Shroomism said:

Bodhi of Ankou said:

War against the enemy they just trained and armed. Funneling money through Saudi Arabian arms dealers, personally training "moderates" over in Syria. None of this ever would happened if America just stayed the fuck out of afghanistan and let the Taliban root out Osama like they said they would of.

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QFT

ISIS/ISIL wouldn't even exist if not for the US.

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zappaisgod said:

Shroomism said:

Bodhi of Ankou said:

War against the enemy they just trained and armed. Funneling money through Saudi Arabian arms dealers, personally training "moderates" over in Syria. None of this ever would happened if America just stayed the fuck out of afghanistan and let the Taliban root out Osama like they said they would of.

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QFT

ISIS/ISIL wouldn't even exist if not for the US.

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This is beyond nonsense.

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Patlal said:

Why do we feel obliged to bomb this place anyway?

Other than oil (which we can get somewhere else) WTF is so important tu us in that region?

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Bodhi of Ankou said:

Its perfectly reasonable. With the multiple governmental overthrows in the region. The funneling of arms directly and through its proxy Saudi Arabia. The millions in intensive military training the states has supplied the last two decades. The invasions and shattering of entire communities. Its completely within reason to say the states has been the primary cause of the inflammation of extremism in the region.

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Bodhi of Ankou said:

Extremism has always existed there, but its never been to the degree it is now. Americas the sole fucking reason theyre so well armed and so big in numbers. Take Iraq for example Saddam Hussien messed with americas oil fields. Overthrown. He was also the only force in the region that stabilized tensions between the opposing sects throughout the nation. His overthrow directly resulted in a massive explosion of violence amoung them as they vied for power. Now little over a decade later ISIS has taken over that region. Had Bush not been so fucking bent on going to war and just eliminated their hold on kuwaits fields ISIS would not have been able to establish a government in the region. The fact that they pulled out without establishing a stable form of governance only made it that much easier for ISIS to roll in. This is a direct result of American foreign policy.

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Bodhi of Ankou said:

There hasnt been a caliphate since the fall of the ottoman empire nearly a century ago. Even then they didnt possess any real degree of power since the 13th century. Where exactly are you getting this info from? Prior to the invasion of Afghanistan there was a large movement within the country to eliminate the taliban, and Iraq was by and large a free and moderate country prior to the fall of Saddam. Invasions driven by conflicts over oil are not indicitive of internal instability. Which is what I was referencing by the term "stable". Up until America eliminated their leaders they were more or less united interally as the baathist party gave absolutely zero fucks about religious differences.

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Quote:

Following the 1979 Iranian revolution, the Iraqis believed the Iranians to be weak, and thus an easy target for their military. This notion proved to be incorrect, and the war lasted for eight years

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Saddam didn't give a shit about religion but that does not mean he was a stabilizing force in the region.  That's absurd.  He started two major wars.

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zappaisgod said:

Saddam didn't give a shit about religion but that does not mean he was a stabilizing force in the region.  That's absurd.  He started two major wars.  And the fact that he was an absolute dictator does not mean they were "more or less united".  They were utterly cowed just as the people of North Korea are

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zappaisgod said:

Bodhi of Ankou said:

Its perfectly reasonable. With the multiple governmental overthrows in the region. The funneling of arms directly and through its proxy Saudi Arabia. The millions in intensive military training the states has supplied the last two decades. The invasions and shattering of entire communities. Its completely within reason to say the states has been the primary cause of the inflammation of extremism in the region.

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Extremism in the region has existed since long before the US.  There is a reason adults who previously occupied  the Oval Office  didn't bitch about the dictators.  Obama shit the bed with his redline for Assad and by attempting to arm any of the Syrian rebels.  There are no moderates fighting.  If you are fighting you are by definition an extremist.

The vast expanse of nonsense of the crowd that blames America for every fucking bad thing that happens is mindnumbing in scope.  Do you know why these ISIS scum exist?  Their fucking nutjob religion and their desire to impose their will and laws on everybody in the world.  They want to bring back the caliphate.  Why don't you go over there and get a taste of what life would be like if we don't stop them in their tracks.  Kill them all

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elax420 said:

zappaisgod said:

Bodhi of Ankou said:

There hasnt been a caliphate since the fall of the ottoman empire nearly a century ago. Even then they didnt possess any real degree of power since the 13th century. Where exactly are you getting this info from? Prior to the invasion of Afghanistan there was a large movement within the country to eliminate the taliban, and Iraq was by and large a free and moderate country prior to the fall of Saddam. Invasions driven by conflicts over oil are not indicitive of internal instability. Which is what I was referencing by the term "stable". Up until America eliminated their leaders they were more or less united interally as the baathist party gave absolutely zero fucks about religious differences.

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This post is so fucked up i don’t even know where to start. There is a major difference between a Caliph and Sultan. The Ottomans weren’t even arabic, nor did they control the Hijaz for very long, so the sultans claim to the title caliph is a weak one at best. The ottomans were at their strongest from 1400-1700 by 1200 they hadn’t even taken Constantinople yet. They were also relatively secular, and for the most part respected the local customs and laws of the lands they occupied.

Hell the only reason the state of Saudi Arabia exists is because the Wahhabis thought the Ottomans were profligate.

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