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Re: Heaven and Earth [Re: Morel Guy]
    #26342262 -

Buster_Brown said:
A single instance of "communication" undoes "concrete scientific understanding" based on numerous testimonies. "concrete scientific understanding" is a misnomer.


LMFAO ...


saved7 said:
Muh jesus...



No point even discussing this further.. You enjoy that.

Morel Guy said:
Sounds like the usual WASP ate acid.



Yep, he'll come down in some years if he's lucky.

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Re: Heaven and Earth [Re: r00tcmplx]
    #26342285 -

what do you think is the object of turning the other cheek to ridicule and bifurcation?

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Re: Heaven and Earth [Re: Buster_Brown] * 1
    #26342393 -

Buster_Brown said:
what do you think is the object of turning the other cheek to ridicule and bifurcation?


I believe that concept from the bible was bullshit and was used to sterilize opposition to powerful and corrupt men... There's tons of that in there. Soft ass shit that doesn't match reality is a tell tale sign of a lie. There are points when you should walk away when you are speaking with a clown though .. that part got it right.

https://biblehub.com/matthew/7-6.htm
Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

https://biblehub.com/proverbs/26-4.htm
Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.

That being said, the sad thing about this quote is that an idiot would use it to arrogantly justify their position and having no need to debate it. I like to debate sometimes to a point to ensure I have ordered my steps in the "Truth" (word). When I understand the debate is fruitless because the opposing party either isn't informed, intelligent, has a nonsensical view they can't support.. I bow out. If a person is destroying my position with logic/rational/facts/truth.. Oh dude, I'm all ears... spank me daddy because thats where I stand to learn the most and grow the most. Not getting that here. Just a guy whose overly immersed in the bible. Maybe it's doing something monumental for him in his life. I'm past that point. Don't want to shit too much on his parade. He's defined who he is and I fail to even understand your posts.. So, i'm out
:raisemyglass:

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Re: Heaven and Earth [Re: r00tcmplx]
    #26343982 -

r00tcmplx said:
And here we go circling back to this... Before the bible 'recorded' it, other religions and civilizations did the same. They had their mystical figures just like 'jesus'.


Like who?  Who compares to the phenomenon of Jesus? 

Make an argument.  I've made mine, providing an outline of what makes Jesus so unique. 

I might add another point.  Show me another man who claimed to be God in flesh that ended up being regarded as the lynchpin of history.  (If you doubt this, then just look at the calender year)

The more you want to lump Jesus in with all other religious claims, the more I'll be happy to show you how unique and unrivaled He is, so have at it.

But I'll ask you a question, and hopefully it goes straight to your heart.  Is this REALLY about the evidence to you?  I know you can't admit here, but when you're alone with your thoughts, ask yourself: Do I actually want the truth?

I never wanted Jesus Christ to be true because that meant I had to surrender my life to Him.  So I pretended to find all sorts of reasons to doubt Him.  I preferred the darkness and suppressed the truth, and when I finally surrendered to it, the Light of Christ shone all through me and I knew it was true. 

There is no other Name on this earth that has such power.  To take someone like me, a mocker of God, only to drop to my knees in an instant in surrender to His authority.  As soon as I actually wanted the truth, He was there.  He waits for you, too, knocking at the door, waiting for you to answer. 

Once you open your heart up to Jesus and what He did for YOU on the cross, there will be no more doubt.


r00tcmplx said:
They had their Gods. They had their afterlife, spirits, and even a concept of the holy trinity. Monotheism didn't start with Christianity.


You're right, it started with Adam, and centuries later continued with Noah.

From this point on in history, the truth and memory of God followed human migration and spread throughout the world and broke up into thousands of unique ethnic variations.  This is why, all over the world, you find a collective memory of an ancient paradise/eden that humanity fell away from, typically after disobeying God.  Memory of the world-destroying Flood is also shared all over the world. 

It's easy to dismiss if you don't want to believe it, but these things really happened and the ancient world is one shared testimony of it.


r00tcmplx said:
So, it's clearly almost like philosophy/theology/theories get baked into a religion sometimes and those religions are theories/good framings that build upon old ones. At times when they become obsolete, new ones are created. Jesus is as real as Horus, Ra... They're concepts. Not magic people.


Where is Horus, where is Ra?

Funny how much of the ancient world became obsolete and yet the name of Jesus is everywhere, just as it was written that it would be.

And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
- Matthew 24:14


r00tcmplx said:
Before this dude named Jesus, there were other dudes.


Oh, where'd they go?  How come I never hear about them?  Yet I can go virtually anywhere on this earth and find people willing to lay down their lives in the name of Jesus.

r00tcmplx said:
Civilizations wrote stories and magical tales about them, about creation, about 'heaven', about 'hell'. about spirits. about 'light'.. about 'the way'... about morality.


And like I mentioned above... If your eyes were open, you'd think that would tell you something.

When the veil finally drops from your gaze, you will probably find that much of the stuff you once used as evidence against the existence of God, was indeed evidence for Him.


--------------------
"Who do you say that I am?"
- Jesus quoted in the Gospel of Matthew

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Re: Heaven and Earth [Re: saved7]
    #26344875 -

People seem to think that the Way of Jesus Christ is something relatively new in history.
Here is a claim that might sound familiar:

"I was saved from death and brought out of captivity by the blood of the lamb."

Remarkably, this sentiment would be shared by both modern day Christians and ancient Israelites, (1500 years before Jesus was even born)

In ancient Egypt, the Israelite slaves were instructed by God to paint the blood of a sacrificed lamb over the doorways of their homes.  This blood would serve as a shield, protecting them from an Angel of Death that passed over Egypt in the night.  Any dwelling place that was not protected by the lamb's blood, the firstborn son of that house would be killed.

This was a picture of the saving blood of Jesus Christ.  Just as the lamb's blood was painted on the doorpost, the blood of Christ was painted on the cross, in both cases offering protection from the destruction to come... 

"And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world."
- Revelation 13:8

Jesus IS the Lamb, the sacrifice that covers up your sins, if only you accept His blood over your heart.

This comparison shows us how Jesus is not simply a figure tacked onto an old religion.  Jesus was always the cornerstone, from the beginning of the world, and throughout the journey of Israel.  He can be found in every page of the Old Testament.  Understanding this brings so much more understanding of the immensity of what we're looking at.

Just as Jesus Christ, being the Logos, the foundation of all Order and Reason in creation... all knowledge and wisdom, wherever it may be attained, is always pointing back to Him. 

In ancient Greece, when the students of Plato were coming to realize that the material world was but a shadow of something far more pure and illuminating, they were unknowingly pointing to Jesus.

"For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
And he is before all things, and by him all things consist."

Colossians 1:16-17


--------------------
"Who do you say that I am?"
- Jesus quoted in the Gospel of Matthew

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Re: Heaven and Earth [Re: r00tcmplx]
    #26346119 -

r00tcmplx said:
Buster_Brown said:
what do you think is the object of turning the other cheek to ridicule and bifurcation?


I believe that concept from the bible was bullshit and was used to sterilize opposition to powerful and corrupt men... There's tons of that in there. Soft ass shit that doesn't match reality is a tell tale sign of a lie.


Jesus taught many things that seem backwards or self-contradictory to our worldly sensibilities.

"My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness."
- 2 Corinthians 12:9

Why would strength come out of weakness?

This goes back to the fundamental nature of reality, heaven and earth, and what we humans are, and where we're going.

Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:
But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:
For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.
- Matthew 6:19-21

Being strong and powerful and 'wise' in the world means nothing, because this world will end, just as all of us are slated for death and destruction.  Any worldly achievement is ultimately meaningless.  So to put all your cares in the world, your goals, your status, your treasure, your flesh, is pointless and powerless.  It is all dead and gone already.. like a long running TV-series approaching its predetermined cancellation date.

Real power is only found in heaven, the kingdom of God.  This is the eternal kingdom with no beginning or ending, where all meaning, and beauty, and truth, and life flows freely for all time. 

So "turning the other cheek" is actually a statement of real power.  It says "I have nothing invested in this person/body on earth.  You have no power to offend me.  Go ahead and strike me.  Even if you destroy my body, it matters not, for my real life is already sealed in heaven above." ... In this way, the lowliest, meekest peasant rises above the mightiest kings of the earth.

By contrast, being offended or vengeful when someone hurts you, is like investing in the fallen world... exalting your earthly self as something important which must be defended... It's like heaping up treasure and guarding it in a sinking ship.

The truth is, if we've accepted Jesus Christ into your hearts, then we are dead already in this world, buried at the foot of the Cross, and our real lives are hidden in Christ above.


This is a basic theme in the Bible.  "Pride comes before the Fall."

The mighty men and wise men of this world will ultimately be cut down, just as the flowers of the field. 
To exhalt oneself in a cursed, fallen world, is no exhaltation at all, but an invitation to destruction.

But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;
And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:

- 1 Corinthians 27-28

God's power is demonstrated even moreso by using weak things to overpower mighty things.

This is the story of Jesus.  In His torment, humiliation, and death on the cross, He was glorified and overcame all the powers of darkness in the world, even death itself.

And now we have the choice to follow Jesus to heaven, or lay up our treasures here on a corrupted earth.


--------------------
"Who do you say that I am?"
- Jesus quoted in the Gospel of Matthew

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Re: Heaven and Earth [Re: saved7]
    #26349809 -

Hate to burst your bubble bro, but if I'm correct, the user you're attempting to debate with is on an extended leave from the forums.


--------------------

"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one’s ignorance." — Confucius

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