Krishna said:

the average artist doesn't get jack-shit for CD sales... most of that money goes to the record company. as well the cost of a CD is way inflated, because of the whole "advertising" industry that is behind the music industry. Canada just said it was OK, if i'm not mistaken. I think that downloading music has, if anything, increased record sales... it is quite hard to find an entire album on any P2P program, so if you like a band, you tend to purchase their CD. Take me, for example, I just bought Shpongle because I had downloaded a few tracks and really liked it. I think the whole idea of "intellectual patents" is simply bullshit...

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WildCardsRevenge said:

I actually worked it out once to about much money i've spent on CD's and music. I also worked it out to how much money was spent on bad CD's or CD's that were just one hit wonders. The total came out ot be like $3000 wasted.

Now thanks to downloading I can listen before I buy and if it is the case of a one hit wonder then I can skip buying the CD and wait until I find something I like.

I've actually bought more CD's thanks to the web because i've been exposed to music I never would have heard before IE Shpongle and the postal service and dry kill logic. I've also avoided spending money on bad CD's or one hit wonders!

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Yes, I can see that, and that's probably one of the reasons that I do occasionally download a little bit. That, and I also use it for research downloading old songs and people's covers of them, when I've turned a song into a "project"...

Personally, I think that's fine, if you ultimately pay for the stuff by the artists you enjoy and plan on listening to. I'd never think of ripping off Neil Young or Tom Waits for instance...

Xochitl said:

Using your own logic, taping a song off the radio in order to listen to a few times is an act of stealing. Using your own logic, video-taping a tv show because you were at work is theft and an act worthy of punishment.

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Hmm... I hate to disagree, but that is not what I was saying at all...

Actually, songs played on the radio are involved in a complicated royalty system, which is supported by advertising revenue; programs aired on commercial television have been paid for by advertising revenue; movies and programming on cable and satellite television have been paid for by subscriber service fees. In ALL of those cases, some revenue has been returned to the source of the media -- usually the artist/creative staff on some level.

To better clarify, the gist of my feelings on the matter is: that if you download something for personal enjoyment for free, and/or without commercial/advertising support, basically circumventing the entire financial reward system to the artist, then that is a moral decision that you have to live with.

To further clarify, I don't think it's bad to sample around for CDs you ultimately intend on purchasing. The thing that bothers me, is the folks who simply never buy anything, and seem to feel that music/art/literature/movies/software is something of no actual value, for which the artist/creator needs no actual compensation. That sort of attitude bothers me, and there is nothing that you are going to say to change that fact.

I'm glad that you are comfortable in your beliefs, that this activity does not financially hurt the artist, and that they are all ok with it. Unfortunately, I cannot share your certainty in this area. I can see no way to rationalize cheating the creative person artist/writer/musician/etc out of their compensation.

I'm not going to sit here and defend the record companies, or capitalism, or distribution/advertising costs, or studio costs, or the way things work in general. However, I am going to give a little shout out to the people who make the music, art, literature, movies, etc, and the fact that what they do has value, and deserves compensation.

It's basically like this. Each individual knows what they are doing; why they are doing it; and should be able to figure out the consequences of their actions. If someone thinks it's ok to collect volumes of free entertainment from their favorite artist without any cost or compensation, then that's fine by me. However, that is not how I feel, and I do have to live with myself. Hence, my purchases far outweigh my downloads...

In other words, feel free to think, act, and rationalize, however you want. I'm not telling you what to do. I'm just stating my point of view on the matter, but like I said, I knew by even answering in this thread, that I'm going to take some flak, because I'm tampering with people's perceived god-given right to free entertainment regardless of economic consequences to the creative people behind the entertainment, and economic structures which enable those people to produce work...

PS: I really don't like having to take the same side as the RIAA and the MPAA, here, as they are obviously anachronistic dinosaurs who have a history of artist abuse. Howfuckingever, it just seems logical to me, that if I download all my albums and don't buy them, then I am ripping off the very artists that I appreciate. In a tertiary economy, stealing bits isn't much different than stealing apples. Seems like bad karma to me...