jars, but if I were you I would stick to the Updated PF Tek guide - at least for your first grow or two, in order to get the basics down.

Quote:
I'm basically completely skint, so I'm looking for the cheapest and most noob friendly method going. Don't need huge yields just yet, just enough for myself and maybe a few friends.


I'm not sure what you currently have on hand and in your home, but PF Tek is the cheapest route to take in the beginning.  After you do a couple of PF Tek runs you will have a better idea of where you want to go and how the processes work.

Quote:
Oh and the microwave. Would I be able to use that to sterilise the plastic tubs/substrate?


No, please do not use a microwave to sterilize anything.  Please just follow the Updated PF Tek Guide.  First, a microwave will melt any plastic you put in there before the contents are sterilized, any metal mason jar lids or foil covering will probably catch on fire.  Also, no one here uses a microwave to sterilize for good reason - it doesn't work otherwise everyone would use them.

Quote:
And can I use large guage needles and sterile water for injection to make a spore solution to colonise my substrate?


I have yet to make my own multispore syringe (MSS), so others can advise on that.  I'm sure there is a tek outlined somewhere on the site.  I have only acquired spore syringes from vendors - they run about $15-$20 plus shipping.


--------------------
Hitchhiker's Guide to the Shroomery


“Once in a while you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right.”

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: UtahGetMeTwo]
    #28928002 -

The plastic containers I have are exactly like the ones you get from takeaways. So I'll sterilise them as per the Tek I read here.
Now all I need is to hit the needle exchange and get the syringes, swabs and water for injection. Then I'll need my vermiculite and brown rice flour and micropore tape and I think I'm good to go.

The plastic containers seem just as easy to use as the plastic jars. I will steam them with them elevated from the bottom of the pan for about 90-120mins, will that suffice?

Then I'll inject with my spore solution and let them fully colonise, wait another week, dunk them in the containers and cold shock in them in the fridge, then put them into a fruiting chamber. Sound good? Seems similar to the kits Ive bought previously except I'm doing it from scratch.

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Re: OK I have spore prints. Now what? LC or agar? [Re: axemaniac]
    #28928067 -

I’ve never used plastic takeaway containers so I can’t say if steaming time would differ from glass mason jars that are typically used. Micropore tape is no longer used in PF Tek, but again, I’ve never used takeaway containers so maybe the process is different? I’d assume not though. The reason I suggest following the Updated PF Tek guide as closely as possible is 1) it works after years of trial and error and refinement, and 2) this is the way most people here do it so it will be easier to help you. If you truly can’t afford to buy a few 1/2 pint glass mason jars then I’d suggest finding someone on here who has done PF Tek with those before, but again, would recommend following the guide using glass mason jars.

Why are you putting the colonized cake in the fridge while dunking? I believe that’s an old tek and unnecessary. Keeping things as simple as possible to get the results you want is a good lesson to learn now. Again, follow the Updated PF Tek guide and Hitchhikers Guide as closely as possible.

In general, your approach seems better than it did earlier, but I can’t speak to using plastic containers and the other stuff I mentioned earlier. If possible, I would just do what the Updated PF Tek guide says and you can deviate from that once you have learned more from this site. Glass mason jars are like $10 for a set of 12.


--------------------
Hitchhiker's Guide to the Shroomery


“Once in a while you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right.”

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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Mushroom Cultivation
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