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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" & "choking". All hail "surface conditions" and the "int... [Re: BeefExtreme]
    #29715397 -

Then if i don't have nice beads, how do i distinguish between "choking" and "a bit too much fae"?

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" & "choking". All hail "surface conditions" and the "int... [Re: jonkerston] * 1
    #29715406 -

At full colonization, it still takes a couple days to develop beads. If it doesnt, youve got too much air.

The settings for me on my tubs =

All holes taped= minimum fae.  I do this in winter when the forced air furnace is drying things out. 

All holes open= max fae. 

I do not believe in sealed lid tubs. 


This is the very hardest part to teach and learn. There's way too many factors for any one system to work for everyone:

Size of tub
Spawn ratio
Field capacity ratio
Temp
Rh
Air pressure/elevation
Sub depth/volume

All i can really say is get it sparkling and keep it sparkling.



Show us some pictures and we can maybe give you some opinions.

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" & "choking". All hail "surface conditions" and the "int... [Re: BeefExtreme] * 1
    #29715422 -

Yo thx for the reply, much appreciated.

I spawned a couple days ago, so will take some time until fully colonized and i have to monitor things, will post once/if i reach that stage.

Was just curious how do i not choke them. Do you know what would a sealed or barely breathing tub look? When dialing my setup for a personal sweet spot, would it be better to start with possibly higher fae and "dial down" by taping and misting when surface seems dry? Or start with lower fae (no/taped holes) and "dial up" by monitoring some other properties?

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" & "choking". All hail "surface conditions" and the "int... [Re: jonkerston] * 1
    #29716390 -

I'd start with low fae. Not a sealed lid and by that i mean the lids with a gasket and latches.
The lids that just sortof click into place actually give plenty of fae to start with.

I appreciate you being here bud. Thanks for joining the shroomery. Check your ratings.

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" & "choking". All hail "surface conditions" and the "int... [Re: BeefExtreme] * 1
    #29717367 -

Thanks Beef, pleasure to be here.

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" "choking" and the exaltation of "surface conditions" and the "intuitive process of fruiting". [Re: BeefExtreme] * 1
    #29720774 -

BeefExtreme said:
cronicr said:
Agreed , cubes should never be over thought , clean spawn wet sub surface conditions harvest



:magicfingers:



As a beginner though, I have to ask; surely there is a way to optimise the conditions under which mushrooms fruit? Obviously they need fresh air and humidity, but there's always a danger of adding too little or too much (of anything, really).

I've heard different discussions about hole size to make sure that the amount of water you add (misting, for instance) doesn't evaporate too quickly, while at the same time allowing enough FAE to give the mushrooms plenty of life.

Maybe for you guys it's obvious, but I've had some good and bad flushes and (at least in my experience) the shrooms can be pretty sensitive to certain conditions. I've made the mistake of choking in the past, so that's something I'll never do again, but what's the best amount of airflow for a tub, for instance? And misting? And, out of curiousity, are these pro humidifier kits worth it or overkill?

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" "choking" and the exaltation of "surface conditions" and the "intuitive process of fruiting". [Re: chewinggum] * 2
    #29720790 -

chewinggum said:
BeefExtreme said:
cronicr said:
Agreed , cubes should never be over thought , clean spawn wet sub surface conditions harvest



:magicfingers:



As a beginner though, I have to ask; surely there is a way to optimise the conditions under which mushrooms fruit? Obviously they need fresh air and humidity, but there's always a danger of adding too little or too much (of anything, really).

I've heard different discussions about hole size to make sure that the amount of water you add (misting, for instance) doesn't evaporate too quickly, while at the same time allowing enough FAE to give the mushrooms plenty of life.

Maybe for you guys it's obvious, but I've had some good and bad flushes and (at least in my experience) the shrooms can be pretty sensitive to certain conditions. I've made the mistake of choking in the past, so that's something I'll never do again, but what's the best amount of airflow for a tub, for instance? And misting? And, out of curiousity, are these pro humidifier kits worth it or overkill?




You really don't have to overthink cubes mate. They do equally well in my 8 hole tubs as they do in my 12 hole tubs. The best amount of airflow will not be the same for you as it is for someone else so you have to try your way and dial the tub in. Beef's tubs work really nicely for me, so does the Ez Dials which are the ones I use the most.

If you want to grow exotics like Panaeolus an automated tub with a humidifier will be quite useful but if you wanna grow Cubensis etc you don't need anything other than simple ez dial monotubs or some other similar design. I wouldn't bother building a dreamer tub or setting up a tent for Cubensis since it's not necessary and I prefer to keep it as simple as possible.

Mist when/if you see the surface conditions dry out. Here is a great place to start reading about this.


--------------------

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" "choking" and the exaltation of "surface conditions" and the "intuitive process of fruiting". [Re: chewinggum] * 1
    #29720853 -

chewinggum said:
BeefExtreme said:
cronicr said:
Agreed , cubes should never be over thought , clean spawn wet sub surface conditions harvest



:magicfingers:



As a beginner though, I have to ask; surely there is a way to optimise the conditions under which mushrooms fruit? Obviously they need fresh air and humidity, but there's always a danger of adding too little or too much (of anything, really).

I've heard different discussions about hole size to make sure that the amount of water you add (misting, for instance) doesn't evaporate too quickly, while at the same time allowing enough FAE to give the mushrooms plenty of life.

Maybe for you guys it's obvious, but I've had some good and bad flushes and (at least in my experience) the shrooms can be pretty sensitive to certain conditions. I've made the mistake of choking in the past, so that's something I'll never do again, but what's the best amount of airflow for a tub, for instance? And misting? And, out of curiousity, are these pro humidifier kits worth it or overkill?



I hear ya bud.  This is why we do our best to share techniques that will generally give you the best shot at getting it right. There is no fool-proof tub or technique.  They are only a way to get you in the ballpark of good conditions. 

That was kinda the point of this whole discussion. Intuition cant be learned by reading.  You just have to experience what were talking about for yourself.

My recommendation is to take either pasty's ez dial tek or my tek (which is basically just an ez dial in a smaller cheaper tub) and from there, make small and slow changes until you find what works for you.

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" "choking" and the exaltation of "surface conditions" and the... [Re: BeefExtreme]
    #29720957 -

The monotub (with holes and polyfil) seems to be the best invention since 2010-

Has enough water/humidity retention, gas exchange and cycling of air along the substrate, etc

Barely needs any intervention.  Maybe the odd bit of fanning/misting in certain spots

Cubes/Nats (Ochra) go wild.  Many have had great luck with Tampa/Semperviva too


--------------------
Link to my journal thread

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/29701994

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" "choking" and the exaltation of "surface conditions" and the... [Re: Snazz] * 3
    #29720972 -

How much intevention depends on where you live. Pasty's design works globally if you follow the instructions and apply some intuition.

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" "choking" and the exaltation of "surface conditions" and the... [Re: BeefExtreme] * 3
    #29721413 -

Beef, I don't get around the board as much as I used to (so I just saw this), but that OP is pretty spot on.

There's a lot of overthinking with some of this stuff. I used to do it.


--------------------
Cultivating Panaeolus cyanescens


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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" "choking" and the exaltation of "surface conditions" and the... [Re: Asura] * 2
    #29721415 -

Asura said:
Beef, I don't get around the board as much as I used to (so I just saw this), but that OP is pretty spot on.

There's a lot of overthinking with some of this stuff. I used to do it.



Hey asura! Damn!
Good to see you.

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" "choking" and the exaltation of "surface conditions" and the... [Re: BeefExtreme]
    #29724754 -

Cheers for the responses Beef and Skansk. I remember actually reading up the EZ dial thread and was a bit surprised to see that his holes were tiny in comparison to the rest of the tub. Is there another element that maybe I'm not following that would allow for such tiny holes to be effective regarding FAE?

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" "choking" and the exaltation of "surface conditions" and the... [Re: chewinggum] * 1
    #29724778 -

I can tell you my first Mono was with polyfil, it's a learning curve getting the tightness and loose fitting right, I still do one layer of Micropore tape (rarely these days) (I'm old don't judge me), but the EZ Dial doesn't require anything extra, and the results out there speak for themselves.  I prefer shoeboxes or my 12qt boot boxes, with tiny holes Fahtster style, they can and WILL grow Pans passively and much more.  I initially added the holes for air and water hog PE/TaT variants when I went Albino crazy.  The 12's are also WAY more durable than the cheap 6's, at the end of the day...  Monotubs and shoeboxes... pick your poison... and get out of your own way.

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" "choking" and the exaltation of "surface conditions" and the... [Re: MushLuvR77] * 1
    #29725286 -

A whole lot of talky talky for something cows do by taking a shit... :shrug::wink:

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" "choking" and the exaltation of "surface conditions" and the... [Re: ghiajake] * 1
    #29725622 -

I've never seen a cow grow a canopy though

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" "choking" and the exaltation of "surface conditions" and the... [Re: BeefExtreme] * 1
    #29725675 -

The cow is not responsible for what Mother Nature does with the shit after it leaves the cow... :shrug:

But that said, I have seen "canopies" of cubes in cow fields back home in FL, pies covered in shrooms. That just depends on humidity, rain, heat, and placement of said pie. I'm not disagreeing with your OP, I'm reiterating how people drastically overthink things. We talk and talk and talk about how to grow the same thing cows do when they take a shit. That in itself shows how much we overthink.

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" "choking" and the exaltation of "surface conditions" and the... [Re: ghiajake] * 1
    #29725722 -

in our climate, cow shit turns into a good bit of fire kindling in a couple weeks.

Theres so many factors of climate that will effect the way a tub willl fruit, so we have to do our best to give people the best shot we can before they ultimately teach themselves how to fruit.  Its not something that is easily taught by way of written word, so i do my best to use a lot of words to basically say "use your best judgement". 

"Keep it sparkly"  is my preferred abbreviation over LITFA.  Ive never been able to fully leave a tub alone.  The damn lids always wanna rain and mat my surface so i gotta get the water off once in a while. 

Still waiting for someone to invent a rainless lid.

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" "choking" and the exaltation of "surface conditions" and the... [Re: BeefExtreme] * 1
    #29725752 -

BeefExtreme said:
in our climate, cow shit turns into a good bit of fire kindling in a couple weeks.

Theres so many factors of climate that will effect the way a tub willl fruit, so we have to do our best to give people the best shot we can before they ultimately teach themselves how to fruit.  Its not something that is easily taught by way of written word, so i do my best to use a lot of words to basically say "use your best judgement". 

"Keep it sparkly"  is my preferred abbreviation over LITFA.  Ive never been able to fully leave a tub alone.  The damn lids always wanna rain and mat my surface so i gotta get the water off once in a while. 

Still waiting for someone to invent a rainless lid.



What does "LIFTA" stand for, just saw it used in another thread and though it was a typo.

I've only ever had issues with rainy lids while my shoebox totes were colonizing. When I switched to bag culture for cubes it became a non-issue. But I started off with a walk-in GH for fruiting, then went to a martha. I don't think I ever actually fruited in a monotub, at least not that I can remember.

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Re: Death to "fruiting conditions" "choking" and the exaltation of "surface conditions" and the... [Re: ghiajake] * 1
    #29725758 -

Leave it the fuck alone.

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Shop: MagicBag.co Certified Organic All-In-One Grow Bags   Sporeworks.EU Spores for European Microscopy   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Mushroom-Hut Mono Tub Substrate   Myyco.com APE Liquid Culture For Sale   North Spore Bulk Substrate


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