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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: Swami]
    #2837037 -

How can I enjoy crap like Britney Spears or the other hundreds of insincere artists out there? Their 'art' is actually lowering the standards across the world

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: Swami]
    #2837188 -

i have a book called -
self transformation through music (joanne crandall)-
lots of nice meditative exercises, one of which is the same as your suggestion (pg127).
my friends and i used to pick bands at random (close eyes and point)from the gig guide and go see. some were shockers but we were lucky to see some great acts.
one point was that all the bands we saw did their best, they had worked hard to get up on the stage and play....i really appreciated that aspect of the concerts.

from 'self trans...'
"there is a story about an intellectual who wanted to know more about zen, so he went to a zen master. the master began pouring tea into the visitor's cup. the tea spilled over the brim of the cup but the master continued to pour. the intellectual said,'my cup is full is will hold no more.'
the zen master replied,'yes, and like your cup, your mind is filled with your own precious ideas. you must first empty the cup before i can give you anything.'
to come to a performance with an empty cup and no expectation other than that something will occur, to listen with a still, empty mind, to experience on the primary sensual level the performers and the music, all this is necessary for a profound listening experience."

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: Swami]
    #2838440 -


I can?t see myself possibly enjoying bubble gum pop...
Honestly, it makes me feel ill. I close my eyes and the mechanical, pre-packaged, plastic-wrapped aural assault begs me to pry the eyelids open for a different stimulus. If I were forced to go to a Britney Spears concert, I?d likely get just as sick watching the Disney-borne choreography that is essentially an emotionally-retarded and fully-clothed pole dance with a disclaimer telling me it?s art. The only thing that would make it worthwhile is the possibility of a handjob from some random MILF there on the vicarious-living-through-celebrities trip.

You buy the tickets... I?ll go to the damn show.


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: Sclorch]
    #2838667 -

If you and Choda can't learn to like Britney, then I am afraid I cannot guide you to the next level. You will forever be stuck where you are. Sorry. :frown:


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: Swami]
    #2838960 -

what about a good example of a creative disruption in programming or healthful breaking of habits, well within the swami capacity and worthy of challenge with envigorating effects for everybody?

who here can think up something like that which is not going to involve spending money or establishing receipts as proof of "being there"? - I would not want to trivialize the underlying importance of this thread and to what impressive places it could lead.

the broken habit can be commemorated without proof or dispute.

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: redgreenvines]
    #2839308 -

"the broken habit can be commemorated without proof or dispute."

true indeed.

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: redgreenvines]
    #2839349 -

Breaking a habit, while highly commendable, is a completely different form of reprogramming. The person wanting to change acknowledges his addiction.

The person who cannot for even a short time, appreciate or attempt to appreciate, a previously distasteful artform is, in many cases, TOTALLY UNAWARE that the decision to like or dislike is not theirs. This illusion is so powerful as to remain unacknowledged.

Here is a more obvious one that might make things clearer. A young man being interviewed stated, " I like sex," as if it was really his choice. You might as well state, " I like to make my heart beat." The "I" part has nothing to do with the "liking" of sex. It is pre-programmed. (Please, no tangents on neurotic or damaged individuals who find sex repulsive.)


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: Swami]
    #2839437 -

swami;

please don't switch to the biological imperative of mating
we are now approaching the issue of conditioning, i.e. the
programmable part, which is all about habit creation
and modification. (as opposed to evolutionary aquisitions of hard wiring)

hunger and mating are not really habits but biologic impulses.
we may have habits related to such impulses, but your clarity fades when you switch focus from programmable to burned in behaviors.

for instance, your computer has no choice in it's start up sequence but to find an operating system, that is surely a kind of programming, but it is not modifiable within it's incarnation (lots of hair splitting possible there too).

I think you are just resisting a bit of loss of floor, which is a good impulse for which to learn a new habit relationship - not to break anything, mind you, the rapid "jiu jitsu" style defense response to all movement is uniquely well developed.

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: Swami]
    #2839451 -

What if you open yourself up to it and still find you don't like it?


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: Swami]
    #2839536 -

there isn't a style of music I don't appreciate :smirk:

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: Swami]
    #2839675 -

?Conventional opinion is the ruin of our souls.?Rumi

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: Swami]
    #2839820 -

Though I agree with you, in theory, on this one... there's just some shit that I'll never like. I don't think this is a spiritual failure. If I can't stand Michael Jackson's latest album (it really blows), I don't see how "reprogramming" myself to like it will benefit me in any way... unless locking arms with his fanatics outside a courthouse chanting "Hell No! Michael's our bro!" is the end goal of the truly spiritual.

I think I have a damn flexible tolerance to just about every kind of art there is. Hell, I've wasted plenty of time at shitty rock shows waiting for a band to woo me. I've been to countless local art exhibitions in search of brilliance. I've even been to a half dozen high school talent shows, chorus performances, etc. in the hopes of seeing someone that just "got it."

As a rule of thumb, your point holds water. But, as an absolute method... it just doesn't work for me. Look, I'll sit through a Britney Spears concert and I'd probably find something neat, but for overall artistic value (not entertainment) - it's a few drops in an olympic-size pool. So, what I'm saying is that for your method of reprogramming to work for me, I'm going to require a higher order of stimulation rather than mere entertainment.


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: Sclorch]
    #2844479 -

*bump*


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: Sclorch]
    #2844662 -

Ding ding ding.

I think you got it there, man.

I personally have learned to break this programming in particular.. it's happened with several bands that one of my friends makes me listen to in his car. At first, I'll likely find something about it that I don't like, but at the same time respect the music for what it is.. then I move past not liking whatever single aspect of it that really bothers me.

But I don't move from "not liking" this single aspect to "liking it".. I move from "not liking" to neutrality. I've accepted it, and allowed it to be. I appreciate the music much more deeply after this.

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: JacquesCousteau]
    #2844804 -

I think the experiment is doable if you are talking about different styles of music rather than different "artists". And I use that term loosely in the case of Brittney Spears.

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: zorbman]
    #2845326 -

My wife once tried to break my programming by making me sit through the musical "Cats" while tripping on shrooms. It did not break my programming, but it nearly broke my soul.

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: Swami]
    #2846732 -

I was expecting something else.. But this task will be a hard one as well.. I dislike country music a lot.. You made me think of actually listening to it.. It almost made me puke. But I'm gonna try... If someone can actually recommend me some good (impossible combination) country music..  :smirk:


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:dancing: My latest music! :yesnod:

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: Fliquid]
    #2846797 -

First look at why you dislike it. Then attempt to figure out why others like it without disrespecting their opinion. Maybe you hate the sappy and simplistic sentiments, or the standard country twang and cracking voice; yet these very same things provide comfort, belonging and continuity with the past to others. Try to envision what the artist is trying to accomplish or say and how well they are doing it. Listen to the arrangement and counterpoint, hear the individual instruments. You probably don't dislike drums, do you?

The Judds have some catchy tunes with good vocal arrangements. The controversial Dixie Chicks are some amazingly accomplished musicians. Listen technically to the banjo and fiddle playing. Alison Kraus and Union Station is more bluegrass than country, but is also recommended.

If you do this "correctly", you may not become a fan, but I guarantee you will never hear it the same way again.


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The proof is in the pudding.

Edited by Swami (07/01/04 10:14 AM)

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: Swami]
    #2847678 -

What if music appreciation has little to do with "likes" and "dislikes"...and much more to do with human brain functioning?

Should I fine-tune my brain simply because certain forms of music do not press the right buttons?


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Re: Breaking your Programming [Re: trendal]
    #2847845 -

I used to hate classical music. Then after having played Civilazation3 for a long, long, time i realized that i actually liked the piano concerto that plays sometimes. Its really a great piece.


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We're the lowest of the low, the scum of the fucking earth!

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