Home | Community | Message Board
You are not signed in.
Sign In New Account
Forum Index Search Posts Trusted Vendors Highlights Galleries FAQ User List Chat Store Random Growery


This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.

Community > The Pub
Threaded Mode Threaded  Previous topic Previous  View all topics Index  Next topic Next 

Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   Sporeworks.EU Spores for European Microscopy   North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale

Jump to first unread post Pages: | 1 | 2 | 3 |  [ show all ]
Re: Kids on meds [Re: lovelaughlibs]
    #24108214 -

Thankfully even at times when I did bad in school my parents are smart enough to keep me away from presription stimulants, however I do feel that ritalin, when used occasionally and by my own free will as an adult is quite ok
It helps me focus and get through things I have no interest in
Everything in moderation I guess

Giving stimulants to super young kids at an age where they have no idea about the implications on their brains and bodies, now thats a different story


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: Asante]
    #24108466 -

i was one of them




Amphetamine between my dyafunctonal family gave me a pretty messed up n malnourished drug induced anxiety hell for years,  I call my childhood




Happy as can be now :smile:


--------------------
:sunny::inlove::peyotespectrum::peyotespectrum::inlove::sunny:
And to everyone who thinks life is just a game,
Do you like the part you are playing?
This is the time in life I am living!
And I face each day with a smile :smile:
My music Library of Synthesizer goodness

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: SunnyD]
    #24108476 -

I feel like what it boils down to is that its an easy fix. Kid struggling in school, just put em on adderall. Kids anxious, put em on benzos. Kid depressed, put em on an SSRI. Nobody wants to deal with their problems anymore when theres an easy fix available. This is something I'm pretty passionate about, as I've got moderately bad social anxiety, which benzos help tremendously, but I refuse to start a benzo habit. I know way to many people who nonchalantly hit up a psych for benzos/adderall/ssris

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: ergoticmandala]
    #24108500 -

Children are not supposed to sit still in a cage.

The system wants them on the government bread and cheese.

Drugs move from the counter culture to the culture. Suddenly your ten year old daughter is on zoloft when really she needs to be prescribed the summer shade.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: czech]
    #24108550 -

I wish I didn't get on antidepressants at 14.

But I had the choice between therapy and drugs or the psych ward.


I don't feel like I've ever had a solid baseline. Not since puberty. But that's why I disagree with putting kids on antidepressants. Their bodies and minds are still developing and hormonal changes and school life makes most young teenagers unhappy. Whereas antidepressants are supposedly for chemical imbalances in the brain, not hormonal imbalances. They treat the wrong thing.


--------------------
          :dancingbear: Free time is the only time :dancingbear:                    :thatsinteresting:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: CookieCrumbs] * 1
    #24108650 -

Hormones are chemicals

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: CookieCrumbs] * 2
    #24108683 -

My step son has had behavioral problems since he started school.  He wasn't mean and didn't want to hurt anyone mentally or physically but sometimes would say goofy stuff and sometimes that offended other students.  He couldn't sit still and would say whatever popped into his head.  He also had a hard time listening to teachers and following directions.  At home he was some trouble but when your 4 to 6 or so what kid doesn't get ornery.  I thought nothing of his behavior in terms of him needing medication or counseling.  But it got so bad in school, so the teachers say, that they wanted us to do something medically.  He was always disciplined at home and it the usual punishment, time outs, talking to, sometimes yelling and they seemed to work to some extent.

Well teachers talked his mom into taking him to a doctor, they said go to a therapist, after 5 minutes at the therapist they said get him on adderall.  I said no so we went around to different doctors trying to find one who had his best interest in mind and just didn't want to throw pills at him, and we did find some that worked for awhile but no one really stuck.  He was diagnosed with autism though and he does seem to be in the spectrum, just not terribly bad.

Eventually we tried adderall after he went through a very bad behavioral period.  It didn't help him so they tried something else which was less intrusive and it does seem to help him.  I don't really like him being on anything but he had no friends and all the kids made fun of him because he was different, plus his grades were bad and seeing him depressed and go through this I changed my mind about the medications after I've seen a huge improvement from him.  He is a happy kid now with many friends and many hobbies.

I want to also add though that we just did not through pills at him.  We take him to talk to therapists he likes and also have the school involved in improving his condition.  He's in third grade now and I think the teacher he has now is wonderful, she is very patient and helps him tremendously.  Also the principlal is involved in correcting his behavior,  he is rewarded for getting so many gold stars, which he gets for doing something good or helpful or being nice and well behaved.  This has really helped him.  I feel like his teachers from kindergarten to second grade just didn't care, wanted a quick fix because they couldn't deal with how he acted.  He was getting a bad rap for every thing that would involve him.  If there was an argument it was his fault.  If a kid lied and said he did something bad which he didn't do they believed the kid.  I was fed up with the school for the longest time until this year.  They are doing a great job with him.

It's hard to say what will make a child better off in the long run.  Medication could help him or it could make him a zombie later in life.  Also what if a child who would thrive off mess did not take them.  They could have no friends, do bad in school and become socially awkward,  this could lead to some severe mental conditions later in life also.

What it comes down to is working your butt off and spending large amounts of time figuring out what is best for your kid.  Going to one doctor and having them throw adderall at them is usually not going to turn out well. You have to dig into your kids brain and figure out how he thinks and spend time trying one thing or another until you can figure out what works

You can't just say medicating kids is bad, it messes their brains up.  And also you just can't say medicating kids is the best thing for them.  Different children need different things, and I'm all for trying everything you can do before medicating a child.  But if that's what they need then go with it.  But I don't think it should end there.  After a child is prescribed parents should continue to work with their kids and figure out what they will need in the future and possibly find a way to get them back off the medication.  All in all it's an extremely difficult subject with and insane amount of variables.  I mean I nearly wrote a whole book talking about one child and that is just a fraction of things he went through. 

In the end it comes down to working hard with your child and guiding them to be the best person they can be.


--------------------
I like lasagna.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: CookieCrumbs] * 2
    #24108698 -

I'm a bit older than most of you here...but this subject hits home for me because both myself and my two sons have been diagnosed with ADD/ ADHD....not just diagnosed, we are def in the spectrum.

First off, I did a shit ton of research and actually wrote a college paper on this subject...I happened to be taking night classes when my first son was diagnosed with ADHD by the school nurse...that's right, the school nurse. This was in the late 80's and the drug of choice was methylphenidate or Ritalin. I didn't like the list of side effects this medication had, so, I wasn't gonna let my kid take it. The school fought me on it because he was so disruptive in class and I held my ground...because I had a paper due in a college writing course, I decided to research Ritalin. What I found out was simply sickening.

First off, there was no such affliction as ADD/ADHD before the early 70's....The drug company "CIBA", made it up. In my day, they would just say we were "blessed with energy" lol. Their first tests were done in 1976 in  the city of Baltimore with mostly inner city minority kids from 6-12 yrs. old....almost all boys...The guy who did the study's name was Connor....these kids were from some really shitty backgrounds and the overall findings were that these drugs calmed them down and made them more "teachable". The bottom line was that they simply acted like a benzo by calming them down but methylphenidate is actually an amphetamine...and they didn't understand this process....so, it was called the "paradoxical effect" They still use this terminology today when describing the  way these drugs work on kids. Bottom line was that, for the reason that it made them less disruptive with not very many side effects...like appetite loss, sleep loss, headaches...these didn't bother the FDA for some reason so they gave CIBA the green light.

Their marketing strategy was to train not just physicians...but therapists, nurses and even school nurses that had absolutely no business prescribing them to detect the newly coined disorder and to recdommend the treatment plan that CIBA had introduced. They gave prizes...like Hawaiian vacations or other lavish gifts to the physicians that prescribed the most...that was their incentive plan....pretty soon, teachers were making the diagnosis themselves and recommending them to one of the bankrolled physicians to write the scripts. There were no long term studies done at all...they would say that the child should be able to come off them when they hit puberty...13 or so. This practice of awarding physicians for the quantity they prescribed became illegal in a few years but, CIBA had been successful in their marketing strategy beyond their wildest dreams by that time...Ritalin was a household name.

It was a mess....one of the studies I read compared the heart rate of a kid on ritalin to a man on cocaine...they were virtually identical. Kids lost weight, slowed down growing...but, this seemed to be acceptable collateral damage. I never put my kid on it and today he is 38 yrs. old and very successful in all facets of life. He learned some behavioral tricks to help with the mind wandering and listening deficiencies. My other son actually took Ritalin for a few years before he refused to take them anymore...I didn't have primary custody, so the decision wasn't mine to put him on it but, he was at the extreme end of the spectrum and may have actually benefited from it.

To this day, the drug works but they really don't know why....my recommendation is to only use these meds if you or your kid are on the extreme end of the spectrum. If not, behavioral therapy and diet can help immensely to slow the symptoms to a livable level.


--------------------
Look Deep Into Nature,and Then You Will Understand Everything Better.

Albert Einstein

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: czech]
    #24108796 -

czech said:
Hormones are chemicals


Yes yes but chemicals are not hormones. Mood regulating chemicals in the mind, aside from adrenaline, are distinctly different from hormones.


--------------------
          :dancingbear: Free time is the only time :dancingbear:                    :thatsinteresting:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: Asante]
    #24112455 -

I see no issue just with kids being on medication. Young people have psychiatric issues like adults.

I feel I would be much better off if I were on Adderall or Ritalin as a kid. Would have actually applied myself and followed with getting a college degree.

People-with-ADHD's brains are different than those without that disability.

'Does poor motivation or ‘bad parenting’ cause ADHD? Studies say it’s in the brain structure'
https://www.geneticliteracyproject.org/2017/02/21/poor-motivation-bad-parenting-cause-adhd-brain-studies-say-genes/

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: eeso]
    #24112590 -

Had a good friend growing up who was put on some kind of amps in first grade.
Was never the same after that.


--------------------
It's all for the :lol:s

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: Eggtimer]
    #24112598 -

From ages 6 or 7 to 13 i was fed so many amp based adhd meds by my mom. The kicker is i never even knew. I was told everydy it was allergy meds.

It makes so much sense now why i was so hyper, mind racing. Staying up till midnight listening to radio instead of sleeping.

I found out at 13 or 14 from a family friend, she told me what my mom was doing. I was quite the aware kid and flipped out and stopped taking them there on out.

Then came 13-18 5 years of withdrawl/psyche damage.
Now im about 22. All good in the hood. But man, being on amps for so long, takes a long time to adjust from and get everything chemically stable.


Fuck pharma.


--------------------
This is not a game. We are not players. We do not play.
Gymnopilus aeruginosus Gymnopilus luteofolius Panaeolopsis sp. Panaeolus bispora Panaeolus cinctulus Panaeolus olivaceus Pluteus salicinus Psilocybe allenii Psilocybe azurescens Psilocybe cyanescens Psilocybe ovoideocystidiata Psilocybe pelliculosa Psilocybe semilanceata Psilocybe stuntzii

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: larry.fisherman]
    #24112629 -

XLCaps said:
Dark_Star said:
Some kids need medications. ADHD I feel there are better ways to deal with than meds & don't agree with the amps being prescribed. But some of the other things you mentioned... . Anti-epileptics..... that's not stifling uniqueness or forcing compliance. That's a necessity to attempt to preserve development, or some semblance of it. I don't think you get how devastating seizures can be. I do, because I treat a lot of kids with severe seizure disorders. They can halt child development in its tracks. I've seen 15 year olds at a 5 month old cognitive level because they have hundreds of seizures a day, and have since they were newborns. Yeah, the medications have side effects, and they're not always effective, but they're life savers.


That sounds really disheartening, tbh.. That's really respectable work. I suppose sometimes even if a medication may or may not have negative side effects that, the positives can far outweigh the condition it's treating.

Question - I've heard a fair amount about marijuana used for seizures, if that's something you or your patients work with, how does it stack up against pharmaceutical medications?


My state just legalized medical marijuana, so I haven't seen it in practice yet. Not sure how much I will either, as most of my patients come from other countries & the physicians won't use an intervention that cannot be carried over once they return to their home countries....where there isn't necessarily medical marijuana. But I've heard incredible things. Doesn't always work, but it is highly effective.....usually when none of the other ones have worked. So it's really promising. Can't wait for it to be more widespread.


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: lovelaughlibs]
    #24112919 -

This bothers me tremendously.  Sounds like I'm not alone when it is definitely a subject that hits home for many. 

My aunt smoked cigs and I think drank while pregnant (back in 1990).  So it's no wonder my cousin was a broken baby.  My mom would recount of his psychotic behavior even as an infant, I'm not sure if she speaks truth or is justifying her sister's actions.  As a toddler he was loaded up on Ritalin and antipsychotics.  In the decade that followed my cousin killed the family dog, burned down the hen house, raped another little boy, taunted the second family dog (a Rottweiler) until it lunged and ripped his stomach open.. dog was put to sleep, etc!  It was one nightmare after another.  By the time he was a teenager they got the bright idea to take him off all meds.  THAT was the cure- he's been a semi productive /normal/ member of society ever since.  Has a kid and is an amazing father..

I was put on antidepressants at 14 and take them to this day.  They definitely level me out but the withdrawal if I don't take them every 24 hrs entails brain zaps and horrible vertigo.  They and another script I picked up over a decade ago might be the most addictive substances I've encountered.  Do not feel like it's an option to come off and my pdoc doesn't seem to want me to, either.

The industry I work in relates to this subject and from what I gather overmedicating our children seems to be engrained into our culture.


--------------------

From all I may be, or have been before,
To mingle with the Universe, and feel
What I can ne’er express, yet cannot all conceal.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: eeso] * 1
    #24112992 -

eeso said:
I see no issue just with kids being on medication. Young people have psychiatric issues like adults.

I feel I would be much better off if I were on Adderall or Ritalin as a kid. Would have actually applied myself and followed with getting a college degree.

People-with-ADHD's brains are different than those without that disability.

'Does poor motivation or ‘bad parenting’ cause ADHD? Studies say it’s in the brain structure'
https://www.geneticliteracyproject.org/2017/02/21/poor-motivation-bad-parenting-cause-adhd-brain-studies-say-genes/


Alot of people don't realize how incredibly important it is to help your child develop socially and interactively. It DOES have an effect on the development of the child's brain.

Children with learning and developmental disabilities are more likely than not ones that suffered from neglect. Children that grow to develop personality disorders and other serious psychiatric conditions are ones that were abused. It changes the structure of the brain as it develops and once it is fully developed it is irreversible.

That's why I think it's totally reckless to give children drugs all willy nilly. You are actively and chemically altering their brain structure FOR LIFE.

Seizure meds are the worst.
If not treating epilepsy.
Their brains are dependent on it and if they ever come off them in their life they will have seizures even tho they had no preexisting epilepsy condition.


--------------------
          :dancingbear: Free time is the only time :dancingbear:                    :thatsinteresting:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: CookieCrumbs]
    #24113099 -

CookieCrumbs said:
That's why I think it's totally reckless to give children drugs all willy nilly. You are actively and chemically altering their brain structure FOR LIFE.




The problem is that generating data to support such an assertion is difficult.


--------------------
...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge.  It is an indellible experience; it is forever known.  I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did.

Smith, P.  Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27.

...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely.

Osmond, H.  Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: TheHunt]
    #24113385 -

TheHunt said:
From ages 6 or 7 to 13 i was fed so many amp based adhd meds by my mom. The kicker is i never even knew. I was told everydy it was allergy meds.

It makes so much sense now why i was so hyper, mind racing. Staying up till midnight listening to radio instead of sleeping.


Sounds like you were misdiagnosed. People with ADHD have a paradoxical effect to stimulants. They 'calm' the affected person's mind rather than causing racing thoughts.

Messed up that your mother lied to you about what they were giving you though.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: Asante]
    #24113400 -

Quote:
Asante said:The problem with amphetamines, other than addiction, is that even if you take your pill like a good boy and don't get into abuisive patterns, even medical doses over time diminish your capacity to experience pleasure and undermine your higher brain functions.


But is it an absolute certainty that it will cause permanent damage?  I've been taking it for about 10 years and I feel ok....


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: CookieCrumbs]
    #24113446 -

CookieCrumbs said:
eeso said:
I see no issue just with kids being on medication. Young people have psychiatric issues like adults.

I feel I would be much better off if I were on Adderall or Ritalin as a kid. Would have actually applied myself and followed with getting a college degree.

People-with-ADHD's brains are different than those without that disability.

'Does poor motivation or ‘bad parenting’ cause ADHD? Studies say it’s in the brain structure'
https://www.geneticliteracyproject.org/2017/02/21/poor-motivation-bad-parenting-cause-adhd-brain-studies-say-genes/


Alot of people don't realize how incredibly important it is to help your child develop socially and interactively. It DOES have an effect on the development of the child's brain.

Children with learning and developmental disabilities are more likely than not ones that suffered from neglect. Children that grow to develop personality disorders and other serious psychiatric conditions are ones that were abused. It changes the structure of the brain as it develops and once it is fully developed it is irreversible.


Yes childhood abuse changes brain physiology development. But that also brings up a chicken-and-egg issue. One can't say that there is an exclusive causal relationship between abuse and serious mental illness. It is illogical to claim that all who's shown mental illness developed it due to abuse. Or that all who's been abused develop mental illness.

Quote:
That's why I think it's totally reckless to give children drugs all willy nilly. You are actively and chemically altering their brain structure FOR LIFE.


Well children aren't given drugs all "willy nilly". I'm not saying there isn't any problems with some mental health providers prescribing practices. But doctors (are supposed to) practice based on science and statistics. With psychiatry in this age that means using the most effective drug available to reduce or alleviate symptoms.

Quote:
Seizure meds are the worst.
If not treating epilepsy.
Their brains are dependent on it and if they ever come off them in their life they will have seizures even tho they had no preexisting epilepsy condition.


Provide a citation for that?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Kids on meds [Re: eeso]
    #24113457 -

If they are dependent on the medication and stop suddenly as a result of the withdrawal syndrome they may have seizures.  Even proper tapering off the medication can lower ones seizure threshold, but is generally more well tolerated and can be controlled decently with other meds.

This is the case for those who have no preexisting epilepsy condition, and even more so to those that do.

Also abuse and trauma highly transforms the brain especially in the young.  This is fact.


--------------------
Give me Liberty caps or give me Death caps.

Edited by The Blind Ass (02/23/17 02:38 PM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: | 1 | 2 | 3 |  [ show all ]

Shop: MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   Sporeworks.EU Spores for European Microscopy   North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale

Community > The Pub
Threaded Mode Threaded  Previous topic Previous  View all topics Index  Next topic Next 

Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Keeping kids OUT of the shroomery... (*LOCK*)
( 1 2 3 4 all )		 Rustik 13,955 66 05/06/03 04:02 PM
by Rustik
* YOUR KIDS AND DRUGS!?!
( 1 2 3 4 all )		 LethalX5 8,847 62 01/30/05 04:30 AM
by LethalX5
* Drug Dogs cant detect Shrooms....according to this seizure they can
( 1 2 all )		 PsillyNilly 7,353 31 05/18/13 01:29 AM
by Tripsurfer
* Seeing psych tomorrow, need advice on meds.
( 1 2 all )		 Foci 2,143 21 06/15/05 03:56 PM
by HELLA_TIGHT
* Vote Pro med MJ on CNN Puke 2,411 18 11/30/04 02:51 PM
by Silven
* METEOR SHOWER COMMING SOON! *INFORMATION HERE* Northernsoul 1,011 11 08/08/04 04:39 PM
by Northernsoul
* Ever hotbox your kids?
( 1 2 3 all )		 YouInfoIt 8,695 54 10/23/08 12:40 PM
by Brainiac
* Crystal Kids
( 1 2 all )		 chinacat72 11,708 32 01/12/12 07:09 PM
by Learyfan

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Entire Staff
909 topic views. 3 members, 271 guests and 72 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2026 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.032 seconds spending 0.009 seconds on 18 queries.