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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Paradoxes of cognition
    #14855341 -

If nothing exists, then there still exists nothingness - an all encompassing truth.

If nothing is constant then there remains change - constant and eternal.

The past and the future exist -but- The present is all that ever exists..

any more ideas? any suggestions? any counter attacks?


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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: Noteworthy]
    #14855391 -

Don't bother thinking anything that you have to remember.

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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: Noteworthy]
    #14855455 -

half of one / six dozen of the other.


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: Icelander]
    #14856238 -

:archiebunker:


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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: Noteworthy] * 1
    #14856246 -

Sound more like paradoxes of language to me.  (which would result in a paradox of cognition in as much as language frames our cognition)

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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: DieCommie]
    #14856288 -

Language is definately a part of it.


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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: Noteworthy]
    #14856289 -

Noteworthy said:
If nothing exists, then there still exists nothingness - an all encompassing truth.

If nothing is constant then there remains change - constant and eternal.

The past and the future exist -but- The present is all that ever exists..

any more ideas? any suggestions? any counter attacks?



Any idea is based on time. Without time, conceptually, it would be impossible to create an idea that is coherent(rationally associated phenomena).

An example of an idea that is coherent is, I walk to the store and take the bridge over the river.

An example of an idea that is incoherent is; maynonaise self destruction grasshopers.

Thought is merly a way to understand, organize, mold the present moment.

Thought can compartmentalize the present moment, albeit subjectively.


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if you ever feel lost, just remember, life is not a journey, it is entertainment, all 4 fun...


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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: Noteworthy]
    #14860444 -

Noteworthy said:
If nothing exists, then there still exists nothingness - an all encompassing truth.



'nothing' is not a 'something'. 'Nothing' does not have the property of existence. 'Nothing' is a concept, but in fact there is something, so 'nothing' is only a concept, not a description of any reality.

Quote:
If nothing is constant then there remains change - constant and eternal.


Yes, if everything changes then everything changes. Also if nothing is slow then everything is fast, and if everything is big then nothing is small. These statements are not conclusions based on anything, they are just statements repeated twice in different forms.

I don't know why you added the constant and eternal part.

Quote:
The past and the future exist -but- The present is all that ever exists..



What exactly do you mean, 'the past and the future exist'? You use present tense exist, but the past existed and the future will possibly exist, but they do not exist now. Only the memory of the past can exist, and the imagination of the future.

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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: AlphaFalfa]
    #14860461 -

Quote:





An example of an idea that is coherent is, I walk to the store and take the bridge over the river.



[



so where did the bridge go after you took it over the river?

(fun with grammer)


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when i think of something interesting, i'll type it in here someday.

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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: Freedom]
    #14860511 -

Freedom said:
Noteworthy said:
If nothing exists, then there still exists nothingness - an all encompassing truth.



'nothing' is not a 'something'. 'Nothing' does not have the property of existence. 'Nothing' is a concept, but in fact there is something, so 'nothing' is only a concept, not a description of any reality.

Quote:
If nothing is constant then there remains change - constant and eternal.


Yes, if everything changes then everything changes. Also if nothing is slow then everything is fast, and if everything is big then nothing is small. These statements are not conclusions based on anything, they are just statements repeated twice in different forms.

I don't know why you added the constant and eternal part.

Quote:
The past and the future exist -but- The present is all that ever exists..



What exactly do you mean, 'the past and the future exist'? You use present tense exist, but the past existed and the future will possibly exist, but they do not exist now. Only the memory of the past can exist, and the imagination of the future.


if nothing is not something then you would not be able to have a concept of it. Nothing is something - it is the space between and around things that exist. It could be that only the nothingness exists, and things are actually shadows, holes in the reality. Inside/outside, the distinction is merely perspective, both exist equally in order to define the other.


It is a paradox for nothing to be constant, because if change is constant, then something is constant.

As for the past/future stuff, I would agree with you, for I think that the present is all that exists, and that the future and past are merely creations of our mind.


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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: Noteworthy]
    #14860515 -

"it is the space between and around things that exist. "

WHERE?

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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: xFrockx]
    #14860793 -

xFrockx said:
"it is the space between and around things that exist. "

WHERE?


Everywhere, because nothingness is only the absence of something else besides what exists at a specific place and time.
As I see it at least.


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Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'

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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #14860835 -

You say it is everywhere, and yet somehow I see none of it. Where is your evidence?

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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: xFrockx]
    #14860941 -

xFrockx said:
You say it is everywhere, and yet somehow I see none of it. Where is your evidence?


That you don't see it is part of the evidence. Something that exists as nonexistence is simply not there :smile:
Sorry, I :heart: this paradox.


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Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'

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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #14860946 -

Oh, is that so?

Well I'm going to postulate that God exists, but he is invisible. So the proof is right there, you don't see God do you?

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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: xFrockx]
    #14860955 -

xFrockx said:
Oh, is that so?

Well I'm going to postulate that God exists, but he is invisible. So the proof is right there, you don't see God do you?


Hehe, nothingness is defined as non existence. A definition is some form of bringing something into existence. It's the existence of the nonexistence, as long there's context for existing, like a nonexisting tree on a field. I can proof that the tree doesn't exist. So it is non-existentially existent :smile:


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Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #14860974 -

"Hehe, nothingness is defined as non existence. "

That's one definition. I'll go with it.

"A definition is some form of bringing something into existence."

I don't see how anything brings anything else into existence. Everything comes from somewhere.

"It's the existence of the nonexistence"

Either it exists or it doesn't. If it doesn't then it doesn't.

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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: xFrockx]
    #14861380 -

non-existant things dont exist.

nothingness does exist though. It exists whenever there is something.

The time and place of nothingness is the same as that of somethingness.

If you take the boundary of 'matter' (or 'what matters'), you find that each side of the boundary is a something different. Theres the thing and the nothing around it.

This can be seen on different layers - with particles vs vacuum, or solid vs gas (eg. my fridge is 'empty'), or intelligence vs unintelligence (eg. theres nothing in there), significant vs insigificant (eg. bob offers greg a half-empty beer. Greg says 'theres nothing in there')

Always there is SOMETHING there.

Of course then we can imagine the possible situation if the universe ended or before it even began, where nothing existed at all. Unsure whether our intuitions on this matter are worth considering, but we can at least know that if we talk about it, it must be something. Even if it is imaginary.


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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: Noteworthy]
    #14861929 -

Noteworthy said:
if nothing is not something then you would not be able to have a concept of it.


Incorrect. It's possible that nothing exists only as a concept, which I think is pretty accurate. "Nothingness" exists in the same way as unicorns, dragons, and god -- as a myth.

Quote:
Nothing is something - it is the space between and around things that exist.


Nope. "Nothing" is a convenience word, i.e. we might say "there's nothing in that room" when we really mean "there's nothing of interest in that room, but there are trillions of air molecules and some photons." A perfect vacuum has never been observed and is impossible to create.

Also, saying "nothing is something" is a contradiction in terms, as ridiculous as saying "1 = 0" or "my guitar is a flute."

Quote:
It could be that only the nothingness exists, and things are actually shadows, holes in the reality. Inside/outside, the distinction is merely perspective, both exist equally in order to define the other.


:confused: What do you mean by "holes in the reality?" Where is your support for any of this speculation?


Quote:
As for the past/future stuff, I would agree with you, for I think that the present is all that exists, and that the future and past are merely creations of our mind.


What is "our mind?"


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Re: Paradoxes of cognition [Re: NetDiver]
    #14862212 -

If nothing is just a concept then so is something.

Everything is a concept. as is the word everything.

things are the objects of thought. Things have parts/properties. Objective is a class of concepts - those which are true for everybody.

Yes saying nothing is something is a contradiction. This thread is called paradoxes of cognition!

As for the holes in reality thing, I think you are over-interpreting this. A hole is just a good example - it is something, but it is actually the absence of something else.

what is your mind?


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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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