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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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    #25059948 -

:cop:


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TRUMP 2020

Edited by XUL (03/13/18 09:02 AM)

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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: XUL] * 4
    #25059974 -

Quote:
The crime rate among illegal immigrants in Arizona is twice that of other residents, Attorney General Jeff Sessions said Friday, citing a new report based on conviction data.




This is data on convictions. In Arizona, Joe Arpaio led a racist witch hunt against immigrants, targeting them through racial profiling, and once arrested the justice system was very harsh to them. Arpaio was ordered to stop profiling and committed a federal crime by ignoring the order.

Quote:
Mr. Arpaio, 85, served for 24 years as sheriff of Maricopa County — which includes Phoenix — building a national reputation for harsh conditions in his county jail, and for his campaign against undocumented immigrants.

Mr. Arpaio had touted himself as “America’s toughest sheriff,” making inmates wear pink underwear and serving jail food that at least some prisoners called inedible. He was also at the forefront of the so-called birther movement that aimed to investigate President Barack Obama’s birth certificate.

The criminal conviction grew out of a lawsuit filed a decade ago charging that the sheriff’s office regularly violated the rights of Latinos, stopping people based on racial profiling, detaining them based solely on the suspicion that they were in the country illegally and turning them over to the immigration authorities.

A federal district judge hearing the case ordered Mr. Arpaio in 2011 to stop detaining people based solely on suspicion of their immigration status, when there was no evidence that a state law had been broken. But the sheriff insisted that his tactics were legal and that he would continue employing them.




https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/25/us/politics/joe-arpaio-trump-pardon-sheriff-arizona.html


The fact that Arpaio led a racist campaign against people with brown skin and the justice system was leveraged to be incrediblity punitive, the conviction rates were almost certainly skewed heavily. And again, the report you're citing is based on, that's right, conviction rates.


If you want to look at a broader data set, look at this.

Quote:
While some immigrants certainly commit crimes, decades-worth of data indicate that immigrants commit far less and are far less likely to commit crime than native born Americans. Immigrants are also highly unlikely to commit acts of terrorism.
Here's what studies show:
* Native-born Americans are incarcerated at a much higher rate than immigrants.




* Immigrants were much less likely to commit most violent crimes. Skye Gould/Business Insider

While the US's immigrant population has grown by more than 5 % over the last 25 years, violent crime has dropped dramatically, according to a 2015 report by the American Immigration Council, a

The foreign-born share of the US population has grown from 7.9% in 1990 to 13.1% in 2013. During the same period, FBI data shows that the violent crime rate has dropped 48%. That includes murer, rape, robbery and aggravated assault.

The 2010 American Community Survey found that, over the last three decades, around 1.8% of immigrant males between 18-39 are incarcerated on average, compared with 3.3% of native-born males of the same age.




http://www.businessinsider.com/immigrants-commit-less-crime-than-native-born-americans-trump-speech-2017-3#native-born-americans-are-incarcerated-at-a-much-higher-rate-than-immigrants-1


But nah, let's not look at larger data sets. Let's hunt down brown people, arrest them and convict them at every opportunity, and then say "look here at all the brown people committing crimes, better ship all these people out and build a massive wall!"

Edited by Buffy (03/13/18 07:56 AM)

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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: Buffy]
    #25060003 -

Quote:
the conviction rates were almost certainly skewed heavily.



I don't agree with your premise.


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TRUMP 2020

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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: XUL] * 2
    #25060016 -

You don't have to agree, but Sheriff Joe specifically targeted illegal immigrants.  Of course that's going to yield more arrests of illegal immigrants.  If he specifically targeted catholic school girls, the stats would show that catholic school girls have a higher rate of conviction than the average.

Think of it like this.  If you randomly search 1000 people, a certain percentage will have something on them that is illegal.  If, instead of randomly searching, you search 900 cab drivers and 100 others, about 90% of those found with contraband will be among the cab drivers.  BOOM - You've just made a statistic out of thin air.  Cab drivers are 9 times as likely to have contraband!


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Censoring opposing views since 2014.



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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: XUL] * 1
    #25060026 -



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A society governed in terms of double standards is self-destructive



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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: Enlil]
    #25060032 -

Enlil said:
You don't have to agree, but Sheriff Joe specifically targeted illegal immigrants.  Of course that's going to yield more arrests of illegal immigrants.







The Sheriff is not responsible for convictions.

Further, there is more than one sheriff in the state of Arizona.

Imagine if the Sheriff did not target these criminals? Then we would never know they were criminal at all.

Perhaps other states are similar.



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TRUMP 2020

Edited by XUL (03/13/18 08:18 AM)

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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: XUL] * 3
    #25060040 -

XUL said:
Imagine if the Sheriff did not target these criminals? Then we would never know they were criminal at all.




Now you're starting to understand how white privilege works.  You'll get there eventually.


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Censoring opposing views since 2014.



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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: Enlil]
    #25060046 -

And what if a state, say California, was typically more lenient on illegal immigrants? Or what if they even forgave and expunged past criminal records?

The statistics would essentially be altered.


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TRUMP 2020

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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: XUL]
    #25060051 -

Depends on the statistics you're looking at.


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Censoring opposing views since 2014.



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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: XUL]
    #25060054 -

The study cited on Fox News and in the Washington Times was conducted by John R. Lott Jr. -- a guy about as loony as Alex Jones.  The guy denies climate change exists, blames legalized abortion for higher murder rates, and has been caught publishing studies with falsified research on numerous occasions.


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A society governed in terms of double standards is self-destructive



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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: Enlil]
    #25060055 -

Enlil said:
XUL said:
Imagine if the Sheriff did not target these criminals? Then we would never know they were criminal at all.




Now you're starting to understand how white privilege works.  You'll get there eventually.



Imagine if the Sheriff didn't target white criminals as much as mexicans? Well then, the numbers would look like this.

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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: XUL]
    #25060060 -

The guy who conducted the study you cited has been caught red-handed, on numerous occasions, publishing falsified research data.


In other words, the guy is a charlatan, a fraud, a con artist, a sham!  And the study you cited is total biased nonsense!


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A society governed in terms of double standards is self-destructive



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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: Enlil]
    #25060065 -



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A society governed in terms of double standards is self-destructive



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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: feevers]
    #25060066 -

There is more than one Sheriff in the state of Arizona.

Asclepius said:
The study cited on Fox News and in the Washington Times was conducted by John R. Lott Jr. -- a guy about as loony as Alex Jones.  The guy denies climate change exists, blames legalized abortion for higher murder rates, and has been caught publishing studies with falsified research on numerous occasions.



That doesn't make him loony.

I also agree abortion is murder.


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TRUMP 2020

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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: XUL] * 1
    #25060070 -

XUL said:
There is more than one Sheriff in the state of Arizona.

Asclepius said:
The study cited on Fox News and in the Washington Times was conducted by John R. Lott Jr. -- a guy about as loony as Alex Jones.  The guy denies climate change exists, blames legalized abortion for higher murder rates, and has been caught publishing studies with falsified research on numerous occasions.



That doesn't make him loony.

I also agree abortion is murder.




You misunderstand.  Lott was caught falsifying the research data.  Moreover, when Lott said that abortion increased the murder rates, he was not taking into account the number of aborted fetuses.  He literally thinks that legalized abortion makes adults more violent. 


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A society governed in terms of double standards is self-destructive



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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: Asclepius]
    #25060079 -

The US has a specific native demographic which skews the statistics, there's no way illegals could compete with that crime level. 

So why should we compare illegals with the general population in the first place?  How about we compare illegals to the US population minus the demographic that skews the statistics?

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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: Asclepius]
    #25060080 -

You misunderstand.  Lott was caught falsifying the research data.

Which part of the data in the current study did he falsify?

The methods or results? And specifically, how?


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TRUMP 2020

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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: Asclepius] * 3
    #25060081 -

Lol, this is another Xul thread where he digs his heels in despite plenty of data from which he can draw an alternative conclusion.  A man who can't change his mind in the face of overwhelming evidence isn't worth having a discussion with. 

I'm out.


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Censoring opposing views since 2014.



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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: Enlil]
    #25060084 -

"overwhelming evidence"


Someone posted an article from a website I have never heard in my life.

That is supposed to convince me?

Give me a break.


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TRUMP 2020

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Re: Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born [Re: XUL] * 1
    #25060087 -



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A society governed in terms of double standards is self-destructive



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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


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