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Invisiblemikonn
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Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:)
    #4299541 - 06/15/05 03:20 PM (12 years, 16 days ago)

Hello all,

Today was a good hunting day here in md/dc(usa), even though it is damn hot and humid. Let me get to the question.

I found these in two locations (a nice rolling church lawn/grounds and a municipal park/field) which are seperate by about a mile or more.

They're anywhere from 2 to 4 inches in length. Have a very firm stem. Thier caps are nearly ballon shape at times. Though there are a few that are more pointed.


Many of them have really good blue at there bases, actually the blueing was more clear before I started pinching them. Does anyone recognize these little ladies? I've looked around and have not been able to find ones that have there particular look. Oh, and I have no idea how to take a spore print from them. I've tried a could of ways but no real luck so far.

Also today, I found some more of those copey looking ones from yesterday, but this time at the church, which is nearly 2 miles from my house.

Also found some what I suspect to be pan subbs at the field

I'm waiting on the prints right now.

So any help on these ones up top would be great.
thanks


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OfflineRebirtha
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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: mikonn]
    #4299982 - 06/15/05 05:18 PM (12 years, 16 days ago)

Doesn't look like anything active to me, if thats what you were looking for.

Once you have those prints, we can pretty much give you a good idea on what the mushrooms are.


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Offlinehot48yearolds
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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: Rebirtha]
    #4300513 - 06/15/05 07:02 PM (12 years, 16 days ago)

they look like cope cyans, only if they actually bruised blue.


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Invisiblemikonn
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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: hot48yearolds]
    #4300720 - 06/15/05 08:01 PM (12 years, 16 days ago)

They do actually bruise blue, though not as dramtically as cope cyans normally do, from what I understand.



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Invisiblemikonn
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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: mikonn]
    #4300729 - 06/15/05 08:04 PM (12 years, 16 days ago)

So here's a tad more info. The gills are sorta of a medium buff color and attached.

Evan --- Why do you say that they don't look like anything active? What are you seeing or not seeing? Thanks.


Edited by mikonn (06/15/05 10:24 PM)


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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: mikonn]
    #4300969 - 06/15/05 09:10 PM (12 years, 16 days ago)

Hmm intersting find, they do look like they might be an active species. I find it hard to differentiate between the different species you pointed out, got any better pics of the ones you thought were subbs? Did you take any spore prints?

Hot and humid is definately not the right kind of weather for liberties, and they would be weird looking liberties anyway. Maybe some sort of Panaeolus? Hmm I'm not sure though.

Grab some spore prints, see if they come out dark purply-brown or black. :thumbup:


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Invisiblemikonn
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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: haunted]
    #4301263 - 06/15/05 10:36 PM (12 years, 16 days ago)

The possible pan subbs prints came out black, though not as black as the copes, its strange and it took me a while to decide, but after comparing them to some other prints a have and getting some better light, i'm pretty sure they are pan subbs, maybe.

Yeah, I don't know about the first ones. I found this picture on erowid that sorta looks like them, but it's fuzzy.

Does anyone have any suggestions on how to get a spore print from one of these?


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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: mikonn]
    #4302198 - 06/16/05 02:22 AM (12 years, 16 days ago)

I would say cope cyans. The last time i went i found a couple of those but mostley pan ants. Where do u live?


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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: sub1ime421]
    #4302246 - 06/16/05 02:38 AM (12 years, 16 days ago)

Where do you people get off on saying they're Cope cyans? He found them in Maryland. Copes don't grow within 1000 miles of there.

Think before you give out ID's people! Thats a rule in here, you know. You could get someone killed.

As far as how to take a spore print goes: Read the rules thread, I'm fairly sure it's mentioned in there.


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Invisiblemikonn
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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: Gumby]
    #4302628 - 06/16/05 07:04 AM (12 years, 15 days ago)

Thanks for looking in on my post Gumby. The cope cyan question was asked in an earlier thread, though not answered definatively, mushroom john did weigh in on the matter
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/4293564#Post4293564
the the jury is still out as to what they might be. Jet black spores, moderate blueing, maryland?

as for the first pictures in this post-- I understand the process undertaken to produce spore prints, which is what is addressed in the sticky, what I'm wondering is if you might have any "tips" on getting prints from such "closed off" specimen. I'm am going to look for fresh ones today and will try for prints again, in the mean time, do they look macroscopically similar to anything you might recall, I am refering to the first type shown. Thanks.


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Invisibleshroomydan
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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: mikonn]
    #4302774 - 06/16/05 09:39 AM (12 years, 15 days ago)

The first ones look like Conocybes to me. Something close to Conocybe tenera. I don't see any bluing. Many times white mycelium at the base of a mushroom can appear blue, especially if you are trying to see blue. Some Conocybes are deadly, so proceed with caution.


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Invisiblemikonn
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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: shroomydan]
    #4303508 - 06/16/05 02:11 PM (12 years, 15 days ago)

Thanks for looking. There is definate blueing. I know that I've stared at the mycelium so much before that it looked blue. but this is blue. I'll post some better pics later.


Edited by mikonn (06/16/05 03:48 PM)


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Invisiblemikonn
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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: mikonn]
    #4303902 - 06/16/05 04:00 PM (12 years, 15 days ago)

alright, I got some fresh specimens of the "liberty cap"-ish ones that were pictured first.

and here is a close-up on the blueing...

now im trying again to get prints, though these little buggers haven't seemed to drop a single one. ?


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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: mikonn]
    #4304002 - 06/16/05 04:23 PM (12 years, 15 days ago)

It looks like an active conocybe, perhaps Conocybe cyanopus which does grow in lawns in the summer in temperate regions. The bluing base and buff gills are correct as well. A spore print would really help confirm the ID. A very interesting find. Well done.

mikonn, check your PM's


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Invisiblemikonn
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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: Workman]
    #4304512 - 06/16/05 06:20 PM (12 years, 15 days ago)

Very interesting, thanks alot. Can't wait to find out what they are.

I still can't get any spores out of these little dears. We'll see.

I found a few more of the disputed "cope cyan"-ish ones today, again at both the church and the field. That is three distinct localities (here in Maryland/usa) where I have found them.

i think something else might have snuck into this picture.
Here is a close up on the blueing.

There is blueing at the bases and on a few of the caps and margins. The picture does't quit show it too great. I'm interested in some of the Mods opinions. Thanks alot.


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Invisiblemikonn
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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: mikonn]
    #4306757 - 06/17/05 07:27 AM (12 years, 14 days ago)

Any idea?


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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: mikonn]
    #4306772 - 06/17/05 07:54 AM (12 years, 14 days ago)

Very interesting finds.

So I put it all together using your own words:

Habitat: church lawn/grounds and a municipal park/field
Cap: nearly ballon shape at times, though there are a few that are more pointed
Gills: medium buff color, attached
Stem: from 2 to 4 inches in length, very firm, bruising blue at the base

I don't know about them being active Conocybes though. Conocybe cyanopus and Conocybe smithii usually have ochraceous tawny to cinnamon brown to dark brown caps, I don't know how hygrophanous they are, but these have an altogether different look. Also Conocybe stems tend to be fragile and easily breaking apart. (I can't say I have seen an active Conocybe in my lifetime though :smirk:). They do look like lawn Conocybes, but what species is beyond me. Also bluing is confusing. Please provide us with more details, mikonn. Here's an outline that you might find useful.

There are very few photos of active Conocybes.

 


Those are some photos by Beug, Stamets and mjshroomer, see the file name for the species name.


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Edited by ivi (06/17/05 08:24 AM)


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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: ivi]
    #4307752 - 06/17/05 03:56 PM (12 years, 14 days ago)

I do agree that the tough stem feature is a problem, but I haven't seen any active conocybes myself. The few pictures are not very helpful in showing species variation, so I think its still possible that its C. cyanopus, but equally likely that its something undescribed. The caps seem dry and that would cause the disparity in color between the published photos and the collection here.


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Exotic Spore Supply
Reinvesting 25% of Sales Towards Basic Research and Species Identification :amanitajar:


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Invisiblemikonn
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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: Workman]
    #4307783 - 06/17/05 04:05 PM (12 years, 14 days ago)

Workman,

Please take a look at my new post. I know my observations are not grounded in a great deal of scientific knowledge, however there may be some more information for you.

Thanks.


Edited by mikonn (06/17/05 04:12 PM)


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OfflineGumbyM
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Re: Good hunt today..."Liberty Cap"ish id help:) [Re: mikonn]
    #4308143 - 06/17/05 05:46 PM (12 years, 14 days ago)

I can't nail it down to a species but it does appear that you have some active Panaeolus species, the bluing is pretty apparent on them. Great find. :smile:


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