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OfflineBbac
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Registered: 01/24/02
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Last seen: 15 years, 5 months
Sterilizing in the oven
    #530170 - 01/24/02 02:50 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Why all this talk about sterilizing in pressurecookers?
Why not just use the oven? Set the temperature to 200 C and let those bacterias burn?

BBac


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OfflineScourge
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Registered: 12/04/00
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Re: Sterilizing in the oven [Re: Bbac]
    #530179 - 01/24/02 02:55 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

a presure cooker is the best way to go. if that's not an option then use simple substrate and a pot with a lid. an oven would not work.


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"Those who walk in Love and Truth shall grow in Honor and Strength."


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Offlinesillvyr
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Registered: 01/12/02
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Re: Sterilizing in the oven [Re: Bbac]
    #530189 - 01/24/02 03:04 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Not everything is that easy. I recently wondered this also, but not having tried growing I never would have found out. This is why:
1. Major concern is that dry heat does not help--if you dry out the growing medium, you will grow nothing.
2. Heat is not the only concern--certain types of bateria can withstand heat, but they cannot withstand heat AND pressure. Pressure cooking/canning is the only way to be sure the contaminants are exterminated.
3. Ovens are good for pre-sterilizing substrate and inoculating jars, but that's it.
These are the reasons that the great folks here taught me, thanks to CaptainMaxMushroom & ralphster44 who answered my many questions!


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The "Little Mushrooms" are but emisaries to the Overmind.....



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InvisibleAction_Man
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Registered: 01/24/02
Posts: 91
Re: Sterilizing in the oven [Re: Scourge]
    #530190 - 01/24/02 03:05 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Well this is my ist time doing this & I uesd the oven like a water bath. I took a large pan put a towel on the bottom. Put my jars in the pan and filled it with water. I left them in for 1 hour & it worked great. I'll try the pot on the stove next time.


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Cookin up some fuel for us all. :laugh:


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OfflineBbac
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Re: Sterilizing in the oven [Re: sillvyr]
    #530206 - 01/24/02 03:33 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

sllvyr:

1. Dont get this one. The growing medium is already dry when you sterilize it. Moisture is added afterwards, sterilized water.
2. How do you know this? I talked to a biologist some time ago and he told me that if you first heat the bacteria to 70 C and then quickly moved them to 170 C, they would all die. Something about tricking them to start growing, then when they sensed no fear, nuke them with to high temperatures.
3. First you say ovens dont sterlize, then you say oen can use them for pre-sterilizing.

Just looking for answers.

Bbac


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Offlinefungichick
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Re: Sterilizing in the oven [Re: Bbac]
    #530230 - 01/24/02 04:09 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

If you're sterilizing jars of substrate to grow mushrooms the substrate should NOT dry when you sterilize them. The most basic substrate consists of brown rice powder, vermiculite, and water. If you plan on inoculating dry substrate you wont be growing mushrooms that's for sure. I use presterilization in the oven as an additional precaution as I do not have a pressure cooker. I then take my presterilized ingredients, mix up the substrate and boil/steam them for 1 hour. Excessive? Maybe but it works and I've had 0 jars fall victim to contams since.

Why not do an experiment yourself and learn from first hand experience. Mix up some substrate that you've sterilized in the oven add your "sterilized" water and place it in a jar. Then take another jar, mix up some substrate, stick it in a pressure cooker or boil/steam the jar on the stove for 1 hour. Leave the jars alone for a week - do a comparison - and see what kind of nifty nasties you can grow or not grow.

If you're sterilizing your substrate in the oven and then mixing up your jars, the second you take your substrate out of your oven it is NOT in a sterile environment anymore. It is subject to whatever contams may be floating around in your kitchen/house etc. When you sterilize your jars of substrate in a pressure cooker, or on the stove you are keeping your substrate in a closed environment safe from whatever may be floating around.


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OfflineBbac
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Re: Sterilizing in the oven [Re: fungichick]
    #530289 - 01/24/02 05:34 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Ok, the substrate need to be wet. Why? Is it because sterilized water from the pharmacy is not really 100% sterile?
(In the Quart Jar Way-Revisited method, the substrate does not include vermiculite, only brown rice and water.- No point, just mentioning it)

Dont need to do a comparison, trust you on this one. I am just the kind of guy who wants to know WHY?

The reason I am asking is because I Dont have a pressurecooker and I dont have a large pot.
Couldt I just mix the substrate (with water) ,put the lids on (loose), and then fry it in the oven?

Bbac


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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero

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Registered: 04/27/01
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Re: Sterilizing in the oven [Re: Bbac]
    #531093 - 01/25/02 04:24 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Heat sterilization will work, but only for objects that wont melt and for objects that don't need to stay wet. Remember that temperature and pressure are directly proportional to each other and inversely proportional to volume. If the volume is constant, such as inside a pressure cooker, and the pressure goes up (from the steam), then the temperature of the water can go above its boiling point at STP (100C). Using steam sterilization, an object must be kept at a temperature of at least 121C for thirty minutes or more to kill the majority of all endospores. Using dry heat sterilization, you will need to heat the same object to 165C for two to four hours for similiar results.

One downside to steam sterilization is the dulling effect it has on knife edges and needle points. Dry heat, chemical, or irradiation are often used for metal objects which must retain their sharpness.

If you want more information, see the following URLs:

http://www.bact.wisc.edu/microtextbook/ControlGrowth/sterilization.html
http://www.lbl.gov/ehs/biosafety/Biosafety_Manual/html/sterilization.htm




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Just another spore in the wind.


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