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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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InvisibleeMotionALLmotion
DivineeMotive....

Registered: 02/28/05
Posts: 759
Loc: The Symphony of Lights......
Re: Theory to explain the manifestation of visual hallucinations [Re: Psychoactive1984]
    #4096355 - 04/25/05 05:42 PM (19 years, 2 months ago)

I should prolly~ go to somone else's house in case I accidentally make it dissappear....    :shocked:  :tongue:

I was just wondering if anyone had tried the combo~....  It would seem that sleep dep has more of a visual effect on me than a substance....  Since the non-positive flavor of personality was noted, it doesn't sound like a good idea....  Maybe a little meditation and sleep would be better suited....   

:yawn:  :sleep:  :heartpump:  :sun:

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OfflineOmEgAx1
Stranger
Registered: 04/11/05
Posts: 120
Last seen: 17 years, 7 months
Re: Theory to explain the manifestation of visual hallucinations [Re: eMotionALLmotion]
    #4098198 - 04/26/05 08:38 AM (19 years, 2 months ago)

Im thinking, due to lack of sleep, your concious thought processes are being reduced while the sleep thought processes are trying to kick in, so a hallucinogen, which I figure boosts the dream state of mind more than the concious state of mind, might seem as though you would basically have a waking dream with normal thought patterns not being able to really grasp physical existance anymore... maybe something similar... it would be an interesting experiment...

:laugh:

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OfflineOmEgAx1
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Posts: 120
Last seen: 17 years, 7 months
Re: Theory to explain the manifestation of visual hallucinations [Re: OmEgAx1]
    #4101338 - 04/27/05 12:57 AM (19 years, 2 months ago)

But back on topic...

Does anyone have any ideas to refute my ideas?

To support the theory?

To expand upon it?

Personally I dont feel this topic is one worth dying, but even if it is, you should let me know :P

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InvisibleeMotionALLmotion
DivineeMotive....

Registered: 02/28/05
Posts: 759
Loc: The Symphony of Lights......
Re: Theory to explain the manifestation of visual hallucinations [Re: OmEgAx1]
    #4101420 - 04/27/05 01:20 AM (19 years, 2 months ago)

I would like to know what sound Frequencies cause what brain waves states, and how long each frequency has to be held to achieve the mental "state"....    I would like to try an experiment with frequencies/brain wave states, and visualisation meditative techniques....  Perhaps I will have to do my own digging, but if anyone knows any good sources of info, I would be greatful....    Perhaps I can expand this topic further upon my "experiments"....    :grin:
.
I think this topic is worthy....  :heart:


:sun:


--------------------
Uni-VersALL      MasterPeace
eMotive  :sun: Divinity NowThere Infinity :sun:  eMelody

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OfflineOmEgAx1
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Registered: 04/11/05
Posts: 120
Last seen: 17 years, 7 months
Re: Theory to explain the manifestation of visual hallucinations [Re: eMotionALLmotion]
    #4101738 - 04/27/05 03:09 AM (19 years, 2 months ago)

Theres this one program...

Its called BrainWave Generator

it claims to produce sound frequencies to produce the desired state in a trip...

Ive seen sources that claim it to work...

You should check it out!

http://www.bwgen.com/

Ive yet to try it myself tripping, but even without tripping, certain sound pattern presets make me space out really hard. Others simply annoy me.

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Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
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Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,934
Re: Theory to explain the manifestation of visual hallucinations [Re: OmEgAx1]
    #4101871 - 04/27/05 06:20 AM (19 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

OmEgAx1 said:
...
[ snipped ]
...
So if your dream state is switched on, which creates images from the static we see, and your concious thought is still on as well, you could infer that the process for visual perception combines the ideas of the dream visuals with that of the concious field of view, and the blending of these 2 visual inputs bring what is a hallucination. With very high doses of hallucinogens however, the concious visual field is superceded by the dream visual field, losing all sense of reality, but concious thought is still fully functioning, while a very intense state of dream is also activated. This would explain the effects of different potency of hallucinogens to the effects it has.

One idea to explain the reasoning for different forms of visual hallucinations with diferent hallucinogens would simply be its chemical makeup affecting different areas of the thought processes and different states of dream basically.

I am, however, not suggesting that a trip is simply your dream mode turned on, but im suggesting it is a very large portion of the mental processes happening during a trip.

...[ snipped ] ...




Vision is made of particles smoothed together, our eyeball vision is pretty low res compared to what is seen by the brain, but eyeball data is essentially particles of arranged color in sequences over time (not static as such). (also note the quiver of the eye is used by the brain to compute infill smoothing information)

I agree that different images smoothed together contributes to hallucination, but have often mentioned that it is because image fragments fade more slowly (under influence of entheogen or in dreams), when the smoothing kicks in it has material from more than one moment. dream mode is like this.

I think that the chemistry of various drugs affects the content of hallucination much less than supposed. set and setting are more important. (expectation is part of that) and some act more slowly or last longer.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:

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OfflineOmEgAx1
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Re: Theory to explain the manifestation of visual hallucinations [Re: redgreenvines]
    #4103592 - 04/27/05 04:39 PM (19 years, 1 month ago)

Well thats the kind of input im looking for...

So the theory could simply be modified to remove the ideas of visual static and include the idea of the particle smoothing.

In any case, the idea of the dream state being activated with its visuals with the inclusion of concious thought and sight being processed all together seems to me to still hold true.

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Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
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Registered: 04/08/04
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Re: Theory to explain the manifestation of visual hallucinations [Re: OmEgAx1]
    #4103804 - 04/27/05 05:48 PM (19 years, 1 month ago)

yes new sensory vision, new hearing, and recalled memories are equally sense data to the cortex, all contribute in forming gestalts or Frames of now, and these frames get stacked when entheogen effect starts to slow down the fading away, but not the arising.
what gets smoothed together can be fragments of vision with pieces of memory and snippets of sound.
quite a miraculous blender you got there!


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:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:

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OfflineOmEgAx1
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Re: Theory to explain the manifestation of visual hallucinations [Re: redgreenvines]
    #4205605 - 05/22/05 12:47 AM (19 years, 1 month ago)

Has this already been discussed or are you comming up with this now?

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Offlinecrunchytoast
oppositional

Registered: 04/07/05
Posts: 1,133
Loc: aporia
Last seen: 17 years, 2 months
Re: Theory to explain the manifestation of visual hallucinations [Re: OmEgAx1]
    #4205684 - 05/22/05 01:25 AM (19 years, 1 month ago)

personally my gut instinct is that brain wave types are a gross understanding of brain processes. yes dreams and tripping have something in common, but i personally dont think its because tripping activates dreaming, but that tripping activates something that itself is usually activated by dreaming.

still, your idea is more parsimonious. very good, clean hypothesis seems to me.

can you make a prediction based on it, that you can test?

ps. in my limited experience with the combo slight sleep deprivation seems to potentiate salvia


--------------------
"consensus on the nature of equilibrium is usually established by periodic conflict." -henry kissinger

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Offlinenewjon
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Registered: 02/12/05
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Last seen: 19 years, 17 days
Re: Theory to explain the manifestation of visual hallucinations [Re: crunchytoast]
    #4205830 - 05/22/05 03:07 AM (19 years, 1 month ago)

re:TV
some nice theories there, but don't forget that other countries have TV too!
it is about control, but the driving force is money, pure and simple.  After all, you can have power without money, but you can't have money without power.  hence, get the money, and you get the power as a side effect :smile:
And what do they use that power for? why, making more moeny of course! I can't believe they're so blind to the never-ending circle they've put themselves on.  It's an empty, numb circle, there's no real good feelings there.  I have a suspicion, that greed is its own punishment...

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Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
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Re: Theory to explain the manifestation of visual hallucinations [Re: newjon]
    #4207021 - 05/22/05 03:05 PM (19 years, 1 month ago)

the mental blender mixes up stuffthat would ahve faded away sooner and never been noticed


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:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:

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OfflineOmEgAx1
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Re: Theory to explain the manifestation of visual hallucinations [Re: redgreenvines]
    #4270679 - 06/08/05 03:23 AM (19 years, 20 days ago)

Newjon, thats a nice theory you have there, but imo its not quite accurate, money does bring power, and both can bring happiness. Power can be used to make more money, but the effort to make more money once you have alot of power is not really as much of an issue, you simply have them. Control over others always brings satisfaction weather you like it or not, even you like it, subconciously or conciously. Money always brings happiness, it can easily buy happiness in many forms, and to say those individuals are punished for greed is rediculas, when the truth is they laugh at regular individuals who have been BRAINWASHED by people with POWER and MONEY to think that POWER and MONEY does not necessarily equal happiness, just some more of what you are programmed to think but dont even realize it. Just like you didnt realize while you were in school that you are really being taught OBEDIENCE and to be SUBSERVANT to people with POWER and MONEY, hmm? Ohh and who set up the school system? Ohh right, the people with POWER and MONEY during the industrial age to train OBEDIENT factory workers. You think those factory workers were more happy than the factory owners?

You gotta be outta your mind.

Your thoughts are nice and all, but simply put they dont hold up, and once you have power and money you will realize it.

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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


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