Home | Community | Message Board


This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   Mushroom-Hut Mono Tub Substrate   MagicBag.co Certified Organic All-In-One Grow Bags by Magic Bag   OlympusMyco.com Olympus Myco Bulk Substrate   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
OfflineJackal
Well Versed In Etiquette
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/16/02
Posts: 4,576
Last seen: 1 month, 7 days
Secrets Of An Acid Head - An Essay
    #1442109 - 04/09/03 06:57 AM (21 years, 5 months ago)

Tripping on hallucinogenic drugs reveals more about our inner selves than the hippies ever bargained for, says Dana Mackenzie


IN A DORM ROOM dimly lit by a lava lamp, a freshman awaits the beginning of his first LSD trip. Slowly, the walls come alive and begin to dance with colour. And then he sees whirling spirals of stars that disappear into the distance. A network of cobwebs that grows across the room. An infinite subway tube, surrounded by fluorescent lights...

Across campus, his science teachers experience their own psychedelic visions?but without resorting to illegal mind-altering substances. Jack Cowan, a mathematician and neuroscientist at the University of Chicago, has built a neural network so powerful it can trip out. His computer's hallucinations match with almost spooky accuracy the visions of acid trippers, shamans and seers?visions that have always been interpreted as revelations from a transcendental consciousness.

Now, after more than two decades, Cowan and his team think they have found where hallucinations really come from. And there's nothing transcendental about it. An LSD trip is really a journey into the brain, says Cowan. "It's just the innate tendency of the brain to make patterns when it goes unstable."

Cowan's goal is to find out how the brain makes sense of the visible world?not when we're tripping, but under ordinary circumstances. In the process, he may learn how it breaks down in other extraordinary conditions, such as migraine headaches. Hallucinations could even offer a route to the more profound depths of the mind, to emotions and conscious thought.

Hallucinations seem to come in an endless variety, as individual as dreams. So it seems improbable that they can even be categorised, never mind calculated by a computer. But in the 1920s, Heinrich Kl?ver, a neuroscientist at the University of Chicago, discovered they did indeed fall into a number of distinct categories. Kl?ver interviewed dozens of people who had taken the drug mescaline, and even took it himself. Keeping a commendably straight head, Kl?ver eventually saw patterns in the patterns.

In the earliest stages of a trip, most subjects reported seeing abstract, geometrical images. Other writers have noted the same thing. "The typical mescaline or lysergic acid experiment begins with perceptions of coloured, moving, living geometrical forms," wrote Aldous Huxley in 1954 in Heaven and hell. "In time, the pure geometry becomes concrete, and the visionary perceives, not patterns, but patterned things, such as carpets, coverings, mosaics." Kl?ver classified these patterns into four types or "form-constants": tunnels, spirals, cobwebs and honeycombs.

Unlike Huxley and Kl?ver, Cowan has never sampled the drugs he studies. "I feel bad about it," he says. "I have to rely on all these reports in the literature." He also hears plenty of personal accounts from students and others who attend his lectures. "Some people see these illusions when they're going to sleep or waking up," Cowan says. "People have seen them after taking anaesthetics. People claim to see them when they meditate, or have so-called near-death experiences." Cowan believes that the "tunnel of light" illusion commonly reported in near-death experiences is simply the first of Kl?ver's four form-constants.

Cowan was turned on to the study of hallucinations from an unexpected direction. In 1977 he was working on pattern formation with graduate student Bard Ermentrout when he stumbled across illustrations of Kl?ver's patterns. "We saw immediately that the hallucination patterns were similar to convection patterns," says Cowan.

The convection of hot water involves a delicate interplay of forces. When a pan of water is heated from below, the hot water at the bottom is more buoyant than the water above, and tries to rise. If the temperature difference is not too great, the lower layer sheds its heat by diffusion before it can rise very far, so the water remains stable. But at a certain critical temperature, diffusion is not enough to cool off the lower layer, so plumes of hot water start to rise. Between each pair of rising plumes, cold water descends, so a pattern spontaneously emerges: rolling tubes of water that form parallel stripes, or square or hexagonal cells. Cowan guessed that hallucinations must also be spontaneous patterns of activity produced by two competing forces?this time in the brain. One, like the water's buoyancy, tends to excite neurons while the other, like the diffusion of heat, tends to calm them down. He speculated that this could happen in the primary visual cortex, sometimes called V1. This is a layer of tissue two to three millimetres thick at the back of the brain which serves as the first layer of processing for images gathered by the retina.

To test their idea, Ermentrout and Cowan developed a mathematical model of V1 and gave it a dose of virtual LSD. Their model reflects the fact that each neuron tends to excite its neighbours and inhibit those a little farther away. Then when the eye sees a large, featureless object, like a big red blob of paint, every neuron in the middle of the image will be excited by nearby neurons and inhibited by those farther away. So it receives no net input from other neurons. It's the brain's way of saying, "There's nothing interesting happening here."

LSD upsets this balance. One of the effects of the drug is to allow neurons to fire when there is nothing in the visual field. Ordinarily, a neuron won't start firing unless the input from the retina and from neighbours exceeds a critical threshold. This ensures that if a neuron fires by mistake, it won't convince its neighbours to fire and the activity dies out. But drugs can lower the threshold?LSD does it by making the brainstem secrete less of the inhibitory chemical serotonin. If the threshold is lowered far enough, then excitation starts to beat inhibition, and spontaneous waves of activity form in the brain. It's like turning up the heat under the pan of water. The first patterns that form will be the same ones that are seen in the water: parallel stripes, checkerboards and hexagons.

So why don't LSD users see parallel stripes across their visual field? Because these patterns are in the cortex, not the retina, Cowan reasoned. A lot of cortical real estate is devoted to objects close to the centre of the field of vision, where our sight is sharp, while relatively little is used for peripheral vision. Mapped onto the cortex, an ordinary scene is grossly distorted: objects near the centre loom large, taking up most of the brain area. When you run this distortion backwards, evenly spaced parallel lines in the cortex appear sucked together into the centre of the visual field, creating the visual impression of either a spiral or a tunnel. The regular checkerboard and hexagon patterns turn into spiralling squares or hexagons.

So more than half a century after Kl?ver set out his form-constants, two of them were finally explained. LSD users see spirals and tunnels because those are the real-world objects that fit the patterns of neural firing in their cortex. Timothy Leary, the guru of "tune in, turn on, drop out" fame, speculated in The Psychedelic Experience, "These visions might be described as pure sensations of cellular and sub-cellular processes." So just as Leary guessed, the spaced-out brain is tuning into its own architecture.

But what about the other two form-constants, the cobweb and honeycomb illusions? These are both lacy, filigree patterns, while water boils in fat rolls, so it's obvious the convection analogy won't work here. Cowan was confidant that his theory would provide the framework to understand these hallucinations, too.

In the 1980s, it became clear that the neurons in V1 are not sensitive simply to the position of an image on the retina. Most of them are sensitive to edges, firing if they sense an edge passing through a particular point in the visual field but remain silent if that point is similar to its surroundings. These cells are arrayed in little patches called hypercolumns that represent a particular part of space (see Diagram). Within the hypercolumn, each neuron responds to an edge at a slightly different orientation.


Edge-detecting neurons in the brain


Instead of signalling to their neighbours in the same hypercolumn, these neurons contact their counterparts in different columns, which represent similar orientations in slightly different parts of space. Then, if there really is an edge, neurons with the right orientation excite each other, so the brain is more likely to detect it.

These long-range connections seemed essential to understanding the last two hallucination types, but they added a new level of complexity to Cowan's mathematical model of the cortex. Hot water was no longer a good analogy, because the forces at work there?buoyancy and viscosity?are all short range. Now equations were needed to describe something long range and direction-sensitive. The maths turned out to be like those of a hot gas in a magnetic field.

Cowan and his graduate student Matthew Wiener programmed in these equations, and found many possible waveforms could result. But they couldn't tell which of these patterns would be the first to appear spontaneously. They needed someone who could combine an expert's understanding of quantum mechanics and neuroscience, and in 1998, Cowan found just the person. Paul Bressloff of Loughborough University in Leicestershire had trained as a specialist in quantum gravity, then taken a detour into neural networks. In a few months of intense work at Chicago, he helped Cowan and Marty Golubitsky of the University of Houston work out the waves of activity that should emerge spontaneously among orientation-sensitive cells. The results appeared earlier this year in Philosophical Transactions of the Royal Society (vol 356, p 1).

The winning patterns were those in which the edges naturally close up into small square or hexagonal cells. Cowan's theory precisely reproduces Kl?ver's two missing form-constants. When the fine-edged squares and hexagons on the cortex are filtered back through the retinal map, they look like lacy cobwebs and honeycombs.

So far so good. But has Cowan done any more than confirm a wiring pattern for the brain that neuroscientists had already worked out? He points out that to understand how the brain works, we need more than wiring: we have to know how these circuits actually behave.

In fact, Cowan's model does hint at this. One unexpected outcome is that subtle changes in the wiring of the model brain can cause significant changes to its preferred hallucination patterns. For example, if the long-range connections in the model always run between edge neurons that represent identical orientations, would generate hallucinations resembling herringbone twill. Clearly our brains are not wired this way; if they were, who knows what effect psychedelic visions of tweed blazers might have had on 1960s fashion. To produce cobwebs and hexagons, we actually need the connections to be a little more slapdash. Perhaps the human edge-detection system is wired this way because it helps us spot small, closed contours.

On the other hand, the herringbone patterns may emerge if the chemical stimulation is changed. Perhaps the theory can explain other kinds of visual disturbances that were thought to be unrelated to LSD hallucinations, such as the auras and zigzag patterns seen by people suffering a migraine attack. If so, it could tell us what changes in the brain cause migraines, and perhaps set us on course for a cure.

Lurking in the background is the much bigger issue of where the mind comes from. To what extent is the mind, and all the rich variety of inner experiences that gives us a sense of self, simply a product of physiological processes in the brain? Hallucinations could be a perfect place to start answering this question.

The apostles of the psychedelic sixties scorned the scientific approach to understanding an LSD trip. "Bobbing around in this brilliant, symphonic sea of imagery is the remnant of the conceptual mind," Leary wrote. "On the endless watery turbulence of the Pacific Ocean bobs a tiny open mouth, shouting (between saline mouthfuls), 'Order! System! Explain all this!'" To appreciate a hallucination, Leary said, you have to let go of the urge to rationalise it.

Tom Wolfe pitched in with The Electric Kool-Aid Acid Test. "The White Smocks liked to put it into words, like hallucination and dissociative phenomena. They could understand the visual skyrockets. Give them a good case of an ashtray turning into a Venus flytrap or eyelid movies of crystal cathedrals, and they could groove on that... That was swell. But don't you see??the visual stuff was just the d?cor with LSD... The whole thing was ... the experience ... this certain indescribable feeling ... The experience of the barrier between the subjective and the objective, the personal and the impersonal, the Iand the not-I disappearing ... that feeling!"

Cowan makes no apologies for being one of the White Smocks. He thinks that the "visual skyrockets" and that "certain indescribable feeling" are part and parcel of the same experience. As the drug penetrates to deeper and deeper areas of the brain?visual layers, cognitive layers, emotional layers and, finally, whatever part of the brain gives us our sense of self-awareness?our subjective experience becomes enormously more complicated and richer. And yet what's going on at the cellular level may not be so different at each layer.

"Does that mean that everything can be observed and described?" Cowan asks. "I happen to believe the answer is yes. I don't think there's anything in the brain that science can't ultimately deal with." But the answers aren't going to come along tomorrow. "There are a hundred vision chips, a hundred sound chips. We now understand a bit more about one of the vision chips," he says. Cowan is already planning to look at other aspects of visual hallucinations, such as texture and size perception.

Journeying deeper still into the mind might not be much harder. The neocortex, the layer of the brain that includes V1, is the part that evolved most recently. It is also the part that supposedly makes humans so intelligent. Because it hasn't been around long, its cells are all structurally quite similar, even if their functions are quite different. "The reason this is a note for optimism," says Gary Blasdel of Harvard University, "is that when you really understand the operations that go on in a particular cortical area, it will generalise to other areas." Cowan's computerised visions might just be the beginning of a really cool trip.



--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineseethe303
enthusiast

Registered: 12/04/02
Posts: 353
Loc: over the rainbow
Last seen: 11 years, 10 months
Re: Secrets Of An Acid Head - An Essay [Re: Jackal]
    #1442188 - 04/09/03 07:52 AM (21 years, 5 months ago)

very interesting...

I agree that the visuals of LSD are somehow related to what is going on inside the tripper's head. at higher doses, with intense visuals, I feel like my mind and my eyes are being peeled back layer by layer, and that when the visuals move, it is just my brain completing a loop or changing it's thought pattern.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinevalour
Swordbearer

Registered: 03/02/02
Posts: 1,453
Loc: USA
Last seen: 18 years, 8 months
Re: Secrets Of An Acid Head - An Essay [Re: Jackal]
    #1443620 - 04/09/03 03:42 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

Incredibly cool -

The only thing I didn't like and actually disagree with is "[T]here's nothing transcendental about it."

But otherwise - damn, interesting theory and practice.
Hey, machines deserve to trip out, too.
I think I'll dose my toaster ;-)


--------------------
"Remember, son,
I didn't sell out-
I bought in."

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblewhiterasta
Day careobserver
 User Gallery
Registered: 04/09/02
Posts: 1,780
Loc: Oregon
Re: Secrets Of An Acid Head - An Essay [Re: valour]
    #1443780 - 04/09/03 04:32 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

Machines have been created to smell,taste,hear and now hallucinate.One wonders,because we can create a machinistic model of a process,does this acknowlege the essence of the experience in the biological version?Does a machine "complete" the experience of the smell of a rose? The taste of chocolate?They certainly can reproduce the objective evaluations of these experiences,but what of the "meaning" ? This is supplied by consciousness.So even as a model acid trip is mechanisticly reproduced meaning is still supplied by consciousness.
It is stated by the researcher that he believes no area of the brain to be "unobservable and understandable",This may be true but understanding the consciousness within that archetecture is quite different.
If they programmed it for acid..... I wonder if they have a psilocybin and mescaline program also? I think my puter would like the mescaline program :wink: WR


--------------------
To old for this place

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineStrumpling
Neuronaut
Registered: 10/11/02
Posts: 7,571
Loc: Hyperspace
Last seen: 13 years, 3 months
Re: Secrets Of An Acid Head - An Essay [Re: whiterasta]
    #1444264 - 04/09/03 07:25 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

I would be VERY interested to see some of these computer-created visuals that this guy is claiming resemble full-blown psychedelic-induced hallucinations. This sounds very fascinating to me..


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinethe spiral
Neuroscientist
Male User Gallery

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 05/13/02
Posts: 1,769
Last seen: 9 years, 1 month
Re: Secrets Of An Acid Head - An Essay [Re: Strumpling]
    #1444485 - 04/09/03 08:16 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

interesting but tripping is more than just visuals, and some visuals can be incredibly complex beyond the simple patterns they talk about in that article. Shrooms often give me this visual in the center of my vision where i can see letters and numbers racing by. The last time i tripped i was looking out the window as my friend drove the car and was in awe watching this shimmering point of light flying outside my window as it raced along next to us and danced in the air. Anyone whos tripped has had visuals like that...so while I totally agree with attempting to understand how tripping happens in the brain, I don't think that it will ever be explainable in english.


--------------------


"A celibate clergy is an especially good idea, because it tends to suppress any hereditary propensity toward fanaticism." - Carl Sagan

Edited by the spiral (04/09/03 08:17 PM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDailyPot
Trip'n Time

Registered: 11/17/02
Posts: 2,207
Loc: Florida
Last seen: 18 years, 7 months
Re: Secrets Of An Acid Head - An Essay [Re: the spiral]
    #1447181 - 04/10/03 03:26 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

I'd like to see the computers visuals also...as much as I like to just trip and enjoy it I think the science behind it is very very interesting. I've always thought about it but I really like the way this guy broke it down, I'd fund him :tongue:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblepsychopsilocyber
Male

Registered: 12/11/02
Posts: 1,020
Re: Secrets Of An Acid Head - An Essay [Re: Jackal]
    #1451814 - 04/12/03 04:19 AM (21 years, 5 months ago)

What if this is how artaficial intellegence was born? Maybe they advance to put a brain on a computer and somehow i dont know fuck it

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePsilocybeingzz
Male User Gallery

Registered: 12/15/02
Posts: 14,463
Loc: International waters
Last seen: 11 years, 10 months
Re: Secrets Of An Acid Head - An Essay [Re: psychopsilocyber]
    #1453076 - 04/12/03 04:37 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

what about info people get from "out there" (so to speak ) on psychedelics ?
thats not in a computer , what about the stuff from a hundred years ago or more that can be seen again in this time by a tripper?

I doubt the computer can "see" that
I doubt it can "see" the great "overmind"

read
THE COSMIC GAME !!!!!!!
I love that book!
read it twice and one day a long time from now I might read it again


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineGhostofbillhicks
Stranger
 User Gallery
Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 20
Last seen: 11 years, 1 month
Re: Secrets Of An Acid Head - An Essay [Re: Jackal]
    #18630746 - 07/29/13 06:51 PM (11 years, 1 month ago)

From the archives, but fascinating article.

The neuroscientist suggests the brain is a machine, thus LSD reveals this fact and is therefore not transcendent.

For me, the very reason LSD is transcendent is because it shows the machine that it is in fact, only a machine.

A passing show; an amusement ride.

And in realising all our grand adventures are 'on rails', we are freed from trivialities.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineGreySatyr
Pagan-Psyche
Male
Registered: 06/20/13
Posts: 3,376
Loc: North Carolina
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
Re: Secrets Of An Acid Head - An Essay [Re: Ghostofbillhicks] * 1
    #18631120 - 07/29/13 08:00 PM (11 years, 1 month ago)

Incomplete data, recalculating...error#22783913739360---0(tripping balls) Please restart.

Fucking stupid if you ask me. It only speaks about patterns, how about seeing a flame shoot up my arm, huh or a circus made of trees?! Shared hallucinations? And it only speaks of hallucinations, slacking, fucking logical thinking nuerologistis. Take the shit and then te me what you think, biaaaatch. Can't know something truly until you've experienced it.


--------------------
...also, go to hell, huh?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineGhostofbillhicks
Stranger
 User Gallery
Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 20
Last seen: 11 years, 1 month
Re: Secrets Of An Acid Head - An Essay [Re: GreySatyr]
    #18632447 - 07/30/13 04:25 AM (11 years, 1 month ago)

Agreed.

But the premise of Science is dualistic and will never discover the enlightened state LSD elicits, that of abiding non-dual awareness.

The subject (scientist) can't become the data (tripping). Shame!

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineHostDisorder
Stranger
Male User Gallery

Registered: 07/27/12
Posts: 529
Loc: United Kingdom
Last seen: 8 years, 2 months
Re: Secrets Of An Acid Head - An Essay [Re: Ghostofbillhicks]
    #18632462 - 07/30/13 04:40 AM (11 years, 1 month ago)

I can never agree that the mind is contained in the brain.


--------------------
"The ego must be repeatedly resubmerged in the unconscious in order to draw upon the restorative and the creative powers that reside there".

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineGhostofbillhicks
Stranger
 User Gallery
Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 20
Last seen: 11 years, 1 month
Re: Secrets Of An Acid Head - An Essay [Re: HostDisorder]
    #18632487 - 07/30/13 04:56 AM (11 years, 1 month ago)

It could be.

Depends what you mean by 'mind'. If personality or individuality, then my feeling is yes, that is nerological and will end when our brains end.

But if you mean 'mind' to be that which is alive in every being, that which is non-individual, I feel that is impossible to ever die.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1

Shop: North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   Mushroom-Hut Mono Tub Substrate   MagicBag.co Certified Organic All-In-One Grow Bags by Magic Bag   OlympusMyco.com Olympus Myco Bulk Substrate   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* acid visuals [smile]
( 1 2 all )
HB 8,320 22 09/24/01 09:32 PM
by Anonymous
* 200ug for first time acid trip?
( 1 2 all )
divinebeing 12,635 27 03/02/18 12:14 PM
by Northerner
* Blind people on acid
( 1 2 3 all )
Grizzy 5,468 43 06/06/05 05:47 PM
by unearth
* acid trip compared to mushroom trip
( 1 2 all )
LTBOOMER 11,123 35 07/29/03 05:03 PM
by cannabis_sativa
* The Great Mushrooms Poll: Shroom Secrets Revealed!
( 1 2 3 4 ... 40 41 )
Asante 516,846 800 04/29/19 02:39 PM
by Doc9151
* Story about an acid trip. DocPsilocybin 8,327 14 01/14/05 02:23 AM
by DocPsilocybin
* acid still around
( 1 2 all )
kontron 3,618 31 09/07/04 11:18 AM
by ChiefThunderbong
* Acid or no...?
( 1 2 all )
minimexyz 3,614 30 03/14/04 09:12 PM
by Hahzist

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: psilocybinjunkie, Rose, mushboy, LogicaL Chaos, Northerner, bodhisatta
6,822 topic views. 3 members, 14 guests and 26 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.025 seconds spending 0.005 seconds on 12 queries.