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Newpala21
1st time farmer
Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 371
Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
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agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed?
#11029520 - 09/09/09 07:16 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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So i got agar agar and dextrose(corn sugar). My first question, is this dextrose fine to use, ive been reading for 3hrs and i dont see anything that is helpful pertaining to this kind... My second question, do i need to add any other ingredients to this or could i just use the agar and dextrose its self, if so what ratio should i use with my p-tree dishes. I got 20 of them but probally only do like 2 or 3 at a time. also i saw different colors of agar( red,green,yellow and clear. i got clear) and was curious if a certain color is better... My last question, which would u guys say is better to use, an LC or the culture?
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Doc_T
Random Dude
Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: Newpala21]
#11029544 - 09/09/09 07:19 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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Dextrose will do better if you add a bit of malt or yeast. A teaspoon to 500 mL is good. Color doesn't matter, plain is fine.
I don't think your last question makes any sense?
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nastos
secret secretions
Registered: 06/15/09
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: Doc_T]
#11029565 - 09/09/09 07:22 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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maybe he means to inoc jars.. a wedge from the plate or an lc from a wedge?
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Doc_T
Random Dude
Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: nastos]
#11029598 - 09/09/09 07:27 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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Well, that's what I thought- but how is one 'better' than the other, they are completely different.
OP, agar is use to isolate a culture, to grow a pure substrain. Liquid Culture is a way to handle growing cultures that may be pure isolates, or tissue clones, or multispore with hundreds or thousands of individual genetic organisms.
Generally, LC will colonize a jar faster than an agar wedge, simply because of the way mycelium grows. But whether that's 'better' or not depends on the culture that is growing and what you want to do with it.
Best of all worlds, IMO: use agar to isolate, grow out on grain, then perform Grain LC. (Or g2g) Also note: with LC, you can't tell if you are growing a contaminant. Agar makes it obvious.
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Newpala21
1st time farmer
Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 371
Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: nastos]
#11029801 - 09/09/09 07:53 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
nastos said: maybe he means to inoc jars.. a wedge from the plate or an lc from a wedge?
Thats basically what i meant. So then it would be better to grow on a culture and then isolate a really rizo part and then start a LC from it or should I grow from MS and take a piece from the membrane and put it on a culture or an LC.
Forgive me if im not makin sense, this is my first attempt at this and ive read so much im not sure how or what to go by, all i know is that im trying to do this the right way instead of doing guess work and failing miserably.
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Doc_T
Random Dude
Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: Newpala21]
#11029867 - 09/09/09 08:01 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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Ok, you are on the right track. Tissue sample to agar is a pretty good way to get started with agar work. It gives you a good chance to get a viable fruiting substrain without too much risk of contamination.
Use that to isolate a pure substrain, grow it out on dishes until you have it clean and strong, then drop wedges into grain.
Once the grain colonizes, g2g or GLC.
Does that make sense?
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Newpala21
1st time farmer
Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 371
Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: Doc_T]
#11029900 - 09/09/09 08:04 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Doc_T said: Well, that's what I thought- but how is one 'better' than the other, they are completely different.
OP, agar is use to isolate a culture, to grow a pure substrain. Liquid Culture is a way to handle growing cultures that may be pure isolates, or tissue clones, or multispore with hundreds or thousands of individual genetic organisms.
Generally, LC will colonize a jar faster than an agar wedge, simply because of the way mycelium grows. But whether that's 'better' or not depends on the culture that is growing and what you want to do with it.
Best of all worlds, IMO: use agar to isolate, grow out on grain, then perform Grain LC. (Or g2g) Also note: with LC, you can't tell if you are growing a contaminant. Agar makes it obvious.
OK this is new to me so im still learning so please bare with me.. I got the first part about use agar to isolate then grow on to grain but the last part when u say "then perform Grain LC" that part ive never heard of, r u sayin to take some mycelium from the grain once it reaches full colonization and start an LC or am i more lost than i thought i was.
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Doc_T
Random Dude
Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: Newpala21]
#11029945 - 09/09/09 08:09 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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Oh, I thought everybody knew about Grain Lc, sorry. Basically, shoot water into a jar with a syringe, shake it around, and suck it back out. Then yo can use it like the kinds of LC you already know about, to start jars quickly and consistently. Like grain to grain but without opening the jars.
Linkety link.
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anonjon
Partially Right
Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 6,322
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: Doc_T]
#11030007 - 09/09/09 08:17 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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The grocery store agar tek recommends potato flakes. I was thinking this was to help solidify the mix a little. But that tek calls for honey, which is a liquid. The dextrose might firm up the agar enuff on its own.
However, if it doesn't solidify good enuff, you might consider adding some kind of starch.
Found pure potato starch at a oriental grocery. Just recently experimented with it and used to much. Agar came out hard as rubber. Next batch should be better.
-------------------- The above post is fictional, hypothetical, or downright nonsensical.
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Newpala21
1st time farmer
Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 371
Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: Doc_T]
#11030010 - 09/09/09 08:18 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Doc_T said: Oh, I thought everybody knew about Grain Lc, sorry. Basically, shoot water into a jar with a syringe, shake it around, and suck it back out. Then yo can use it like the kinds of LC you already know about, to start jars quickly and consistently. Like grain to grain but without opening the jars.
Linkety link.
yup its offical cause im still lost on that Grain LC. Im sorry but could u please explain that to me again like i was 5yrs old, soooo lost on that.
Are u meaning to shoot water into a jar that has culture growing in it already? and then inoc with that..
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anonjon
Partially Right
Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 6,322
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: Newpala21]
#11030111 - 09/09/09 08:32 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Newpala21 said:
Quote:
Doc_T said: Oh, I thought everybody knew about Grain Lc, sorry. Basically, shoot water into a jar with a syringe, shake it around, and suck it back out. Then yo can use it like the kinds of LC you already know about, to start jars quickly and consistently. Like grain to grain but without opening the jars.
Linkety link.
yup its offical cause im still lost on that Grain LC. Im sorry but could u please explain that to me again like i was 5yrs old, soooo lost on that.
Are u meaning to shoot water into a jar that has culture growing in it already? and then inoc with that..
yup, click the link
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Newpala21
1st time farmer
Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 371
Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: anonjon]
#11030148 - 09/09/09 08:36 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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HOLY SHIT :holy shit: I DIDNT C THAT, my bad but thanx for the recommendation there.lol.
WTF my flying holy shit didnt show up
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Edited by Newpala21 (09/09/09 08:38 PM)
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Newpala21
1st time farmer
Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 371
Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: Newpala21]
#11034296 - 09/10/09 01:31 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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Heres a thought, would the hot creamy wheat based cereal "FARINA" be possible to use instead of yeast with making a agar culture or an LC. Its mainly all wheat products, heres its ingredients:FARINA (WHEAT), DICALCIUM PHOSPHATE,FERRIC ORTHOPHOSPHATE (A SOURCE OF IRON), NIACINAMIDE,FOLIC ACID,THIAMIN MONONITRATE,RIBOFLAVIN...
% daily value: TOTAL FAT- 0g--0% saturated fat- 0g--0% trans fat- 0g CHOLESTEROL- 0mg--0% SODIUM- Omg--0% TOTAL CARBOYHDRATE- 22g--8% dietary fiber less than 1g--4% sugars- 0g PROTEIN- 3g
AND NUTRITION INFO BASED ON 2000 CALORIE IN TAKE:
TOTAL FAT- LESS THAN 65G SAT FAT- LESS THAN 20G CHOLESTEROL- LESS THAN 300MG SODIUM- LESS THAN 2,400MG TOTAL CARBOHYDRATE- 300G DIETARY FIBER- 25G AND VITAMINS: VITAMIN A-0%, VITAMIN C-0%, CALCIUM-10%, IRON-50%, THIAMIN-10%, RIBOFLAVIN-6%, NIACIN-6%, FOLIC ACID 15%....
So does anyone think this stuff would work at all in makin LC/Culture, Its all wheat based from what it looks like so i figured it would but i thought id post this and see what some of the wonderful all knowing ppl on here thought.. If so, what ratio would b suitable for mixing and using to experiment with
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anonjon
Partially Right
Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 6,322
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: Newpala21]
#11034900 - 09/10/09 03:14 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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every lc recipe ive seen is some kind of simple sugar. i dont see the point of what you're doing. why not just get some karo, honey, dextrose, maltose, etc?
-------------------- The above post is fictional, hypothetical, or downright nonsensical.
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Newpala21
1st time farmer
Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 371
Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: anonjon]
#11035163 - 09/10/09 04:14 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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I got dextrose( corn sugar) and agar and potato flakes and honey. I wasnt doing anything with it , if u read the question u would see that it was just "A question" on what ppl thought and if this stuff would work aswell. its just sitting around in my cabinet so i looked at its ingredients and saw it was mainly wheat and fat/sodium free. So again, just a question
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CH HELL
Brain Sturgeon
Registered: 10/02/08
Posts: 6,610
Loc: mars
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: Newpala21]
#11035224 - 09/10/09 04:24 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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If you are making agar or LC. If its agar and you're growing cube the dextrose isn't necessary use instant potato flakes or malt and if you want you can add a little dextrose. LC then the dextrose is fine use it on its own at 4% or add a little malt. TC, CH
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anonjon
Partially Right
Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 6,322
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: Newpala21]
#11035258 - 09/10/09 04:31 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Newpala21 said: I got dextrose( corn sugar) and agar and potato flakes and honey. I wasnt doing anything with it , if u read the question u would see that it was just "A question" on what ppl thought and if this stuff would work aswell. its just sitting around in my cabinet so i looked at its ingredients and saw it was mainly wheat and fat/sodium free. So again, just a question
What's the consistency like? If you can get it to gel up clear, it might work. I would think a simple sugar, rather than carb would be easier for a tissue sample to use. I could be wrong.
-------------------- The above post is fictional, hypothetical, or downright nonsensical.
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Newpala21
1st time farmer
Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 371
Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: anonjon]
#11035442 - 09/10/09 05:06 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Newpala21 said: Heres a thought, would the hot creamy wheat based cereal "FARINA" be possible to use instead of yeast with making a agar culture or an LC. Its mainly all wheat products, heres its ingredients:FARINA (WHEAT), DICALCIUM PHOSPHATE,FERRIC ORTHOPHOSPHATE (A SOURCE OF IRON), NIACINAMIDE,FOLIC ACID,THIAMIN MONONITRATE,RIBOFLAVIN...
% daily value: TOTAL FAT- 0g--0% saturated fat- 0g--0% trans fat- 0g CHOLESTEROL- 0mg--0% SODIUM- Omg--0% TOTAL CARBOYHDRATE- 22g--8% dietary fiber less than 1g--4% sugars- 0g PROTEIN- 3g
AND NUTRITION INFO BASED ON 2000 CALORIE IN TAKE:
TOTAL FAT- LESS THAN 65G SAT FAT- LESS THAN 20G CHOLESTEROL- LESS THAN 300MG SODIUM- LESS THAN 2,400MG TOTAL CARBOHYDRATE- 300G DIETARY FIBER- 25G AND VITAMINS: VITAMIN A-0%, VITAMIN C-0%, CALCIUM-10%, IRON-50%, THIAMIN-10%, RIBOFLAVIN-6%, NIACIN-6%, FOLIC ACID 15%....
So does anyone think this stuff would work at all in makin LC/Culture, Its all wheat based from what it looks like so i figured it would but i thought id post this and see what some of the wonderful all knowing ppl on here thought.. If so, what ratio would b suitable for mixing and using to experiment with
yes yes everyone i know the recipes for LC and cultures its all over this site. i just want to know if anyone here know or thinks if this stuff would work or have any benefit at all
Quote:
anonjon said:
Quote:
Newpala21 said: I got dextrose( corn sugar) and agar and potato flakes and honey. I wasnt doing anything with it , if u read the question u would see that it was just "A question" on what ppl thought and if this stuff would work aswell. its just sitting around in my cabinet so i looked at its ingredients and saw it was mainly wheat and fat/sodium free. So again, just a question
What's the consistency like? If you can get it to gel up clear, it might work. I would think a simple sugar, rather than carb would be easier for a tissue sample to use. I could be wrong.
Quote:
anonjon said:
Quote:
Newpala21 said: I got dextrose( corn sugar) and agar and potato flakes and honey. I wasnt doing anything with it , if u read the question u would see that it was just "A question" on what ppl thought and if this stuff would work aswell. its just sitting around in my cabinet so i looked at its ingredients and saw it was mainly wheat and fat/sodium free. So again, just a question
What's the consistency like? If you can get it to gel up clear, it might work. I would think a simple sugar, rather than carb would be easier for a tissue sample to use. I could be wrong.
Well its kinda like salt just a tad bigger and its solid white, no it wont gel up or dissolve clear, kinda turns into a pasty white and it hold its form but swells up a little when its heated up in water. Again just a thought so i figured i ask around and see what people thought. SORRY DIDNT MEAN TO DOUBLE QUOTE
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Doc_T
Random Dude
Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: Newpala21]
#11037285 - 09/10/09 10:15 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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Corn sugar? Or corn starch?
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Newpala21
1st time farmer
Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 371
Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
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Re: agar+dextrose-more ingredients needed? [Re: Doc_T]
#11037830 - 09/10/09 11:46 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Doc_T said: Corn sugar? Or corn starch?[/quote were that come from, i was describing the farina i was talkin about earlier
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