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InvisibleSearch59
Yet anotherhobby for me.

Registered: 10/28/04
Posts: 116
Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti?
    #3382208 - 11/19/04 12:52 AM (12 years, 21 days ago)

I just wanted to start this thread to get everyone that does have hydrocacti, to talk about it.

I have a single hydro-sanpedro, and ive noticed about 1/2 inch growth on the top in a 2 week period. Is this normal? Fast? Slow?

My hydro cacti setup is this:
The bottom of the cacti is 1 inch above the highest level the water gets. The roots of the cacti stretch all the way down into the bottom of the plastic container, in the water. The pebbles are nothing more than that lava pebble stuff you get any any hydro store(PH neutral). I don't change my nutrients(cept every 2 weeks), and keep the PH at 6.5 I add H2O2 to keep root rot and other pathogens from becoming a problem.(supposed to do it every day) (the amount to add can be found on the net) I basically keep all my settings the same that my vegetables will like. I dont know if the cacti will like it, but i guess we will see in the next few weeks. The cacti is under a 400wHPS. My vegetables have not out grown the area, but i fear they soon may, and i will havta pick and choose what to kill to keep up with space. (grean beans, and tomatoes are MAD space users)

When the cacti arrived, it had some dirt on the roots, and at the bottom, i just ran warm water over it for a few minutes, and gently rubbed the dirt that wouldn't come off. (you don't havta get it ALL off, just most and any that will rub lightly off) Then i put the cacti in the VERY bottom of the plastic container, with no lava pellets in it, i then, added pellets till it was full, and SLOWLY lifed and shook the cacti, then added more pellets, lifted/shook again, more pellets, lifted/shook again. The goal was to get pellets under the cacti, while keeping the roots as deep as possible. As soon as the cacti's bottom was high enough to where, highest water was about 1 inch below the bottom of the cacti, I stopped pulling the cacti up and filled the rest in with the pebbles. you may have to tie or secure your cacti depending on how deep its in the pebbles, and how many roots you have.
So, lets say my HIGHEST water level was at 5inches on the plastic container from the bottom up. My cacti sits at 6 inches from the bottom up, never acutally in the water, HOWEVER the roots stretch well into the water, all the way down to the bottom of the plastic container. (the pic i posted above shows the lines if you click it)

Much more than that, I don't know, as this is my first attempt at hydro cacti. For nutrients, I use microGrow, microFloral, and MicroBloom, or something. I never use solid nutrients, they suck compared to liquid. My first attempt at hydro veggies, i had solid nutrients, and when I switched to liquid, it was like giving the plants caffiene.



--------------------
The only beneficiaries of Prohibition were bootleggers(drug makers), crime bosses(drug pushers), and the forces of big government(DEA).
(wheres the benefit for the consumer?)

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http://www.di.fm/mp3/chillout96k.pls

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InvisibleSearch59
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Posts: 116
Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: Search59]
    #3382234 - 11/19/04 01:01 AM (12 years, 21 days ago)

I screwed up. When i added my cacti, I forgot to treat the cacti alone for a while to kill off any bad things in the roots of the cacti.
Well, the cacti roots gave my whole hydro system some kinda root eating pathogen. My green bean is suffering bad, so after chaning the water, running water thru every plant container, rinseing all tubs, lines, pumps out, I refilled my system with just plain NO NUTRIENTS, distilled water, and then added 300ml of (3%h2o2) to 25 gal of water. I then cycled this thru my system and plants for an hour. And did this cycle for an hour every 5 hours. All day. I then again the next day, changed the water out again, added again 300ml of (3%h2o2) and again didn't put ANY nutrients in the system, and flushed the system for an hour, every 5 hours all day.
I plan to keep this system going untill I see there is no bad roots under my plants.
I currently FOLAR FEED the plants as many times a day as i can.
I also FOLAR SPRAY the plants with regular distilled water to wash away the unused nutrients at the end of the day.

I don't know when i can go back to feeding them via resivior, but my theory is if I starve the pathogen using only water and H2O2(which will acutally kill the pathogen) I hope I can kill the pathogen by not giving it nutrients.

SO DON'T add plants to your system, untill you have treated them with some kinda treatment for a week or two. I would suggest H2O2 watering the plant in a hydro system by its self or something.
I washed the roots off, but that wasn't good enough.

A big symptom of you having a root pathogen, is the leaves turn yellow or even white. My new growth on the grean bean, was pure white, untill I found a way to start killing the pathogen. Then after a day and 1/2 the new white leaf started to take on a yellow then green tint, indicating that my method is working.

UPDATE::
My method worked. Some of my vegetables started to show signs of nutrient depletion, so I started them back on a regular schedule of nutriends.
They are now showing signs of new green growth.

My H2O2(3%) Schedule works like this:
At water change, I add H2O2 first and let circulate the plants roots once. After letting it circulate I then add the nutrients.
Lastly I PH balance to 6.5 after the nutriends have been mixed well.
I add using this:
10*L/C = ML at every reservior change(usually every 2 weeks).
L=total liters of reservior
C=% of h2o2 (most have 3%)

FOR UPKEEP of the H2O2 levels, I follow this schedule
(10*L/C)/4= ML to add to reservior EVERY DAY.
When I add H2O2 I wait at least a few hours to test the PH of the reservior(after adding H2O2) every day, as to allow the H2O2 to eat away any pathogens, before I add any PH adjustments that may defeat the H2O2s strength.

So far so good for me.


--------------------
The only beneficiaries of Prohibition were bootleggers(drug makers), crime bosses(drug pushers), and the forces of big government(DEA).
(wheres the benefit for the consumer?)

You gotta check this out.
http://www.di.fm/mp3/chillout96k.pls

Ride the wave of the mellow fractal rainbow!


Edited by Search59 (11/19/04 01:06 AM)


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: Search59]
    #3383865 - 11/19/04 01:22 PM (12 years, 21 days ago)

Good job! I've been meaning to do this for a while. You have a bubbler or two in the bottom of your tank I assume? Otherwise, they would die from lack of oxygen to the roots. I use to do dwc but got away from it. I've been thinking about doing hydro cactus for over a year. Just laziness has stopped me. Good point about keeping the cactus above the water. This prevents stem rot. Cacti usuall like a higher ph than 6.5 but other plants do not so you have to have a happy medium.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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InvisibleSearch59
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Posts: 116
Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: Stonehenge]
    #3385368 - 11/19/04 06:30 PM (12 years, 21 days ago)

I have a flood and drain system. No need for a bubbler because it has now been proven that the SURFACE of water transpires more air, than a bubbler, thus fanning your water surface does more than any bubbler would. When my flood and drain system, is in its drain stage, it drains thru a opening, causing alot of splashing and resivior surface disruption. In flood and drain systems, oxygen is not a problem, due to the fact that the roots sit in water for a max of 1/2 hour, 3 times a day. The rest of the time the roots are in air.
Flood and drain is prolly the eaisest hydro system to maintain.

I just looked at my cacti base, and roots, they are both VERY healthy.
Acutally more healthy than when it was in dirt. I can see wrinkling and signs of rot where the cacti used to sit in dirt, prolly overwatered. In my hydro system, the cacti will never get any kind of ROT again. No second guessing if it has enough water. The roots take as much water as it needs, and the cacti its self never touches the water.
Perfect.
If people are serious about cacti, then mabee they should look into a flood and drain setup for their cacti. BTW already rooted cacti in DIRT CAN be converted to hydro. Read how above in my first post.
I am pretty sure i will never have to worry about ROT or over watering my cacti ever again.

(in flood and drain systems, root rot and water pathogens are a issue if one gets lazy, but if the H2O2 plan mentioned in my second post is followed, that is not a problem.


--------------------
The only beneficiaries of Prohibition were bootleggers(drug makers), crime bosses(drug pushers), and the forces of big government(DEA).
(wheres the benefit for the consumer?)

You gotta check this out.
http://www.di.fm/mp3/chillout96k.pls

Ride the wave of the mellow fractal rainbow!


Edited by Search59 (11/19/04 06:33 PM)


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InvisibleSearch59
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Posts: 116
Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: Search59]
    #3385377 - 11/19/04 06:32 PM (12 years, 21 days ago)

Having other plants in with your cacti, can be a helpfull indication of the health of your cacti. As cacti respond alot slower to problems, and then its most likely too late. Tomatoes are a GREAT hydro addition. VERY good fruit and they grow like MAD.


--------------------
The only beneficiaries of Prohibition were bootleggers(drug makers), crime bosses(drug pushers), and the forces of big government(DEA).
(wheres the benefit for the consumer?)

You gotta check this out.
http://www.di.fm/mp3/chillout96k.pls

Ride the wave of the mellow fractal rainbow!


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InvisibleToolTroll
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Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: Search59]
    #3386747 - 11/20/04 12:01 AM (12 years, 21 days ago)

Good work, Search59! I've dabbled in hydro but never thought of hydro cacti. Great idea! And you showed excellent problem solving skills, glad the pathogen was stopped. I hope you have excellent growth in the future!
P.S. Would the hydro san pedro still produce the same amount of alkaloids if it was always happy? Since it's been theorized that stressing cacti increases potency, might this method produce giant plants with fewer alkaloids? Just a thought. Peace!!


--------------------
"This whole idea that different is bad, that a change in consciousness is in itself harmful, is really one of the fundamental problems inherent in the drug war.” - Rick Doblin
my cactus collection
You vote with your dollars. Everyday. Vote responsibly.


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InvisibleSearch59
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Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: ToolTroll]
    #3387035 - 11/20/04 01:42 AM (12 years, 20 days ago)

I suppose you might be right about the stress. From what ive heard stressing can be achieved thru shade, dehydration, pruning, and mabee even lack of nutrient. All of these things CAN be done in hydro situations if your goal is that. Personally I just wanna see how fast and healthy I can get my cacti to grow, as I am sure clones of the cacti are always capable of being stessed in the future if one desired so.
In this situation, stress might be achieved from a lack of nutrients, less water schedule, and or less light time. Im sure with all combined, once could stress a healthy hydro cacti to extremes.
PH stressing is also possible with hydro also. Precision PH stressing, just enough to cause stress, but not enough to kill it.

So in my opinion, dirt VS hydro, I see it eaiser to stress hydroplants than dirt plants. In dirt its almost impossible to take out all the nutrients, and very hard to maintain a PH. Light, yea one can always move the cacti. And of coarse one can prune.
But im willing to bet, stress via PH and nutrients would produce more stress on a plant. Also, if you stressed it a bit too much, hydro is much more forgiving, as one can change the entire bin. Once you PH dirt, or take nutes out of dirt(or try too) One must leech dirt plants to get the PH back to neutral, or one must add nutrients to get dirt back to healthy state. So thats my 2 cents of stress.

Also, during my pathogen episode, ALL of my vegetables were stressed, their roots were getting eaten! Their leaves turned yellow, even white, and the growth slowed way down, the leaves turned down like they were sad, and were somewhat wilted. The stems stayed straight tho so, im pretty sure I stressed all of my veggies to their max (on accident). I wonder if my tomatoes are going to be extra tasty!
Or my peppers are going to be extra peppery... heh.. or my vadalia onion be extra sweet.
Who knows. Its possible that it will make my veggies NOT as tasty. But knowing how resiliant plants are, im sure i won't see much difference.


--------------------
The only beneficiaries of Prohibition were bootleggers(drug makers), crime bosses(drug pushers), and the forces of big government(DEA).
(wheres the benefit for the consumer?)

You gotta check this out.
http://www.di.fm/mp3/chillout96k.pls

Ride the wave of the mellow fractal rainbow!


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: Search59]
    #3388649 - 11/20/04 12:33 PM (12 years, 20 days ago)

Flood and drain or ebb and flow is a good system. However, it is a little expensive to set up and you have a pump to maintain. DWC is the best hydro system in my opinion. All you need is an aquarium air pump and a couple $2 bubbler and you are all set. As for which one puts more oxygen into the water, that's debateable. Bubblers will put more than sufficient oxygen in and the plants can only use so much. What kind of nutes are you using, are they regular hydro nutes?

If someone had a cutting they wanted to put into hydro, I would start them in either sand or aquarium pebbles until they were rooted. Then, clean off the sand or pebbles, let the roots dangle into the water and go from there.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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InvisibleSearch59
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Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: Stonehenge]
    #3392843 - 11/21/04 01:46 PM (12 years, 19 days ago)

My only issue with bubblers is that I love to have a good MIXING of the nutrients, by pumping the water all aroung the system.

If I am correct, bubblers work by putting water right below the plants roots, and then a bubbler down in the water, causing the bubbbles to splash the roots? Your right, that is a much cheaper method. But one bubbler per plant or two, times # of plants does get expensive.
flood and drain is a large initial investment, as bubblers don't have a pump, but have a air motor anyway. But after 3 or 4 air pumps, your getting into the same cost as a flood and drain.
For ease of setup bubblers would prolly be eaiser, but if you want to have a LARGE setup with lots of plants, you might wanna go with a flood and drain.


--------------------
The only beneficiaries of Prohibition were bootleggers(drug makers), crime bosses(drug pushers), and the forces of big government(DEA).
(wheres the benefit for the consumer?)

You gotta check this out.
http://www.di.fm/mp3/chillout96k.pls

Ride the wave of the mellow fractal rainbow!


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Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: Search59]
    #3393439 - 11/21/04 05:51 PM (12 years, 19 days ago)

Search, you have some points but bubblers do mix the nutes. The constant rising bubbles create an upwelling of water which mixes the solution. A 2 outlet air pump costs $10 at wallmart and they last for years and years. Bubblers cost $2 for the 10" stones and there are other sizes. You are correct in that the bubbles produce a spray of nutes as they burst. The amount of water they spray per hour is more than you might expect. Roots will constantly drip from the spray. The problem with e+f is that you have to have a water pump which is expensive and wears out. For a very large setup, e+f might be more economical but for the small time hobbyist, dwc is the way to go.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: Stonehenge]
    #3393494 - 11/21/04 06:03 PM (12 years, 19 days ago)

Having a bubbler in your E&F rez is always a good idea. It wont however wet the roots stonehenge because the rez is below the table. With bubbler you can loose the pump too, only they can live as is with no air for a few days but E&F you need to water.


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Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: Gr0wer]
    #3393514 - 11/21/04 06:08 PM (12 years, 19 days ago)

Obviously, you have to have the roots above the res to get the benefit of the spray. With e+f you can have the res a ways away from the grow table and that might be important in some cases. Air pumps seem to last forever. I don't think any of mine ever bit the dust. Water pumps work harder and seem to go bad quicker.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755


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InvisibleSearch59
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Posts: 116
Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: Stonehenge]
    #3430621 - 12/01/04 01:29 AM (12 years, 9 days ago)

Side by side, pictures of my cacti when I first bought it and put it in my hydro system

Heres the first pic


Heres a pic, 3 1/2 weeks later.


--------------------
The only beneficiaries of Prohibition were bootleggers(drug makers), crime bosses(drug pushers), and the forces of big government(DEA).
(wheres the benefit for the consumer?)

You gotta check this out.
http://www.di.fm/mp3/chillout96k.pls

Ride the wave of the mellow fractal rainbow!


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleToolTroll
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Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: Search59]
    #3432026 - 12/01/04 11:23 AM (12 years, 9 days ago)

Very nice!!! That looks like some fast growth. Now you need to put more cactus in the pots next to this one. Then you could have a grove of hydro cacti. :smile: Five shrooms for you!


--------------------
"This whole idea that different is bad, that a change in consciousness is in itself harmful, is really one of the fundamental problems inherent in the drug war.” - Rick Doblin
my cactus collection
You vote with your dollars. Everyday. Vote responsibly.


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Invisiblegr33ntea
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Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: Search59]
    #17539854 - 01/12/13 11:33 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

that is very fast growth! Got any updates on it?


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OfflineJuke Adro
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Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: gr33ntea]
    #17540214 - 01/13/13 01:00 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

8 years of electricity would be costly :lol:
that guy is long gone!


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Offlinenicechrisman
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Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: Search59]
    #17541104 - 01/13/13 09:05 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I've been wanting to experiment with growing them in straight fine pumice. I'm not gonna bother with a water system though, just top water them.

One of my good friends who is a PHD in horticulture has been telling me about the virtues of growing in straight pumice. He's been using it for orchids for years with far superior results compared to other substrates. He tells me this pumice (it's a certain special kind we get from only one supplier) would be ideal for growing ganja or cacti.


--------------------
"Cosmic Love is absolutelely ruthless and highly indifferent:
it teaches its lessons whether you like/dislike them or not."

John C. Lily

 


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Re: Do You Have Hydroponic Cacti? [Re: nicechrisman]
    #17541897 - 01/13/13 01:49 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

plz do and please make your own thread it will  be cool.


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