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Switched to Diazepam
    #8940004 -

Well, I went in to my psychiatrist and told him the Ativan was not working- which was true. I have experimented with many prescriptions in the past, and although I am not a doctor (soon to be though; med school in a few years), I have a good idea of what I need to help me. I was prescribed 5 mg valium three times a day. It works, but it does not completely calm me down. I am still very anxious, and bite my nails to the point of bleeding. I feel I need a higher dose of valium, preferably 10 mg three times a day. I have battled anxiety for fifteen years, and in the past few months had a steady supply of 10 mg valium, and it certainly put me in place.

A little background:
My first doctor prescribed me Paxil CR 25 mg once a day for the past year and a half. I had a horrible wreck on the interstate due to a panic attack, and decided that this was the time to seek the help I needed. I ended up switching doctors, and my new one is quite a smart character. I am a 19 year college student at the #2 party school in the nation (Go Rebels!!). I believe this has an influence on what he prescribes me. Since switching doctors, I have had a corresponding switch in medicine. The new doctor has prescribed me 20 mg IR Paxil twice a day, and gave me Ativan 1 mg three times a day. I went back the next week for a "check up", and was prescribed 5 mg Olanzapine once a day, as well as 25 mg Strattera twice a day. I went back two days later because my anxiety was uncontrollable. I told him how my anxiety has started to control my life, and was appalled when he ended the session without writing another prescription. As we stood up, my mom in the room as well, I sat back down and said "I need help. Is there anything I can get temporarily that will calm me down?" He ended up giving me a prescription to the 5 mg Valium, with one refill. He said that is what he prescribes to people with a fear of flying.

My question:
How do I go about getting a higher dose of the medicine, or something stronger? I allowed my mom to come into the room, because it makes a stronger case that I am there for help and not drugs, which is the case. My doctor is set on a method called "using platforms". Under this method, a single medicine is just that- a single medicine. If you add another medicine, it acts as four medicines. Since I have three medicines combating my anxiety, it acts as nine when they work together. I have an appointment Thursday, and when I go in and say the Valium is not working, I feel that he will add a different medicine to give me sixteen medicines using the platform method. As I said earlier, 10 mg of Valium will work. 5 mg doses are just not enough to calm me down.

Any ideas?
Thanks for your advice.

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: They call me Jim]
    #8940139 -

I've never heard of this using platforms business. The closest I've heard is that they will sometimes find out that a drug is beneficial for a condition other than it was originally made for.

I used to have really bad anxiety issues. Back then the doctors prescribed me Welbutrin(300mg, once daily) and Klonopin(1mg, use as needed up to 3x daily). That did the trick pretty well without making me feel like a zombie.

Just suggest a medication and/or dosage increase. Tell him you've been doing some reading and talking to people. If he's a good doctor he will address your concerns without being accusatory.

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: Gumby]
    #8940169 -

The platform method is a true way medicines react. It is not called the platform method persay, but it was explained to me by those terms by three different doctors.

I do believe you are right about suggesting a higher dose. I did pretty much ask for something stronger than Ativan, and got it. I would like Klonopin though. I have heard that works better than Valium for anxiety. I have taken it once, but it was penny pitcher night so I cannot comment.

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: They call me Jim]
    #8940445 -

Would I develop a tolerance to taking 5 mg Valium three to four times a day over eight days? I did have a steady connect, but my tolerance returned to normal since obtaining a prescription. I do not want to go in to the doctor Thursday and say I am tolerant to 5 mg, and have him stare at me and say "That is impossible. Tolerance takes a month or more to build up.". I did some research online and found out that Valium tolerance occurs very rapidly, but it did not specify an amount of days. Taking the medicine at first did work, but after about four days it tapered off. I do believe it is due to tolerance. How should I bring that up with my doctor in order to not sound like I want to abuse my prescription?

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: They call me Jim]
    #8940737 -

Benzos are meant to treat acute anxiety, not general anxiety.

Your doctor is trying to peddle drugs to you. You will become helplessly addicted to greater and greater amounts of benzos. When this becomes obvious to your doctor he will cut you off and dump you in the nearest psychiatric hospital.

This is exactly how I got addicted to 4 mg a day of xanax. Trust me dude, you don't want to go down this road. It does NOT help your anxiety. You only trick yourself into thinking it does.


--------------------
While there is a lower class, I am in it
While there is a criminal element, I am of it
While there is a soul in prison, I am not free.

Eugene V Debs

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: kriminalelement]
    #8940761 -

I didn't know there was another 4mg/day person floating around here.

Benzos with a long half life don't help my general anxiety disorder, so I have to mouth 8 little pieces of sour junk to get through my day. If I don't time it right I'm fucked.

I wish I had done more behavioral therapy before requesting to stay on benzos. If I knew the addictive power of them I never would have considered going past what started as .5mg.

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: Adden]
    #8941896 -

sounds to me jim, like you jjust want some valiums. if you were really experiencing these problems you should know what to say to your doctor, and not ask a bunch of people on a drug related website. pills are bad news, but i guess some people just wont find that out until theyve built up a base level of the drug in their system, run out of the drug, and are throwing up every 15 minutes going through withdrawal and wishing they were dead.


--------------------
     

                                                                  thats right cubes in december bitches

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: CubensisCutter]
    #8943187 -

No, I am not looking for drugs. I am looking for help. I am tired of going from doctor to doctor, and getting no results. I finally found one that actually listens, and this is where I am now. My plan is to go in and talk to him, and basically ask him if I can get an increase in my Valium. I have extreme anxiety, and suffer from panic attacks almost daily. I have some severe downfalls in my life at the moment, which is causing the anxiety, as my doctor knows. I am not turning to pills to escape, but rather to allow me to cope with my problems and be able to face them head on. I told my doctor in the first meeting that I am not there for drugs; I am there for help. I just want to know how I should go about asking for a higher dose of Valium without him saying no.

Right now, I am looking at a bottle of half filled 7.5 mg hydrocodone, eighty 1 mg lorazepam, and sixty 5 mg Valium (all my prescriptions). If I wanted to get high, I could very easily. I don't want to get high though. I don't take two of the Valium because I don't abuse them. I am not looking for a high, but rather for help.

If you were in my situation, what would you say to my doctor to get an increase in Valium?

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: They call me Jim]
    #8943252 -

Quote:
Benzos are meant to treat acute anxiety, not general anxiety.

Your doctor is trying to peddle drugs to you. You will become helplessly addicted to greater and greater amounts of benzos. When this becomes obvious to your doctor he will cut you off and dump you in the nearest psychiatric hospital.

This is exactly how I got addicted to 4 mg a day of xanax. Trust me dude, you don't want to go down this road. It does NOT help your anxiety. You only trick yourself into thinking it does.



YUP!!!! you took the word right out of my mouth. My advice is a behavioral heath therapist specializing in cognitive behavioral therapy.

Basically they try to get to the root of the anxiety, as anxiety is only a cover to he real issues you are feeling. Once you begin to combat anxiety you can then start to ween yourself off of Valium or any benzo.

I got into this shit the same as you, looking for help with my anxiety. Then got myself into the world of benzo addiction. I am currently trying to taper off my doses. At one time I was up to 3 mg. a day.

You can do it but you have to make yourself feel better about what ever the root to the anxiety is. When the anxiety is gone you will feel as if the xanax is another addiction and not something that really helps, it just takes your mind off of it, which after you build a tolerance doesn't really take your mind off anything. YOU CAN DO IT.

look for a therapist and tell your doc you need a strategy to EVENTUALLY get off benzos because you KNOW about the horrors of benzo addiction.

http://www.benzo.org.uk/

sorry for the long post.

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: They call me Jim]
    #8943278 -

maybe drugs aren't the answer for you.  have you looked into breathing exercises?  i know of one very simple one that instantly gets rid of anxiety, it's making the in breath and out breath the same duration.

Edited by sleepy (09/17/08 09:44 AM)

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: sleepy]
    #8943289 -

...omg I cant believe I didnt think of breathing exercises or meditation... Good Advice SLEEPY. If you open yourself to meditation I think you will find it VERY benifitial. I did. But you have to believe in it, and open your mind. Good luck dude

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: sleepy]
    #8943297 -

without sounding like a drug addict, you could say you see that the valium is helping but it might require a higher dose to successfully combat your anxiety to the level of satisfaction you require. You're not a fan of taking multiple medications, even though that's what he suggests so you would like to stick with one and try different dosages.

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: Platinum]
    #8943828 -

Platinum, I feel that is a very logical approach to my dilemma. I can go ahead and say, out of all the medicines I am prescribed, the Valium is the only one that I actually notice helps me. Paxil takes four to six weeks to work, but after being on it for about ninety weeks, I do not notice much of a change. My new doctor upped the dose and changed it to IR Paxil, in hopes that it will work, but sadly, I feel no different. The Olanzapine helps me to sleep, which is why they prescribed it, but it does not help me cope with my anxiety. The Strattera was prescribed for my adhd. Although it acts as an antidepressant, it still does nothing in respect to my anxiety. I know I may sound like a kid looking for drugs, but I am not. I am majoring in Pre-Med, and Biology, with a business minor. In two years I will be applying to medical school. I have a 3.5 GPA in college, in the top ten percent at my university. I am not a drug addict, and am in no way looking for a high.

It does seem that way though, I must admit. I get prescribed a benzo, and immediately want more. I want more because the 5 mg just does not work enough, and I don't know how to approach my doctor about upping my prescription.

If you put yourself in my doctors shoes, imagine what he sees:
A 19 year old college student at a huge party school, wanting a higher dose of a prescription that sells like hot cakes anywhere. Know, with this background, how in the world can I persuade him that I do not want a higher dose, but rather I need a higher dose. Not to get high off of, but to help me.

As I said earlier, I can take two of the 5 mg Valium, but I do not abuse my medicine. I have a bottle of Hydrocodone that I could use to combat my knee pain, but it was prescribed for pains from a wreck, which have subsided, so the medicine is of no use to me.

I just want to be able to walk in to the office tomorrow, have a talk, and walk out with a prescription to a stronger dose of Valium.

Any ideas?

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: They call me Jim]
    #8943839 -

I just think it's ironic how a person who legitimately needs pharmaceutical drugs to help them with anxiety needs to ask a drug board on how to obtain them from their doctor.

Gotta love the drug war.


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: deCypher]
    #8943862 -

Wow I'm not a doctor but I think you're way overmedicated.  Do you really need all those pills?  I used to be on almost the same shit.  Lexapro, seroquel, clonazepam and adderall.  This was a few years ago, I got off it all and now I'm on no meds and I feel so much better than I ever did when I was on them.  I did have depression anxiety and insomnia and a bit of ADD.  After a while I realized that I really wasn't that mentally ill, I was just using that as an excuse to take pills to help me cope with life.  I was scared of life and unmotivated more than I was mentally sick with any of those 'diseases'.  I eventually got over the problems that I was taking the pills for.  I used to smoke a lot of pot and after I quit so many of my symptoms went away within weeks.  Quitting weed helped me wayy more than all those pills did.

I'm not assuming anything about you, you probably have some serious issues that the meds are supposed to help you with. But maybe you can take look at it from a different perspective and ask yourself if you really need all that stuff to function and deal with your life.

Edited by BoneMan (09/17/08 11:43 AM)

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: BoneMan]
    #8943917 -

Boneman, I too agree that I do not need all of those medications. I do not like taking medicine. If I have a headache, tough luck, I am not going to my pantry to get Tylenol. I just don't like taking medicine. The "problem" is my mom comes with me on these visits. Of course, being 19, I can say no, but I am sick and tired of dealing with this, and letting my mother speak her mind on the issue is helping to resolve it. I actually am more than happy to have my mom in the room with me.

As far as facing the problem head on- I have tried. For fifteen years I have tried to deal with my anxiety. Yes, since I was four years old my mom said she always knew I had problems with anxiety. I have found a medicine that "works" (Valium). I say it works loosely, because it does; it is just not strong enough. I guess what my main point is is I am worried that I will go in there tomorrow and get a prescription to another medicine, when I know what already works. The Valium is what I need (not physically, rather emotionally). Since my mom is going to be in the room tomorrow, I am fearing that when I recommend an increased dose, he will shoot it down and give me a new medicine, and tell me to stop taking the Valium. If that is the case, my mom will completely cut me off of something that is working.

As The Cypher said, it is ironic; however, I am treading on thin ice when I talk to my doctor. I have tried many different medicines in the past, and I finally found one that works, but it is just not the correct dosage. If I suggest a higher dose and the doctor sees it as drug seeking behavior, I will never see another one of those Valium again.

I need to delicately, as if hint, that I need a higher dose of the medicine. I can't just say, at 19, can I get a higher dose, or can I?

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: They call me Jim]
    #8945656 -

Quote:
Right now, I am looking at a bottle of half filled 7.5 mg hydrocodone, eighty 1 mg lorazepam, and sixty 5 mg Valium (all my prescriptions). If I wanted to get high, I could very easily. I don't want to get high though. I don't take two of the Valium because I don't abuse them. I am not looking for a high, but rather for help.

If you were in my situation, what would you say to my doctor to get an increase in Valium?


Dude, we're trying to tell you what we've been through.

I had the same problem. Bunch of shit went wrong, daily panic attacks, suicidal, fucked up mindstate, etc. BENZOS DO NOT HELP. There is NO WAY

NO WAY

NOOOO WAAAAAAAAAAAY

not to get addicted to them. The liver becomes reliant on them to function. Even if you take them only a few times a week (depends on the half life). If you continue to rely on numbing yourself you will be back on the boards in three months saying "Help me! I take enough benzos to kill a HORSE every day but they don't effect me AT ALL! I can't sleep! I can't eat! I'm yelling at everybody! I'm a total dick and I'm angry all the time!"

Do you want this to be your life? I have had painkiller addictions and benzo addictions. Trust me dude, heroin is way easier to kick than a festering benzo addiction. The sad thing is most people get addicted to benzos taking them as directed by their doctors. Stop now. Get help. The benzos will only effect you for about 6 months if you've got a serious anxiety issue. Then you will be taking massive amounts each day and still be in withdrawal.

But w/e, don't listen to the experienced people here. Continue to take pills to feel better. That'll totally take care of your problems.


--------------------
While there is a lower class, I am in it
While there is a criminal element, I am of it
While there is a soul in prison, I am not free.

Eugene V Debs

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: kriminalelement]
    #8945668 -

Quote:
It does seem that way though, I must admit. I get prescribed a benzo, and immediately want more. I want more because the 5 mg just does not work enough, and I don't know how to approach my doctor about upping my prescription.

If you put yourself in my doctors shoes, imagine what he sees:
A 19 year old college student at a huge party school, wanting a higher dose of a prescription that sells like hot cakes anywhere. Know, with this background, how in the world can I persuade him that I do not want a higher dose, but rather I need a higher dose. Not to get high off of, but to help me.



You are such a classic drug addict dude.

Don't give yourself airs. It's not WRONG to take drugs. It's not WRONG to get high. It's a bad idea to rely on them to feel normal/happy. It sounds like your mom is really controlling.... to the point where your taking mammoth amounts of drugs you don't want to take to please her/shut her up.

Did it ever occur to you to just take valium/benzos maybe 1 day a week? Like on saturday? Spend the whole day relaxing, then devote the rest of the week to studying and working. When you know you have that little vacation, you feel better.

Additionally, I'm shocked you're going to med school. How can you be a biology major and know nothing about drug tolerance? How can you not know that in six months of daily benzo use, you will feel NOTHING?

I think you do know. I don't think any student of science could miss the fact that tolerance after continuous use renders drugs ineffective. I think you DO want to get high. Just admit it to yourself. Why else would you overlook one of the basic principles of biological/neurological drug response?


--------------------
While there is a lower class, I am in it
While there is a criminal element, I am of it
While there is a soul in prison, I am not free.

Eugene V Debs

Edited by kriminalelement (09/17/08 06:22 PM)

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Re: Switched to Diazepam [Re: kriminalelement]
    #8945708 -

Speaking from experience, you should try another route than benzos.  I was on ativan for a while after suffering from a panic attack and it turned out to be hell for me.  Aside from the fact that you develop a tolerance and the efficacy of benzos is reduced to almost zero after 6 months, in my experience they just made anxiety worse.  Anxiety is a response to stressors and your body will just overcompensate over time so that when you come off the benzo the anxiety from normal things will seem doubly bad. 

I don't even know why people get prescribed these.  They're near the addictiveness of opiates, they're that bad.  Look to SSRI or other medications for a better treatment of anxiety, or until you can get things in your life under control.  I don't know what you're going through w/ a switch to diazepam since I've only used lorazepam, which I'm sure you know ativan has a much much lower half-life than the valium does and ativan hits much harder than valium. 

Basically, benzo withdrawal sucks and the efficacy of them sucks.  Do whatever you can to not take them regularly but only when really needed.

edit:  My grades went down a CONSIDERABLE amount while I was on benzos.  Seriously man, I went from 3.3 GPA to a 2.89 in one semester.  It isn't a coincidence considering benzos cause anterograde amnesia.  Just something else to consider.  They are bad, bad, bad.


--------------------


Science is a way of thinking much more than it is a body of knowledge. - My hero, who will be forever remembered, Carl Sagan.


Edited by 5HTSynaptrip (09/17/08 06:34 PM)

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