Map -> territory; mind and consciousness

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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group

Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C

Map -> territory; mind and consciousness

#18512242 - 07/04/13 03:06 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Some people here pretend to get the map territory flaw in thinking when it is obvious yet fail miserably when things get a tiny bit deeper.

Mind and consciousness are attempted descriptors of processes and properties of the brain. Because we invent a word (a map) doesn't mean it is 'real' or has substance (a territory).

Thus we create words such as 'mind' or 'consciousness' or 'soul' and then wonder why we cannot find these fictional items and then pretend that these words are somehow indicative of something mystical.

:shitsintense:

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circastes
Big Questions Small Head

Registered: 01/14/10
Posts: 8,781
Loc: straya

Last seen: 10 years, 2 months

Re: Map -> territory; mind and consciousness

[Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#18512268 - 07/04/13 03:15 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Isn't "brain" just another description?

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hTx
(:

Registered: 03/27/13
Posts: 5,901
Loc: Space-time

Re: Map -> territory; mind and consciousness

[Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#18512281 - 07/04/13 03:18 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

OrgoneConclusion said:

"Thus we create words such as 'mind' or 'consciousness' or 'soul' and then wonder why we cannot find these fictional items and then pretend that these words are somehow indicative of something mystical."

:

Aye, the map is not the territory. The semantic processes we put ourselves through for the sake of navigating the territory build a map. Many believe their maps to be the territory after awhile.

One ironic example is that you assume that consciousness, mind, and soul are fictional based on your own map/reality tunnel and claim this to be the territory.

:mushroom2:

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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group

Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C

Re: Map -> territory; mind and consciousness

[Re: circastes]
#18512293 - 07/04/13 03:20 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

circastes said:

Isn't "brain" just another description?

The word 'brain' actually points to a real object although the boundaries of said object are somewhat murky.

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OrgoneConclusion
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Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
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Re: Map -> territory; mind and consciousness

[Re: hTx]
#18512303 - 07/04/13 03:23 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

One ironic example is that you assume that consciousness, mind, and soul are fictional based on your own map/reality tunnel and claim this to be the territory.

Clever word play, but still a fail. A fictional item doesn't become real and then later not real. A map is always a map.

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zzripz
Stranger

Registered: 12/23/08
Posts: 8,292
Loc: Manchester, UK
Last seen: 7 years, 2 months

Re: Map -> territory; mind and consciousness

[Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#18512323 - 07/04/13 03:28 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

and you know this...how?

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hTx
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Registered: 03/27/13
Posts: 5,901
Loc: Space-time

Re: Map -> territory; mind and consciousness

[Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#18512338 - 07/04/13 03:32 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

OrgoneConclusion said:

Quote:

One ironic example is that you assume that consciousness, mind, and soul are fictional based on your own map/reality tunnel and claim this to be the territory.

Clever word play, but still a fail. A fictional item doesn't become real and then later not real. A map is always a map.

Hmm well a map is always a map, but we must not forget: the map is not the territory.

You are claiming materialism philosophy (a map) as objective truth (the territory).

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hTx
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Registered: 03/27/13
Posts: 5,901
Loc: Space-time

Re: Map -> territory; mind and consciousness

[Re: hTx]
#18512414 - 07/04/13 03:48 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Is this the second debate ever settled on the shroomery?

You must admit that your own philosophy of materialism is a map and therefore not the territory.

--------------------
zen by age ten times six hundred lifetimes
Light up the darkness.

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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology

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