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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
    #26157185 -

Jokeshopbeard said:
Heinrik said:
Just look at the meth heads and crack heads, they look like mindless zombies, they're not humans anymore.


People that down on their luck will turn to anything they can get their hands on to ease their suffering. Of course we will have preferences. But don't sit there and tell me that stimulants are more addictive than opiates, cause it's a crock.


There's also a component of your free time becoming your worst enemy.  I'd reckon that some people end up doing drugs just so that they'll have something to deal with, be it a trip or whatever tension enters their life as a result of doing drugs.

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: Bill_Oreilly] * 3
    #26157213 -

Bill_Oreilly said:
I once hit 13 3 pointers in a row while on heroin.

Heroin wasn't always a scourge. Bayor produced it for a reason.

The lack of drug knowledge on a drug forum is pretty sad. But some of you really know your shit.


Ayy bill out here gettin buckets


--------------------
I'm stupid, Enlil is smart.
I'm ugly, Enlil is beautiful.
I'm a loser, Enlil is a winner.
Someday, I hope to be like Enlil but secretly know I never will.

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: Bill_Oreilly]
    #26157217 -

Bayer said It wasn’t harmful at all.  That’s why everybody got addicted.


--------------------
Amanita86 said:
Sui is trying to mod right now.  Kinda like a newborn calf tryin ta stand fer the first time ain’t it..

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: Heinrik] * 1
    #26157256 -

meh....

:stoner:







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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
    #26157581 -

Jokeshopbeard said:
Heinrik said:
Just look at the meth heads and crack heads, they look like mindless zombies, they're not humans anymore.


People that down on their luck will turn to anything they can get their hands on to ease their suffering. Of course we will have preferences. But don't sit there and tell me that stimulants are more addictive than opiates, cause it's a crock.



  I've had long runs, months to years of daily use with coke (raw powder), Hero (raw white powder), and 90%+ speed. Speed and coke were hands down he most fiendish on the brain's reaction to re-dose, not to mention the shorter high and required multiple re-dosing during the day really puts people into a position where they have to more frequently keep their dosage in-check.
  Hero (10-20mg bump of white) would go for a solid 7-8 hours before I thought about doing another bump, coke was roughly an hour to 1.5 before another line, amphetamine right around the 4 hour mark. Also, the mental desire never came close to coke and speed, and I used H for years longer than either of the other two on a daily use level. Everyone's brain chemistry is unique; however the people I've both known and/or discussed this with have had similar experiences much more often then not.

Sources were very trusted and product always tested by myself.


--------------------
Oxygen. Water. Neil Young

Our word "planet" comes from the Greek word planetes, meaning "wanderer."

"There ain't no revolution, only evolution, but every time I'm in Georgia I eat a peach for peace."
Gregg Allman

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: O_Dweeds]
    #26157592 -

O_Dweeds said:
coke was roughly an hour to 1.5 before another line, amphetamine right around the 4 hour mark.


So after sleep, you would pass the compulsive redosing mark, right?


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: O_Dweeds]
    #26157685 -

The plants in their natural state are the best way to use imo, and the only way that I would use again.

Fresh baby coca leaves have a nice variety of alkaloids that gives a very euphoric, no anxiety high for about 3 hours with a 1-1.5 gram wad and something to pull out the alkaloids such as leija. Also wonderful to have at high elevations hikes, hunts, ect.

The poppy plant pods and stalks are the best use of the plant. Even more alkaloid variety (Morphine and the right level of Thebaine is a perfect mix of energy) Not even lancing to pull out latex; just dried and eaten or drank mixed in with water.

*Side note subutex/suboxone is synthesized thebaine, which is why it is so effective in long-lasting pain-relief & energetic in very low dosage.

Amphetamines are no longer something I consider.


--------------------
Oxygen. Water. Neil Young

Our word "planet" comes from the Greek word planetes, meaning "wanderer."

"There ain't no revolution, only evolution, but every time I'm in Georgia I eat a peach for peace."
Gregg Allman

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
    #26157699 -

Jokeshopbeard said:
So after sleep, you would pass the compulsive redosing mark, right?



Nope, it would just exponentially increase during those hours which is why in the morning I would be just begin to wanting to have a bump of H. Where as with Coke I would always have a shittier sleep, inconsistent REM cycle, and wake up much more mentally craving it.

Coke is a shitty drug imo, it's effects/duration, so much more quantity being used, all the potential health issues. Pure powder/flake via insufflation.

If two users, one using pure H, one using pure Coke, and kept their dosages the same (10-20mg every 8 hours for H/50-100mg every hour to 1.5 hours for Coke) for desired effects and same method (insufflation) in the long-run the coke user would suffer more damage/side effects.

Edited by O_Dweeds (08/28/19 08:10 PM)

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: O_Dweeds]
    #26157714 -

And never underestimate the powder of a good healthy nights sleep (REM Cycles).
That compounds fast with stimulants.


--------------------
Oxygen. Water. Neil Young

Our word "planet" comes from the Greek word planetes, meaning "wanderer."

"There ain't no revolution, only evolution, but every time I'm in Georgia I eat a peach for peace."
Gregg Allman

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: Malcolm_Xtasy] * 1
    #26158123 -

Malcolm_Xtasy said:
Bill_Oreilly said:
I once hit 13 3 pointers in a row while on heroin.

Heroin wasn't always a scourge. Bayor produced it for a reason.

The lack of drug knowledge on a drug forum is pretty sad. But some of you really know your shit.


Ayy bill out here gettin buckets




--------------------
Something there is mysteriously formed,
Existing before Heaven and Earth,
Silent, still, standing alone, unchanging,
All-pervading, unfailing,
I do not know its name; I call it tao.
If forced to give it a name, I call it
Great (ta). Being great, it flows out;
Flowing out means far-reaching;
Being far-reaching, it is said to return.

It's just a shot away..

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: O_Dweeds]
    #26158147 -

O_Dweeds said:
If two users, one using pure H, one using pure Coke, and kept their dosages the same (10-20mg every 8 hours for H/50-100mg every hour to 1.5 hours for Coke) for desired effects and same method (insufflation) in the long-run the coke user would suffer more damage/side effects.


See this is my point though; I think it's damn rare to find a cokehead that will dose as soon as he wakes, and then dose all day every day until he sleeps again, and then repeat.

Whereas I would say that freqency is absolutely the norm amongst heavy opiate users...

I get the side by side thing, but I don't think one can compare that way.

Thoughts?


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
    #26158159 -

I'll add my experience with opiate addicts.

I've met some very smart and more arguably stupid people who ended up addicted to heroin, and in both cases it pretty much ruined their lives or at best set them back years if not decades.

One of them ended up going in and out of jail, and steadily draining their family's savings trying to deal with legal fees and support. They also almost died from a collapsed vein at one point...

The other spent tens of thousands of dollars of their kids college savings fund after getting hooked to pain pills and later heroin.

In both cases the addictions ended up costing them obscene amounts of money, seriously damaging family/friend relationships, and leading to years of recovery/relapses. That may not happen to everyone but it seems like a fairly consistent result of regular opiate use be it medicinal or recreational. The tolerance issues alone make it pretty tough to use long term without issues, especially when people are chasing the high.

So personally I'd say the risks outweigh any possible benefits in almost every case, and even people using opiates for chronic pain should look for better long term solutions or at least take regular breaks.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free


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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: musiclover420] * 1
    #26158188 -

Life destroying is a pretty extreme description, but if you feel great on opiates and don't feel good when you're not on them, you will easily get hooked.  While I can't speak for chronic pain patients, self medicating for some emotional or existential reason with opiates tends to cause lots of life problems and decreases you potential for enjoyment in life down the road in lots of ways.  If you give a fuck about your life and future, I personally would not recommend taking opiates. 

To me it's not too much safer to take weak opiates or low doses.  Sure you might get less sick but the sickness is not the dangerous part as much as it sucks.  What's dangerous about it is how it changes your thought processes regarding what you find a rewarding experience, and that will happen at any dose you can feel.  Lots of drugs can do this but opiates seem especially effective, and that effect of the drug can last for an indefinite amount of time unlike the sickness.

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #26159855 -

moonrockmushy said:
Life destroying is a pretty extreme description, but if you feel great on opiates and don't feel good when you're not on them, you will easily get hooked.  While I can't speak for chronic pain patients, self medicating for some emotional or existential reason with opiates tends to cause lots of life problems and decreases you potential for enjoyment in life down the road in lots of ways.  If you give a fuck about your life and future, I personally would not recommend taking opiates. 

To me it's not too much safer to take weak opiates or low doses.  Sure you might get less sick but the sickness is not the dangerous part as much as it sucks.  What's dangerous about it is how it changes your thought processes regarding what you find a rewarding experience, and that will happen at any dose you can feel.  Lots of drugs can do this but opiates seem especially effective, and that effect of the drug can last for an indefinite amount of time unlike the sickness.


Wayyy to many uniquely occurring opiates to blanket them all in the not safe for low/micro-dosing.
Example: Micro/Low-dosing thebaine is extremely energizing and lasts 24 hours. So you're going a full day before your body is even feeling like a re-dose.
And since it also has pain relief properties 2-4 times as strong as morphine it works great for it's desired use and one can sleep well and have a good ngihts sleep (REM Cycles)


--------------------
Oxygen. Water. Neil Young

Our word "planet" comes from the Greek word planetes, meaning "wanderer."

"There ain't no revolution, only evolution, but every time I'm in Georgia I eat a peach for peace."
Gregg Allman

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: O_Dweeds] * 2
    #26159859 -


Let me sum up this thread for the Too long didn't readers. TL:DR




Quote:
Are opiates really life destroying?




YES

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: Fiery]
    #26159945 -

Fiery said:
Let me sum up this thread for the Too long didn't readers. TL:DR




Quote:
Are opiates really life destroying?




YES


Get ready.  Somebody’s going to argue it.


--------------------
Amanita86 said:
Sui is trying to mod right now.  Kinda like a newborn calf tryin ta stand fer the first time ain’t it..

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: lowbrow] * 1
    #26159958 -

lowbrow said:
Fiery said:
Let me sum up this thread for the Too long didn't readers. TL:DR




Quote:
Are opiates really life destroying?




YES


Get ready.  Somebody’s going to argue it.



NO, How could an inanimate object destroy a life.

Is not having self-control really life destroying?
Yes, it can be.

Are people responsible for their own actions?
Yes.

If you do heroin and rape someone is it the heroins fault?
No.

If you do heroin and spend all your money and get locked up is it the heroins fault?
No.

If you drink a gallon of vodka a day and fuck up your health do you blame yourself or the alcohol?

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: Lophosaurus]
    #26159973 -

How are you going to rape somebody when you’re nodding off and can’t even get it up?

Strawman better please.


--------------------
Amanita86 said:
Sui is trying to mod right now.  Kinda like a newborn calf tryin ta stand fer the first time ain’t it..

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: Lophosaurus] * 2
    #26159985 -

Lophosaurus said:
NO, How could an inanimate object destroy a life.


What, like guns?

I know, I know, guns don't kill people, people do, but without guns in this world I'd stake my life on the fact people wouldn't be getting killed in anything like the sheer numbers they currently are.

Such is the case with opiates. There's no way, were they no so readily available in this country, that you'd be losing so many due to the crisis they've caused.

Ergo, opiates destroy lives. Were they not here, they would not do so.


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe

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Re: Are opiates really life destroying? [Re: lowbrow]
    #26159987 -

Not every dose of heroin makes you nod off obviously, so is the heroin responsible for the rape or not? You can't answer that question without proving your view to be wrong. Heroin is a drug and not responsible for anything.

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