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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] * 2
    #25719895 -

[CBT] cognitive behavioral therapy

form 10.2 [a guide for the sick]

Mind-reading (he thinks I'm a loser or he think I'm amazing)
Fortunetelling (predicting the future negatively or positively)
Catastrophizing (he's going to do terrible or I'm going to do terrible)
Labeling (you assign global negative traits to yourself or others)
Discounting positives (positive things that one does are trivial)
Negative-filtering (attending only to the people who don't like you)
Overgeneralizing (concentrating on a sequence of negatives)
Dichotomous thinking (concentrating on a global pattern of negatives based on a single incident. "I seem to fail at a lot of things.")
Shoulds (what is vs. what should be)
Personalizing (disproportionate blame for negative events)
Blaming (the source of your negative feeling: other person)
Unfair Comparisons (you interpret events in terms of standards that are unrealistic. Who has the biggest dick)
Regret Orientation (could have done better in the past, forgetting what you can do better now)
What if? (what if I get cancer?)
Emotional Reasoning (I feel depressed, therefore it's not working)
Inability to Disconfirm (negative beliefs are confirmed by more negative beliefs "I'm hated")
Judgement Focus (superior/inferior)

Edited by Cory Duchesne (01/05/19 04:37 PM)

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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: Cory Duchesne] * 1
    #25721097 -

Can it be self-serving to profess that one is not responsible for one's actions if one is 'sick'?

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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #25721650 -

Buster_Brown said:
Can it be self-serving to profess that one is not responsible for one's actions if one is 'sick'?


One may move from sick to patient without the anticipation of another meeting.

"Patience is the strength of the weak, impatience is the weakness of the strong." (Immanuel Kant)

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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: Cory Duchesne]
    #25722120 -

What did you get out of this therapy?

I once had a psychiatrist tell me that in order to have a disorder you need to be disordered and you are not that, since then I haven't thought of myself as having any sort of mental illness.


--------------------
I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.


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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: sudly]
    #25722295 -

sudly said:
I once had a psychiatrist tell me that in order to have a disorder you need to be disordered and you are not that, 


With order being a biased state subject to change, one might very well question your analyst' logic.

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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: sudly] * 1
    #25722389 -

sudly said:
What did you get out of this therapy?

I once had a psychiatrist tell me that in order to have a disorder you need to be disordered and you are not that, since then I haven't thought of myself as having any sort of mental illness.


I don't find it helpful to think of myself as diseased or disordered.  I follow the guidance of Stanton Peele who says not to dwell on negative beliefs about oneself or one's brain.

As for my therapist and my psychiatrist, they are both quite young so it's difficult to know what to make of their thoughts.  They have had moments of impatience and scorn with me.  They are human, and their salary and their position depends on their ability to find fault.  It's my responsibility to determine if the fault is objectively real or merely invented so that someone above could feel superior or have a job to do.

“Our moral thinking is much more like a politician searching for votes than a scientist searching for truth.”
― Jonathan Haidt, The Righteous Mind: Why Good People are Divided by Politics and Religion

Edited by Cory Duchesne (01/04/19 08:52 AM)

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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: Cory Duchesne]
    #25722708 -

I think it is important to see that the actual naked self is probably something that would be locked up permanently if those that have the keys (to the jail) could hear our conflicted internal dialog, or see the internal chaos of perception.

Fortunately most of us have decorous habits which keep up the appearance of sanity, and those that do not conform this way, can practice trigger resolution - defanging of traumas that disrupt smooth social and private behavior.


--------------------
:brainfart: _ :finger:

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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: Cory Duchesne]
    #25722860 -

Cory Duchesne said:
... It's my responsibility to determine if the fault is objectively real or merely invented so that someone above could feel superior or have a job to do.....


if your therapy is your "responsibility", and determining its value is your "responsibility", then what do you expect to get from posting about it on the internet?
(And further more, with next to no details! ? ! ? )

If I did that, I would certainly wonder why I was doing it.

It seems, ironically, that a 'part of yourself' has located the pertinent issue of the moment, (namely "responsibility"), while 'another part' keeps trying to ignore it.

Beyond pointing this out, obviously no one else can, "solve the issue".
In fact thinking about the type of therapy, the competence of the therapist, whether they "understand" you and so on, would all seem to be just distractions.

In some ways we are all alone in the world.

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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: laughingdog]
    #25722961 -

The common alternative to the work-a-day 9-5 being the State subsidy for the deranged, it naturally becomes a goal for the above average intelligence who can maintain the illusion. The object, in that case, is not to be cured.

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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #25723824 -

Buster_Brown said:
sudly said:
I once had a psychiatrist tell me that in order to have a disorder you need to be disordered and you are not that, 


With order being a biased state subject to change, one might very well question your analyst' logic.


She asked whether I thought I was being watched by the government or if I wore that sort of tinfoil hat logic and I didn't. She asked a few more questions about how generally grounded I was and the feedback was pretty good. I left feeling rather good about myself.

This was a few years ago now.


--------------------
I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.


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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: sudly]
    #25724326 -

It's a small thing for a government to preserve the goodwill of it's constituents by providing for them in their time of need, and in this manner the government is watching you isn't it?

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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: Buster_Brown] * 1
    #25724830 -

Buster_Brown said:
The common alternative to the work-a-day 9-5 being the State subsidy for the deranged, it naturally becomes a goal for the above average intelligence who can maintain the illusion. The object, in that case, is not to be cured.


in a nutshell, except for some mind numbing drugs they would admin to keep the patients docile, being holed up for free in the middle of a park, and allowed to draw or paint - healthy food, a bed, a bath...

well what more would you need.


--------------------
:brainfart: _ :finger:

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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: laughingdog]
    #25724855 -

Quote:
if your therapy is your "responsibility", and determining its value is your "responsibility", then what do you expect to get from posting about it on the internet?
(And further more, with next to no details! ? ! ? )



I post on the shroomery because of the smooth and agreeable atmosphere it gives out.  I like how many of the posters here do not worry about unnecessary detail; they have the right values and are interested in the right things, which keeps their mind away from the wrong things.

Responsibility means to not be attached to outcomes [results] and to accept the invariable surprise of the present moment.

Edited by Cory Duchesne (01/05/19 10:12 AM)

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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: Cory Duchesne] * 2
    #25724931 -

Cory Duchesne said:
Responsibility means to not be attached to outcomes [results] and to accept the invariable surprise of the present moment.


Someone needs to hang that in a workplace.

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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #25725875 -

the one who is the subtratum of your being:


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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #25728401 -

Buster_Brown said:
It's a small thing for a government to preserve the goodwill of it's constituents by providing for them in their time of need, and in this manner the government is watching you isn't it?


Medicare or social security doesn't mean the government is watching you.

The government watching you means your phones are tapped and satellites are tracking your movements etc.

To even suggest that welfare is equivalent to the government watching you is concerning to say the least.


--------------------
I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.


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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: sudly]
    #25728416 -

sudly said:
Buster_Brown said:
It's a small thing for a government to preserve the goodwill of it's constituents by providing for them in their time of need, and in this manner the government is watching you isn't it?


Medicare or social security doesn't mean the government is watching you.

The government watching you means your phones are tapped and satellites are tracking your movements etc.

To even suggest that welfare is equivalent to the government watching you is concerning to say the least.


With charity / social assistance there is always the potential for corruption in the form of incentives to be pushy, overly-helpful, dishonest or rigidly controlling of the person who is being "helped."   

http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/couch-crisis/therapeutic-lying-contradiction-terms

"O what a tangled web we weave, when first we practice to deceive."
- Sir Walter Scott

"Therapeutic lying, a concept that is currently seeping into the medical literature, is defined as the practice of deliberately deceiving patients for reasons considered in their best interest."

Edited by Cory Duchesne (01/07/19 02:01 AM)

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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: Cory Duchesne]
    #25728424 -

Malpractice by individual therapists is no indication that welfare is something that leads to government spying..

Welfare is not charity, it’s the purpose of taxes, to pay for things like roads, schools and emergency services.

Corruption usually comes in the form of quid pro-quo deals between politicians and their donors in regard to legislative decisions.


--------------------
I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.


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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: sudly]
    #25728437 -

sudly said:
To even suggest that welfare is equivalent to the government watching you is concerning to say the least.


Are you speaking for yourself or for the establishment?

That is to say, are you voicing your own concern or are you electing yourself to speak on behalf of society?

Edited by Buster_Brown (01/07/19 02:51 AM)

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Re: CBT: form 10.2 [sickness] [Re: Cory Duchesne] * 1
    #25737240 -

Cory Duchesne said:
I don't find it helpful to think of myself as diseased or disordered.  I follow the guidance of Stanton Peele who says not to dwell on negative beliefs about oneself or one's brain.


Amen

Hey, I'm pleased to see comments regarding Stanton Peele... Love that guy.

One reason an explanation of being diseased or disordered is so alluring and attractive is it's a way to avoid digging deep to discover the real (difficult) issues. Often we hear people proclaim with exuberance, "It was so great to find I have ____ disorder!" And most people are reluctant to discuss non-disease explanations for engaging in depressing, stressing, wild mood swings, etc.   

Cory Duchesne said:
“Our moral thinking is much more like a politician searching for votes than a scientist searching for truth.”

Jonathan Haidt, The Righteous Mind: Why Good People are Divided by Politics and Religion


I just got this book in the mail on Monday! It looks very interesting.

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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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