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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience?
    #12542384 -

I'm trying to think of new academic terms that could be used to describe the translational process whereby the (often ineffable) nature of the psychedelic experience is explained using other lenses and models.

In attempt to communicate this, we reference a variety of metaphors, symbols, and allegories, sometimes scientific experiments when available. What is this pulling-in form of extraction called? The approach is interdisciplinary but I want a better word for this particular style of rationalization. Maybe something in linguistics or philosophy?

Framing effect / Representation / Semiotics / etc.

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: Arden]
    #12543164 -

Any ideas are appreciated. I'm experiencing not writer's block, but creative terminology-block if there is such a thing.

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: Arden]
    #12543533 -

I once looked up all the synonyms of belief, and then the synonyms of the synonyms. All the second order synonyms seemed to cover a landscape of attitudes people have towards belief.

It was illuminating. Shed some light on the issue if you will. Elucidating even. Perhaps you could explicate the psychedelic experience, or would you rather expound your belief? Maybe propound it?

Or would you tentatively suggest, put forth, posit, propose or postulate? No you would not suggest doubt. Always be confident in your own crazy ideas. Convince and persuade if you can.

But the assumptions, presumptions and suppositions have got to go. Along with hand waving and conjecture.

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: Freedom]
    #12543571 -

Assimilezation.


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We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: deCypher]
    #12543648 -

Quote:
I once looked up all the synonyms of belief, and then the synonyms of the synonyms. All the second order synonyms seemed to cover a landscape of attitudes people have towards belief.

It was illuminating. Shed some light on the issue if you will. Elucidating even. Perhaps you could explicate the psychedelic experience, or would you rather expound your belief? Maybe propound it?

Or would you tentatively suggest, put forth, posit, propose or postulate? No you would not suggest doubt. Always be confident in your own crazy ideas. Convince and persuade if you can.

But the assumptions, presumptions and suppositions have got to go. Along with hand waving and conjecture.



Nice, I like it.

I think there is a bit of a theoretical circus that is created by trying to out-jump the previous paradigms by either scoping our lenses more acutely or further removed--hoping to, once and for all, grasp the "big picture" with our angle. The more we look, the more it expands. And the more I grasp for words that categorize all of this doing-ing-ing, I realize I'm guilty of the same fucking thing. :lol: 


Quote:
Assimilezation.



"Assimilation (philosophy), incorporation of new concepts into existing schemes" (from Wiki).

Do you think the psychedelic experience is better understood by using pre-existing concepts, or is its profundity better captured by its own language--colored by art, stories, and cosmic puns?

I think regardless to whatever degree we believe the experience and the substances to be appropriately conveyed by certain subjects, at this moment they are being insufflated and rationalized like a fat rail of blow by various schools of thought and science. But like a wet dog, it shakes off all labels. It looks like this unrefined slice of reality is performing Maya's great dance... but maybe it's our own minds doing the dancing? We keep finger-pointing and referencing explanations, but really we are just illuminating the nature of ourselves:


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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: Arden]
    #12543655 -

How could the psychedelic experience be communicated if we didn't use pre-existing concepts?


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We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: deCypher]
    #12543719 -

Quote:
How could the psychedelic experience be communicated if we didn't use pre-existing concepts?



It seems all of language is comprised of pre-existing concepts (e.g. words), otherwise how would we communicate efficiently. But the point remains that if we only used pre-existing concepts, then how is there ever room for new ones to emerge?

If our prima materia for rationalizing knowledge on May 11 is only derived from what is already in existence, we are left with the problem of explaining the diversity of already-extant ideas.

Without deviating too much, all I mean is that the psyc. experience seems predisposed to provide oneself with linguistic conglomerates, humorous gobbledigooks of perception, a novelty of wordsmithing. I think even non-sense blabbery, along with the viewpoints, should be cultivated and used more in current terminology (as Mckenna said, we should be pulling in our nets and taking some fish back with us).

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: Arden]
    #12543748 -

Blab away good sir.  :salute:


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: deCypher]
    #12543787 -

Quote:
Blab away good sir.  :salute:



It's only to rationalize and make sense of things that are currently not understood.

Of course this also assumes they / it can be understood.

I'm just fishing for ideas and inspiration--writing an article about a similar topic.

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: Arden] * 1
    #12543885 -

weird fishes...

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: Arden]
    #12543971 -

are you talking about a review of the reverberation of similes propagating with residual meanings?


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:brainfart: _ :finger:

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #12544004 -

Quote:
are you talking about a review of the reverberation of similes propagating with residual meanings?




I just imagined metaphors having rough sex and giving birth to conundrums. Am I on the right track?

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: Arden]
    #12544006 -

metaphornication


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We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: Arden]
    #12544026 -

No words can describe a psychedelic experience, you must dose them.

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: Dr. Zaius]
    #12544107 -

Quote:
metaphornication



Term-sperm: putting the physical back in metaphysics.

One 8 can become two 0's. This phrase, using language, characterizes math, conveys/creates an idea with symbols, and expresses both a conceptual possibility and a practical impossibility.

Neat.

Quote:
No words can describe a psychedelic experience, you must dose them.




Dose the words or dose the disbelievers? Let's soak their bibles in acid and accomplish both.

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: Arden]
    #12544128 -

Arden said:
Quote:
No words can describe a psychedelic experience, you must dose them.




Dose the words or dose the disbelievers? Let's soak their bibles in acid and accomplish both.



The only way to understand is to experience it. If you soaked peoples bibles in acid they would have bad trips.

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: Dr. Zaius]
    #12544138 -

Quote:
If you soaked peoples bibles in acid they would have bad trips.




Until they discovered that their pinky finger perfectly fits into their nostril. Hilarity ensues.

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: Arden]
    #12544333 -

Arden said:
I'm trying to think of new academic terms that could be used to describe the translational process whereby the (often ineffable) nature of the psychedelic experience is explained using other lenses and models.

In attempt to communicate this, we reference a variety of metaphors, symbols, and allegories, sometimes scientific experiments when available. What is this pulling-in form of extraction called? The approach is interdisciplinary but I want a better word for this particular style of rationalization. Maybe something in linguistics or philosophy?

Framing effect / Representation / Semiotics / etc.



Great question for which I have no answer.  I enjoyed the jokes though.  Clever and intelligent humor rules.


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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: daytripper23]
    #12544832 -

Some psychedelic patterns are wide spread:


Afghanistan:




turkey:




Incan:



The Pakistani who made this must have been smoking hash:


Here is an Iranian prayer cove wrapped in psychedelic patterns:


When I take psychedelics I spontaneously see similar patterns. There is something about the geometry in the patterns that catches the eye in a certain way.

Edited by Freedom (05/11/10 06:35 PM)

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Re: Extrapolating the Psychedelic Experience? [Re: Arden]
    #12544930 -

Arden said:
Quote:
Blab away good sir.  :salute:



It's only to rationalize and make sense of things that are currently not understood.

Of course this also assumes they / it can be understood.

I'm just fishing for ideas and inspiration--writing an article about a similar topic.



I don't think you xan properly describe the psychedelic experience with words. I think that words can only ever describe existing ideas or new patterns of existing ideas.

However psychedelics open our mind to complexly new ideas.. perhaps new patterns of patterns of existing ideas... when tripping, words mostly go out the window. because words represent concepts that we have already agreed exist socially. But when you are having a trip, you are experiencing something that cannot be clearly verified by other people.

Psychedelic midstate is in many ways dialectically opposite to the structured mind of social agreement and conservative objectivism. However our MIND and our experience of life on earth is not an objective one. That is why the psychedelic experience is so powerful. It helps us understand the subjective framework. Objective ideas are patterns of this framework that we hold on to and give importance to. But the basic underlying 'stuff' of our thought processes is a subjective reality.


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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


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