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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Using Hypnosis to Induce Addiction
    #8875946 -

I picked up an excellent guide to this yesterday evening. (guess where!)

1) First find a substance that will emotionally alter a human.

2) Next lay down a suggestive foundation, tell them:

-If they ever go against the emotion you have the power to create for a distinguishable period of time; they have gone against nature.

-This betrayal of nature constitutes a disease.

-When you accept the disease as such it will make you more aware.

-You are not normal if they have this disease.

-Most importantly, tell them you have found a wonderful cure! Let them know it will make them natural again.




3) Build a suggestive structure ingrained in time, tell them:

-After a couple weeks you will begin to feel more consistently relaxed and comfortable.

-In a few more weeks you will notice general physiological and health improvement.

-In a few more weeks you will feel more and more relaxed, more natural, and more empowered.

-Make sure they know it is your magic medicine causing them to believe these suggestions, and not the suggestions them selves.





(thanks Doc! I'm feeling less depressed already! And what a great buzz these pills give me!)


--------------------
Know your self.
Know your substance.
Know your source.

The most distorted perspective possible is the perspective that yours is not distorted.

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Re: Using Hypnosis to Induce Addiction [Re: ExplosiveMango] * 1
    #8876096 -

Double blind studies


--------------------
The Prophecy!

Learn To Code

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Re: Using Hypnosis to Induce Addiction [Re: blewmeanie]
    #8876153 -

Wow, those studies must be pretty blind.

(That's the great thing about figuring how God makes an emotion and putting it in a pill. Very definite. Let's call it an anti-depressant!)

Now depression is real!

Edit:
I suppose I'm a bit biased though... when I was given those pills I decided my depression was rooted deeper than my chemical emotions.

After that I just learned to believe it a(way).

(But I got to make up the way, so I didn't call it being depressed anymore. I called it self belief.)

Second edit:
I should also mention hypnosis is not detectable with a double blind study. Convenient.


--------------------
Know your self.
Know your substance.
Know your source.

The most distorted perspective possible is the perspective that yours is not distorted.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Using Hypnosis to Induce Addiction [Re: ExplosiveMango]
    #8876315 -

Both people in the study would be treated for the same thing, those receiving real medication respond to it, those who are receiving a placebo do not.

EXAMPLE:
http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=3885838

Titre du document / Document title
Pilot controlled double-blind study of the hypnotic effects of zolpidem in patients with chronic learned insomnia : psychometric and polysomnographic evaluation
Auteur(s) / Author(s)
HERRMANN W. M. (1) ; KUBICKI S. T. (1) ; BODEN S. ; EICH F. X. ; ATTALI P. ; COQUELIN J.-P. (2) ;
Affiliation(s) du ou des auteurs / Author(s) Affiliation(s)
(1) Free univ. Berlin, dep. clin. psychiatry, 14050 Berlin, ALLEMAGNE
(2) Synthélabo rech., Bagneux, FRANCE

Résumé / Abstract
In a pilot double-blind trial in 21 patients with learned or idiopathic insomnia (DSM-IIIR), patients received placebo for 1 week (nights 1-7), either active (zolpidem, 10 mg) or placebo treatment for 2 weeks (nights 8-21) and then placebo for a further week (nights 22-28). Variables to measure efficacy, rebound and withdrawal were assessed daily from day 1 to day 28. Polysomnographic recordings together with sleep cycle analysis were performed on nights 7, 21 and 28. Patients treated with 10 mg zolpidem for 2 weeks had significantly improved sleep efficiency at the end of the randomised double-blind phase compared with the placebo group. Fractionated sleep-cycle analysis showed an increase in slow-wave sleep during the first 2-hour cycle after sleep onset
Revue / Journal Title
Journal of international medical research  ISSN 0300-0605  CODEN JIMRBV 
Source / Source
1993, vol. 21, no6, pp. 306-322 (22 ref.)
Langue / Language
Anglais

Editeur / Publisher
Cambridge Medical Publications, Worthing, ROYAUME-UNI (1972) (Revue)



--------------------
The Prophecy!

Learn To Code

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Re: Using Hypnosis to Induce Addiction [Re: blewmeanie]
    #8876582 -

Placebo effects can still produce detectable improvements, though.

I read an interesting study where they compared the same brand of medicine's efficacy, except the price was jacked up for half of the people involved.  The people who paid more for the medicine reported feeling better and that the medicine had worked much more effectively than for the people who paid less.  It seems that thinking your medicine must be worth more because it's expensive might actually make it worth more.  :lol:


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: Using Hypnosis to Induce Addiction [Re: deCypher]
    #8876800 -

The Cypher said:
Placebo effects can still produce detectable improvements, though.

I read an interesting study where they compared the same brand of medicine's efficacy, except the price was jacked up for half of the people involved.  The people who paid more for the medicine reported feeling better and that the medicine had worked much more effectively than for the people who paid less.  It seems that thinking your medicine must be worth more because it's expensive might actually make it worth more.  :lol:


That is true, but in that example the medication is effective in both subjects. The effects, or more accurately the perceived effects are only slightly elevated in those who have a greater belief in the effectiveness of their medication. However autonomic response has its limitations. When paired against a placebo, you do not see the same results, though the same autonomic response may be present(digestion, respiration rate, salivation, perspiration, diameter of the pupils, micturition (urination), and sexual arousal).

Suggesting that someones response to medication is nothing more than the result of "hypnosis" is simply incorrect.

That of course doesnt discount the therapeutic stimulus of the autonomic nervous system, which can sometimes IMO be a better alternative to medication anyway. Yoga is an excellent example of this.


::::::::::::::::
I quoted the list of autonomic responses from wikipedia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autonomic_nervous_system


--------------------
The Prophecy!

Learn To Code

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Re: Using Hypnosis to Induce Addiction [Re: blewmeanie]
    #8876810 -

blewmeanie said:
Both people in the study would be treated for the same thing, those receiving real medication respond to it, those who are receiving a placebo do not.

EXAMPLE:
http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=3885838

Titre du document / Document title
Pilot controlled double-blind study of the hypnotic effects of zolpidem in patients with chronic learned insomnia : psychometric and polysomnographic evaluation
Auteur(s) / Author(s)
HERRMANN W. M. (1) ; KUBICKI S. T. (1) ; BODEN S. ; EICH F. X. ; ATTALI P. ; COQUELIN J.-P. (2) ;
Affiliation(s) du ou des auteurs / Author(s) Affiliation(s)
(1) Free univ. Berlin, dep. clin. psychiatry, 14050 Berlin, ALLEMAGNE
(2) Synthélabo rech., Bagneux, FRANCE

Résumé / Abstract
In a pilot double-blind trial in 21 patients with learned or idiopathic insomnia (DSM-IIIR), patients received placebo for 1 week (nights 1-7), either active (zolpidem, 10 mg) or placebo treatment for 2 weeks (nights 8-21) and then placebo for a further week (nights 22-28). Variables to measure efficacy, rebound and withdrawal were assessed daily from day 1 to day 28. Polysomnographic recordings together with sleep cycle analysis were performed on nights 7, 21 and 28. Patients treated with 10 mg zolpidem for 2 weeks had significantly improved sleep efficiency at the end of the randomised double-blind phase compared with the placebo group. Fractionated sleep-cycle analysis showed an increase in slow-wave sleep during the first 2-hour cycle after sleep onset
Revue / Journal Title
Journal of international medical research  ISSN 0300-0605  CODEN JIMRBV 
Source / Source
1993, vol. 21, no6, pp. 306-322 (22 ref.)
Langue / Language
Anglais

Editeur / Publisher
Cambridge Medical Publications, Worthing, ROYAUME-UNI (1972) (Revue)




Well I definitely agree with you.

You do have to use the hypnotic suggestion that the drug buzz is what will cure the depression. That is how you can succeed with the hypnosis while still successfully failing with the placebo in your double blind study.

(I'm not suggesting you can't feel anti-depressants, they're similar to DXM in my opinion)

Depression used to just be another word for natural sadness.
Since prozac came along it has been used to mean medical disorder.

I just think it's the medic who's being disorderly, and the sadness who's being natural.

I think people should be allowed to be high all the time if they want, even on an addictive drug. I'm not so certain about the ethics in making them diseased all the time, especially on an addictive disease.


--------------------
Know your self.
Know your substance.
Know your source.

The most distorted perspective possible is the perspective that yours is not distorted.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Using Hypnosis to Induce Addiction [Re: ExplosiveMango]
    #8876912 -

Depression is sometimes the result of a chemical process in the brain, and has nothing to do with sadness. Often the person doesn't even feel sad, they don't feel anything at all.

Disease means that it is an abnormal process, that isn't favorable to the health of the patient.

Personally I would rather see allot more exercise, and allot less medication being prescribed.


--------------------
The Prophecy!

Learn To Code

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Re: Using Hypnosis to Induce Addiction [Re: blewmeanie]
    #8877118 -

blewmeanie said:
Depression is sometimes the result of a chemical process in the brain, and has nothing to do with sadness. Often the person doesn't even feel sad, they don't feel anything at all.


When you're talking about emotion- there is always a neuro chemical link.

Keep in mind, nobody fully understands how the brain works, SSRI's (and especially SNRI's) are still mystery pills to a large extent.

Certainly people should be allowed to feel however they want to, especially if it helps stabilize them. That's why humans have the right to intoxication (too bad they also have the right to persecution).

Quote:
Disease means that it is an abnormal process, that isn't favorable to the health of the patient.



Right, and I for one was very disappointed when I found out how much psychic fulfillment had been denied me in favour of a simple economic loop ending in the pocket of Mr. Pill.  Happiness cannot be felt without sadness. Something cannot be felt without nothing.

When I took away the name they gave me for my sad feelings, and replaced it with self awareness... the sad feelings mysteriously vanished.

Quote:
Personally I would rather see alot more exercise, and allot less medication being prescribed.



Me too, but also I would like to see depression as being seen as a natural human phase, not something a Doctor can hyptnotize you into for his purposes. Depression is an opinion, not a fact.


--------------------
Know your self.
Know your substance.
Know your source.

The most distorted perspective possible is the perspective that yours is not distorted.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Using Hypnosis to Induce Addiction [Re: ExplosiveMango]
    #8877218 -

ExplosiveMango said:
Me too, but also I would like to see depression as being seen as a natural human phase, not something a Doctor can hyptnotize you into for his purposes. Depression is an opinion, not a fact. 


Have you ever personally dealt with true clinical depression? You don't feel sad, you don't feel anything. Its an absolute indifference, and separation from anything, and everything. I have an aunt who hasn't spoken a word to anyone in about 30 years, she just stairs blankly at a wall. Shes not dumb, or brain damaged, she just doesn't feel anything.


--------------------
The Prophecy!

Learn To Code

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Re: Using Hypnosis to Induce Addiction [Re: blewmeanie]
    #8877223 -

blewmeanie said:
Personally I would rather see allot more exercise, and allot less medication being prescribed.


QFT.  I'd bet that if everyone currently on antidepressants were put on an exercise regimen, subjected to a good diet, and got a decent amount of sleep every night, their depression would dramatically improve.


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: Using Hypnosis to Induce Addiction [Re: deCypher]
    #8877292 -

Quote:
Have you ever personally dealt with true clinical depression?


I have, not especially personally. And I do believe that those people have a right to whatever intoxication betters them in life.

I think drug treatment can be very effective in situations like that (sometimes). And it does at first seem like defining those people as something might help their cause.

My problem is when that 'clinical' depression starts creeping outward, and denying freedom of mind to more and more people. And when, as a hypnotist, I find a pamphlet in a drug store laid out full of unambiguous 'medically approved' suggestions about how you might improve your life through this categorization;
I feel like I have found an explanation as to why this world has a 'depression rate' that climbs on a consistent basis.

When I look back at the problem, I recognize that I should not have been in that category- and people like your Aunt, may in fact get better results from being treated as 'people' rather than 'depressed people', whatever the treatment.

Don't get me wrong, drugs can be a good thing. But when a doctor is allowed to look at you and 'correctly' see something that you are not licensed to see, I see a problem.



Edit: I am going with the assumption that you mean 'severe clinical depression' (since even I once had 'clinical depression')


--------------------
Know your self.
Know your substance.
Know your source.

The most distorted perspective possible is the perspective that yours is not distorted.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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