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OfflinePhluck
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Why do you trust your brain?
    #1581007 - 05/27/03 11:35 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Something I've noticed about people is this: They trust their brains too much. Way too much.

For instance, people seem to be baffled by the idea that their subconcious is working separately from their concious thoughts. The notion that their brains might be doing something they don't know about is frightening or something.

I remember talking to someone about their beer preferences. They said they really liked Brand X, and hated Brand Y. Both brands were regular commercial lagers, with extremely similar tastes, and I strongly suspected that the only reason my friend preferred the one brand was because the design of the label was more appealing. When I mentioned that, he got defensive and told me I had no idea what I was talking about as I wasn't him and couldn't possibly know what he was thinking. So, I gave him a blind taste test, and guess what? He couldn't tell the difference at all.

Your brain is working this way all the time. The vast majority of your preferences, prejudices and opinions, no matter who you are, aren't created for the reasons you think they are.

People have a whole lot of trouble accepting this, nobody wants to believe that their choices are being made for them by an unseen part of their brain, but they are, and unless you can accept this, you're operating on some false assumptions.

Also, there are people who trust their dreams, visions and hallucinations. When you take drugs and a serpent tells you that God is a huge computer created by an ancient race, or whatever, why would you believe that? First of all, there are people everywhere believing contradicting things for the same reasons. Even if you use the rationale that all ideas are truth in some sense, why are you giving this idea more credit than anything else your brain farts out? I'm imagining a machine that processes sticks of butter and buttons, and turns them into monkeys... is that machine real now?

Your brain has the ability to make you believe anything. You could hallucinate people speaking and interacting with you. You could hallucinate the universe imploding, or aliens abducting you, or god granting you mystical powers, but why do you take it seriously. Could it not just as easily be just something your brain farted out?


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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Offlinelucid
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: Phluck]
    #1581085 - 05/27/03 12:14 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

>Why do you trust your brain?
to avoid pain...
I have to trust some of my judgements/reasoning/reationality/feelings/sense in order to make choices. The result of these choices affect me... they cause peace, pain or pleasure.
If I trusted nothing in my own mind, I would freak out...utter chaos...
the subconcious can be affected/influenced by the concious, we arn't at the mercy of the subconcious as some would believe (although it affects conciousness and vice verse)...


--------------------
"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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OfflineMAIA
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: Phluck]
    #1581091 - 05/27/03 12:17 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Well, i think people usually have to use their brains to come up with something for their life, i mean if you can't trust the mechanism that creates the idea of self to understand this reality (brain) , what else can you trust ? Your liver ? Mine is evil and must be punished .... but not my brain, "my precious" !!!

MAIA


--------------------
Spiritual being, living a human experience ... The Shroomery Mandala



Use, do not abuse; neither abstinence nor excess ever renders man happy.
Voltaire


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: Phluck]
    #1581095 - 05/27/03 12:20 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

I trust my brain, it is just yours that I am suspicious of.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: lucid]
    #1581098 - 05/27/03 12:22 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Okay, well, obviously you have to trust your brain to a certain extent, but why do you trust it when it starts telling you things that are bizarre or implausible? Why do you trust it when it's telling you things that contradict everyone else's perceptions? We know even a healthy mind can construct bizarre ideas and fantasies, so why are we so quick to buy into them? Are people so insecure they can't question themselves?


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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Offlinelucid
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: Phluck]
    #1581149 - 05/27/03 12:45 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

>but why do you trust it when it starts telling you things that are bizarre or >implausible?
I don't trust it when it judges things as being bizarre or implausible...

>Why do you trust it when it's telling you things that contradict everyone else's >perceptions?
I don't trust everyone elses perceptions (since it's comming from their brains - which according to u might not be trustworthy) and I don't trust my brain when it thinks it knows everyone elses perceptions...

>We know even a healthy mind can construct bizarre ideas and fantasies, so >why are we so quick to buy into them?
I don't trust my mind's inertia, so I must act quickly...

>Are people so insecure they can't question themselves?
I question myself all the time... like why am I doing this ?
TRUST NO ONE !!! ESPECIALLY YOURSELF !!!! it's all a LIE... aaaAAAA...
stay calm... the people in white coats will be here soon...
But they tell me it's a passing phase and they'll release me from
this place soon  :crazy:


--------------------
"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


Edited by lucid (05/27/03 12:47 PM)


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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: Phluck]
    #1581258 - 05/27/03 01:29 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

why did you trust your brain in making this post?


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE


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Offlinenubious
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: lucid]
    #1581259 - 05/27/03 01:29 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

People are nothing but the result of experience - everything you experience in your life time be it beer labels or haullucinagenic elf people shapes who you are, what your morals are, and the general outcome of the person you project to everyone else in your life. If something you believe isn't the standard of beliefs, whoopdie fuckin' do - you're comfortable with them, and providing they don't hurt anyone (including yourself), then what's the harm of believing things like that?

I don't mean to come across as demeaning you as a person or your post as a whole, but Could it not just as easily be just something your brain farted out? sounds like a copout excuse for something you don't fully understand.

People have a whole lot of trouble accepting this, nobody wants to believe that their choices are being made for them by an unseen part of their brain, but they are, and unless you can accept this, you're operating on some false assumptions.

Choice - what funny word... What is choice? Is choice the options towards your next move in time playing in your head making you believe you have options of what you can do? Is choice just a delusion of our knowledge of possibility playing out on something we can't come to accept - that we're all just random molecules colliding and responding to everything around us? Think about this next time you find yourself in an addiction, and try to tell yourself you can't overcome it. Everything around you is a learning tool to help you evolve - whether you evolve or plateau is nothing but the result of negative or positive stimulous (sp?) passed through that central cluster of electrons in your head. Choice.. Hah.. what a funny word...


--------------------
No one knows the worth of innocence till he knows it is gone forever, and that money can't buy it back. Not the saint, but the sinner that repenteth, is he to whom the full length and breadth, and height and depth, of life's meaning is revealed. Good and evil loose all objective meaning and are seen as equally necessary and contrasting elements in the masterpiece that is the universe.


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Offlinenubious
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: nubious]
    #1581262 - 05/27/03 01:30 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

*replied as to add thread to favorites - sorry for the post*


--------------------
No one knows the worth of innocence till he knows it is gone forever, and that money can't buy it back. Not the saint, but the sinner that repenteth, is he to whom the full length and breadth, and height and depth, of life's meaning is revealed. Good and evil loose all objective meaning and are seen as equally necessary and contrasting elements in the masterpiece that is the universe.


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OfflineGrav
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: lucid]
    #1581275 - 05/27/03 01:32 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

I don't trust my mind's inertia, so I must act quickly...
hah i like that


I trust my brain because I have to... Me and him have to keep a friendly relationship for quite some time or things could get ugly again. We used to play awful tricks on each other, but finally called a truce, and we're working together now.

I think a trick is to ask yourself "Do i want to believe this? or... Do I believe this?"
seek structure and stability... there is no right and wrong here.. just physics.

it helps to worm out the desire, then you can begin playing with a full deck.
you can then honestly ask yourself 'Where am I now?' and 'Where do I go from here?', no more if's and varied circumstances... you take control. It's YOUR brain.

and if your brain is dependent on other people than it definately can't be trusted. It could turn on you at any second!


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: Phluck]
    #1581380 - 05/27/03 02:04 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

I trust my brain, because time and time again it has proven itself correct. I think it knows what it's talking about, most of the time anyway.

Beyond that...I understand exactly where you are coming from  :smirk:

I don't trust my senses. Not one bit.

My mind is a different matter.


--------------------
You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: trendal]
    #1581407 - 05/27/03 02:14 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

rofl phluck, what do you suggest one trusts if not their own mind?


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE


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Offlinedebianlinux
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: Strumpling]
    #1581465 - 05/27/03 02:38 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

I agree with part of Phluck's original post. This world has gone image mad. Some/Many people are completely controlled by imagery. It becomes rather obvious if you take the time to analyse people's actions vs. motives. The blind taste test is a good example. Personally, I have transcended the majority of"brand-association" type of thinking but the fact of the matter is our brains DO have predictable reactions to certain types/styles of imagery. In a world of overstimulation it is impossible to say that your "choices" are not dramatically influenced by advertisement in it's many forms. Someone above made the great suggestion to simply ask yourself why you believe something or why you chose to believe something. Once can condition their mind/brain/conciousness not to "filter-out" influential media but to see it for what it "really" is. This is why I can barely bear to watch any television. I mean I see actors on stage reciting lines and the lines are carefully constructed to convey "persuasive" messages. This isn't so bad when you are constantly aware of this but I have reached the sad conclusion that most people are not.


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Anonymous

Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: debianlinux]
    #1581478 - 05/27/03 02:42 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

nihilism for the masses


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: Strumpling]
    #1581516 - 05/27/03 03:01 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Do you think the highly-indoctrinated marines and army rangers hell-bent on killing "towel-heads" question their programming? Hell no! They believe that the "patriotic" thoughts originate from them and were not impressed upon them.

Ever thought how ordinary eyeglasses are nerdy, yet sunglasses are cool?

Ever thought how women generally do not prefer bald guys yet would rather their men's face be bald (no beards - please!) ?

American guys, what do you think of a women with hairy legs and unshaved arms?

Most will tell you, "I think that it is gross or not at all sexy." Not 1 in 1 10,000 will say "I have been culturally brainwashed to hold the belief that it is undesirable."


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: Strumpling]
    #1581735 - 05/27/03 04:15 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Well, what I mean is, you have to learn to recognize, accept, and work around the flaws in your mind. You must also realize that it's impossible to avoid some of these flaws.

So, don't accept everything your brain tells you. That's pretty much my point.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflineTeknoJunkie
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: Phluck]
    #1581833 - 05/27/03 04:54 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

I like to perceive the brain as a tool. It is part of myself, but it does not define who I am. It can help shape my opinions and ideas, but when it does, I am conciously making the choice to use my brain and 'feel out' which choice is best for me at the moment, whether I'm deciding on what kind of ketchup to use or what shirt to wear. And if I know that I'm only wearing that shirt because I look more 'raveresque' or beautiful to my husband, I KNOW that. I am conciously aware of my decision. And if I have made it, I more often than not feel comfortable with it, even if it is silly and I know it....I just smile and laugh at myself and then realize that I WANT to look more 'raveresque'.

The world is full of an indelible amount of programming. The thing we have to realize is ourselves, and to break down all of the programmed nonsensical crap that gets put into our heads either by ourselves or others' concepts. To actually stop. - . and listen..to our true feelings on the subject, whatever it may be. Whence upon understanding, you can become the action, not the reaction.


Awesome thread.


--------------------
:oogle:  :pacman: :tripping:


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Offlinejohnnyfive
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: Phluck]
    #1581978 - 05/27/03 05:56 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

For instance, people seem to be baffled by the idea that their subconcious is working separately from their concious thoughts.




True

Quote:

So, I gave him a blind taste test, and guess what? He couldn't tell the difference at all.




Its all in the commericals, they are designed to appeal to different people. Dispite there being no difference in the brands.


Quote:

Also, there are people who trust their dreams, visions and hallucinations. When you take drugs and a serpent tells you that God is a huge computer created by an ancient race, or whatever, why would you believe that?





lol if this is implying to what i said awhile back, first off, when i said that phluck, no snake ever actually appeared to me and actually told me that. This is something i became aware of when i was reading the bible. The fall of man

Quote:

Your brain has the ability to make you believe anything. You could hallucinate people speaking and interacting with you. You could hallucinate the universe imploding, or aliens abducting you, or god granting you mystical powers, but why do you take it seriously. Could it not just as easily be just something your brain farted out?





Heres a good articale found at trip magazine: http://www.tripzine.com/articles.asp?id=lifelong

Ok now phluck, ive read alot of your posts in the last year, and you are a very skeptical person as i can see. First off the internet is not a collection of lies but a collection of the imagination (its not to say theres junk on the internet, but i just think you need to trust yourself in commen sense judgment, then agian what is "commen"). People are inherently good, unlike most would believe. Do you believe that what you see in waking reality is all there is? Have you ever used a psychedelic? If so, usually a psychedelics open ones mind dispite how closed it maybe? So your saying don't trust yourself, well then you must be trusting some sort of external source, the tv, other people?

Ive said ALOT of crazy shit in my days, how can one believe in some of the shit ive said, NWO, evolution, aliens. All i can say i don't know, you just need to find your way. I can't tell you the truth, because the truth is only true to that person. Truth is in the eye of the beholder. It just makes sense to me. Im taking everything, i mean everything, and putting it into a puzzle, and saying "What THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH THIS WORLD", and just try to figure it out.

When i was young, i often said to myself, "This has got to be a sick joke, this can't be life; this can't be reality" "I wish everyone would just come out and say, haha, this is all a prank we've been playing on you, don't you think its funny?" Ya know ive actually said shit like this when i was young.



--------------------
And the gameshow host rings the buzzer (brrnnntt) oh and now you get a face full of face!


Edited by johnnyfive (05/27/03 11:28 PM)


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OfflineShroomMind
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: johnnyfive]
    #1582571 - 05/27/03 09:54 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

your ego and your logic are lying to you. get rid of them.


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OfflineGrav
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Re: Why do you trust your brain? [Re: ShroomMind]
    #1582757 - 05/27/03 10:42 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

desires motivate relentlessly until you accept that they're just figments of your mind and that you only choose to desire them
they do not choose you
the power is always yours, the hard part is accepting it


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