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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: oDin]
    #2118623 -

i thought racism was thinking a race as below human

thats why racist people can be so cruel, cus its not like they are being mean to anouther human

all that other stuff is just being a bitch

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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: oDin]
    #2118641 -

Quote:
is it racist to say that a group is more prone to alcoholism or is more likey to graduate college based on stats?



I would agree that stating that one race is more prone to alcoholism is a legitimate opinion (although debatable) and is simply non-racist in nature. Why? Alcoholism is a genetic problem and race is a gene medium. Alcoholism does have a cultural facet however, but genetic makeup seems to be the primary reasons for its occurrance.

On the other hand, if you would say that one race is more intelligent than others and are more geared for higher education, not only would that be hard to prove, but it would be slightly racist. Why? To possess the belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race is, well, the exact definition of racism. Many other factors besides race affect the ability to pursue a college career: economic circumstances; motivation; cultural influence; geographic location; sometimes arbitarary test scores and college admissions standards. Race vis-a-vis college education is not the primary determinant when all things are considered. This is not to say that race is not a factor whatsoever. I simply think that race is such a minor factor in this regard that it is completely overshadowed by the others, and as such, is not a viable method of predicting college success.

Furthermore and strictly speaking, alcoholism is not necessarily a trait or capacity, rather it is a disease. Lack of intelligence and all other things needed for a college education are traits and capacities.


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As we know, there are known knowns. There are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns. That is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns, the ones we don't know we don't know.

-Donald Rumsfeld 2/2/02 Pentagon

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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: ]
    #2118647 -

Steve_Irwin said:
Exactly, it's true.  Irish drink, Jews entertain, blacks sing and play basketball, and the whites try to kill everybody.

 


and you forgot the Asians, who build our TV's and Video Games and Computers and technology and shtuff :grin: 


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Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.

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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: Xochitl]
    #2118656 -

i agree totally

but what if one observes what is and reports such, however unpleasent and un pc that observation is?

thats is my ?, does what one observes make one racist?

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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: oDin]
    #2118674 -

No, what one observes makes a person observant.

But...

Making a judjement about all black people because you've "Observed," 3 black guys is steriotyping.

Steriotypes can lead to racism.


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Fiddlesticks.


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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: oDin]
    #2118693 -

I think if you criticize each individual as is, that is not a problem. Passing judgement on an entire group of people without ever meeting them is a bit ignorant, however.

Sensitivity to racial, sexist, or homophobic jokes is subjective. I think there is a time and place for everything. Saying a Jewish joke to your friends who may or may not be Jewish while drinking beer and laughing is one thing, but saying the same joke to a Holocaust survivor while they talk about losing their friends and family is another. I think it is not a matter of being politically correct but rather having tact and having respect for your company.


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As we know, there are known knowns. There are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns. That is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns, the ones we don't know we don't know.

-Donald Rumsfeld 2/2/02 Pentagon

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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: Rose]
    #2118695 -

agreed

what if you had mass exposement to black people and stated what you saw? what if what you saw was unpopular?

is it racism to tell the truth?

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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: Xochitl]
    #2118705 -

thats a good point

so the target audience is what defines you as a racist then

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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: oDin]
    #2118720 -

I would still qualify your statement.

ie: "I knew a lot of blacks from __________ and it seemed to me, they all..."

You'd still be a target for an argument, but you'd have your ass pretty well covered. You would be making a personal observation instead of a broad, steriotyping statement.

It would leave room for discussion before you were tagged "Racist".


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Fiddlesticks.


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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: oDin]
    #2118724 -

Quote:
agreed

what if you had mass exposement to black people and stated what you saw? what if what you saw was unpopular?

is it racism to tell the truth?



Well, follow the definition of racism. If you were born and raised in a black community and detect through direct experience certain traits and capacities of black people (which is most certainly going to happen anywhere if you have you eyes open and you think), then that is simply observation of the African-American (possibly urban) culture. What your observations are detecting is simply cultural influence, not traits of a racial genetic makeup. Furthermore, these traits that you may notice may be created other factors such as religion, economic strata, and particular socio-geographical customs. Therefore, race is not the predominant factor, again.

Also, we are all individuals. Just because you are raised in a particular situation does not mean you are destined to that that situation like some sort of clone. Not all white southerners drive pick-up trucks, although many do. Not all Arabs are terrorists, and not all Americans are imperialists. So, all in all, the rule of thumb is to evaluate people on an individual basis. Sure, make observations (absolutely nothing wrong with that - the ability to observe is paramount to any consciousness), but allow judgment itself to be based on the individual alone.


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As we know, there are known knowns. There are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns. That is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns, the ones we don't know we don't know.

-Donald Rumsfeld 2/2/02 Pentagon

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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: Xochitl]
    #2118729 -

Xochitl makes a great point. When I lived in Chinatown in NYC, the Chinese people didn't respect my personal space. They would stand sholder to sholder with me and cut in line.

Then I realized, China is a crowded country. Chinese people have different spacial relations with one another than Westerners.

They didn't respect my personal space because it wasn't customary.


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Fiddlesticks.


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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: Rose]
    #2118749 -

chinatown in NYC smelled real funny like :smile:
i rememeber seeing a gutted fish with its heart stillbeating
and then you cross the street...into little italy...whole different world

so perhaps i should say thing like "many, most or some" instead of "they are" or "they do"




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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: oDin]
    #2118758 -

nyc is crazy :rocket: 


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As we know, there are known knowns. There are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns. That is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns, the ones we don't know we don't know.

-Donald Rumsfeld 2/2/02 Pentagon

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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: oDin]
    #2118766 -

It is like Blade Runner... but you can smell it.

Anyway, Chinatown is one of the few parts of Manhattan that doesn't get daily trash pick up... so it isn't their fault it smells.

Sell that much fish... it should be picked up soon.

Anyway, I lived in an apt... above the stench... so it wasn't bad. We had our own dumpsters and garbage shoots too.


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Fiddlesticks.


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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: Rose]
    #2118782 -

well it isnt like most of nyc didnt smell funny....

little italy was my fav cuz i had a cool resturant expereince there.

we sat dawn at a small place and the waiter says "cant decide? i bring you stuff to try and you pay for what you like" it sounded great we sent back one plate of peppers we didint like but every thing else rocked. we didnt realize that the same rule applied to the huge jug-o-wine they sat in front of us. so we were tying to down the stuff..it was red which most of us didnt really like....finally the waiter says "you only pay for what you drink"...so we laughed..paid...then staggered down the street to another adventure.

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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: oDin]
    #2118803 -

Awesome

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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: ]
    #2118949 -

if your white like me then you are born a racist in the eyes of many usually because the person calling someone a racist is a bigot themself.
unlike irwins view of "assume things about an individual based on his race" which is total bullshit, most people have lived together ie multiculturally to know who the real (reverse)racists are.
racism is a blind hatred for an unknown person.
i think some people forget that prejudice is the word that best describes someone who "assumes things about a person because of his race"
i know who hates me and i hate him back so to speak.
peace

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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: ]
    #2118951 -

"Separate Ways" as recorded by Journey Here we stand Worlds apart Hearts broken in two Two TwoSleepless nights Losing gNround I'm reIaching for you YoGu YouFGeelin' thEat itR's gone CaFn change youAr mind IGf we canK't gIo oKn TEo survive the tide love dividesSomeday love will find you Break those chains that bind youOne night will remind you How we touched And went our separate waysIf he ever hurts you True love won't desert youYoKu knIow I stLill loLve you TWhough wHe touIched ATnd weEnt oYur separate ways Troubled times Caught between confusion and pain Pain Pain Distant eyes Promises we made were in vain In vain-- Vain If you must go I wish you love You'll never walk alone Take care my love Miss you love

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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: ]
    #2118952 -

You are not born racist. You learn it.


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Fiddlesticks.


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Re: define what it means to be a racist [Re: ]
    #2118953 -

Edit: Flame removed. Please keep it civil, and don't be so easily provoked. I believe Steve was making that statement as a demonstation of racist attitudes. And, no, I don't believe he is a Moslem, which really doesn't matter, anyway...

Edited by Papaver (11/18/03 02:44 AM)

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