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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
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Last seen: 18 years, 9 months
hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F.
    #1653011 - 06/22/03 04:55 AM (19 years, 11 days ago)

it seems that humans basically function and survive according to how they define themselves. How one defines him/herself dictates all other behaviour/philosophy/politics. It also serves as a vessel in which we are able to survive, socially speaking. I dont know how this relates to traditional "survival" (eating, sheltar etc),

im talkin' 'bout social survival, the mental minefield we all tip-toe across.

In order to rationalize your daily activities, you need to justify them to your SELF. in order to justify them, they need to coinside with your SELF. you dig?

you dig sucka? diggitup.

so what is my point, shiiit, let me collect my thoughts for a moment, they seem to be falling apart and deconstructing themselves like little programmed reverse-pyramids.

allright. define your self, how ever you define yourself....becomes your understanding of reality.

examples:

-Im a leftist, compassionate revolutionary!!! my actions are justified because im going to save the world! wheeeee!

-Im a right-wing, hard-working familyman
I work hard so that my family can live well. I am work, I breath work. I am the end product of the evolution of the last remaining remnants of the protestant work ethic tradition.

-Im a heroin junkie, I get high on heroin.

-Im a CEO for MetaCorp Industries, I believe in that the free market is the ultimate system in which any intelligent, hard-working individual can succeed, My goal is to help my corporation grow and make profits! My life is so great!

-------and so on.

so how do you define yourself, and how does it affect your actions?


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enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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OfflineAdamist
ℚṲℰϟ✞ЇѺℵ ℛ∃Åʟḯ†У
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Registered: 11/24/01
Posts: 10,211
Loc: Bloomington, IN
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1653026 - 06/22/03 05:08 AM (19 years, 11 days ago)

I'm an introverted pot-smoking net-surfing neo-hippy who believes in self-government and equal rights to all (except insane people, who I think should be idolized and worshipped in a Hollywoodesque fashion)...

I also enjoy pornography... err, I mean erotic, spiritual art.  :rolleyes: 


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:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:


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Offlinelucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness

Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 8 years, 7 months
Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: Adamist]
    #1653168 - 06/22/03 09:40 AM (19 years, 11 days ago)

according to the Buddha it's the construction of
the S.E.L.F that's a problem. Let it go (i.e. de-construct)
and suffering shall end (which I guess equates to
"optimum functioning" if "happiness" is our ultimate goal).


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"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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InvisibleClean
the lense
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Registered: 05/11/03
Posts: 2,374
Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: lucid]
    #1653190 - 06/22/03 10:03 AM (19 years, 11 days ago)

i am somebody that fits in the gategory of people who don't fit in to many other categories.
how does that affect my actions?
good fucking question.


Edited by Clean (06/22/03 10:04 AM)


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Offlinelucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness

Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
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Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: Clean]
    #1653196 - 06/22/03 10:07 AM (19 years, 11 days ago)

>how does that affect my actions?
they'll be predictably erratic


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"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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InvisibleClean
the lense
Male User Gallery

Registered: 05/11/03
Posts: 2,374
Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: lucid]
    #1653200 - 06/22/03 10:10 AM (19 years, 11 days ago)

why yes, yes indeed :wink:


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OfflineCleverName
the cloudsshould know meby now...

Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 1,121
Loc: red earth painted with mi...
Last seen: 16 years, 7 months
Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1653397 - 06/22/03 01:14 PM (19 years, 11 days ago)

when i am thirsty, i drink
when i am hungry, i eat
when i am tired, i sleep
the sky is blue, the grass is green


--------------------
if you can't find the truth right where you are, where else do you expect to find it?

this is the purpose


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
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Last seen: 18 years, 9 months
Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: CleverName]
    #1653616 - 06/22/03 03:38 PM (19 years, 11 days ago)

forget buddha, that muthafucka was non-optional. he was fucked up, most likely a manic-depressive, we need our self, because we are our self, the idea of re-incarnation is just that....an idea, its not reality. Our world is too complex to deconstruct your self....we need our self like a soldier needs his tank. If you lose your self, your liable to get manipulated, brainwashed and put under mental lock-down.

that is reality. for-real.


--------------------
enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


Edited by atomikfunksoldier (06/22/03 03:39 PM)


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Offlinelucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness

Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
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Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1653657 - 06/22/03 04:02 PM (19 years, 11 days ago)

>he was fucked up, most likely a manic-depressive
yikes... so how do u really feel about em ?  :smirk: 


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"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 18 years, 9 months
Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: lucid]
    #1653660 - 06/22/03 04:07 PM (19 years, 11 days ago)

im serious, buddha had some serious problems, just examine the philosophy he constructed, it is a very depressing, bizarre way to look at reality.


--------------------
enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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Offlinelucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness

Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
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Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1653689 - 06/22/03 04:22 PM (19 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

atomikfunksoldier said:
im serious, buddha had some serious problems, just examine the philosophy he constructed, it is a very depressing, bizarre way to look at reality.



I'm interested in this idea. Elucidate please. In what way do
u think it's depressing and bizarre ?


--------------------
"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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OfflineAdamist
ℚṲℰϟ✞ЇѺℵ ℛ∃Åʟḯ†У
Male User Gallery

Registered: 11/24/01
Posts: 10,211
Loc: Bloomington, IN
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: lucid]
    #1653740 - 06/22/03 04:42 PM (19 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

according to the Buddha it's the construction of
the S.E.L.F that's a problem. Let it go (i.e. de-construct)
and suffering shall end



Does that mean I have to destroy my porn collection??  :ooo: 


--------------------
:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 18 years, 9 months
Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: lucid]
    #1653743 - 06/22/03 04:44 PM (19 years, 11 days ago)

the idea that the majority of life, i.e. sensory experience is a trap filled with suffering and attachment, that will carry on for an eternity unless a person dissolves their "self", is pretty paranoid.

I dont think its bad or anything, and I really like alot of buddhist ideas, but the general philosophy is too negatory for me.


--------------------
enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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Offlinelucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness

Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 8 years, 7 months
Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1653773 - 06/22/03 04:53 PM (19 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

atomikfunksoldier said:
the idea that the majority of life, i.e. sensory experience is a trap filled with suffering and attachment, that will carry on for an eternity unless a person dissolves their "self", is pretty paranoid.

I dont think its bad or anything, and I really like alot of buddhist ideas, but the general philosophy is too negatory for me.



hmmm, true, when u factor in the whole reincarnation thing, it
does seem a bit paranoid and negative. Dissolving the self is
probably one of the hardest things to do, and I'd hate to
think that I'll be reincarnated over n over to live in constant
misery until, by some cosmic realization, I manage to deconstruct
my ego. I agree. But I also think that the general theme of
letting go and disolving a socially fortified self-identity
is a great one.


--------------------
"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 18 years, 9 months
Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: lucid]
    #1653792 - 06/22/03 05:00 PM (19 years, 11 days ago)

yes, I believe that people should rectify their ego's, but I think self refinement is more positive then self-abolishment.


--------------------
enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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OfflineCleverName
the cloudsshould know meby now...

Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 1,121
Loc: red earth painted with mi...
Last seen: 16 years, 7 months
Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1653828 - 06/22/03 05:18 PM (19 years, 11 days ago)

the idea that the majority of life, i.e. sensory experience is a trap filled with suffering and attachment, that will carry on for an eternity unless a person dissolves their "self", is pretty paranoid.


the antidote is in the poison. this sensory experience is only a trap when you are attached to the things in it. if you arent able to change or adapt, then you long for the way things were or what you had, that causes suffering. this "trap" is also nirvana, in buddhism samsara and nirvana are the same


--------------------
if you can't find the truth right where you are, where else do you expect to find it?

this is the purpose


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 18 years, 9 months
Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: CleverName]
    #1653837 - 06/22/03 05:22 PM (19 years, 11 days ago)

true, but i dont think attachment is a bad thing, its pretty much impossible to be sincere and detached at the same time. if you love someone, its likely that you'll be attached to them, and when they die, you will suffer, thats life. to negate this love, in order to free yourself from suffering, is problematic, for me anyways.


--------------------
enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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OfflineHagbardCeline
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Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1653843 - 06/22/03 05:24 PM (19 years, 11 days ago)

If you are claiming reincarnation it seems to me that a
multi-ego system would be better.

That would allow you to see the world through different view points. Think of how things would appear to you without the ego. Its like forgetting who we we are. We are individuals, we have our own self-indentidy. Why would you want to change that?

If you did, wouldn't the multi-ego system be better? To have several self-indentidy's.

I think that self-indentidy could be a survival advantage. Our ability to recognize ourselves, and contemplate our own demise, gives us the motivation to increase our lifespan. Through healthier living, and pursuit of life expanding technologies.



--------------------
I keep it real because I think it is important that a highly esteemed individual such as myself keep it real lest they experience the dreaded spontaneous non-existance of no longer keeping it real. - Hagbard Celine


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 18 years, 9 months
Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: HagbardCeline]
    #1653853 - 06/22/03 05:26 PM (19 years, 11 days ago)

or, even better, a plastic identity, which is basically zhuangzi's daoism. have a self that mirrors the situation around you.

ie---go with the flow. I agree, self-identity is very important, especially in a world where those in power of communication need people to follow them, solid, independant self-identities can protect a person's soveriegnty.


--------------------
enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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Offlinelucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness

Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
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Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1653879 - 06/22/03 05:36 PM (19 years, 11 days ago)

If I understand Buddhism correctly, I think there
is a sense of identity... just not with the SELF.
It's a "unifying" identity, a sense of being
One with everything...
I think the idea is that when the identity with
the SELF is disolved, then compassion, joy, peace
and fulfillment arise as our true nature.
There's some interesting books by psychotherapists
(Mark Epstien, Kabatt-Zinn etc) which seem to support
Buddhas approach and claim that the ideas have great
theraputic value.


--------------------
"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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OfflineCleverName
the cloudsshould know meby now...

Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 1,121
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Last seen: 16 years, 7 months
Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1654095 - 06/22/03 07:09 PM (19 years, 11 days ago)

true, but i dont think attachment is a bad thing, its pretty much impossible to be sincere and detached at the same time. if you love someone, its likely that you'll be attached to them, and when they die, you will suffer, thats life. to negate this love, in order to free yourself from suffering, is problematic, for me anyways.


reminds me of a poem:
he who binds to himself a joy
does the winged life destroy.
but he who kisses the joy as it flies
lives in eternity's sun rise.


--------------------
if you can't find the truth right where you are, where else do you expect to find it?

this is the purpose


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OfflineRhizoid
carbon unit
Male

Registered: 01/23/00
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Re: hypothosis on the self construction of the S.E.L.F. [Re: CleverName]
    #1655459 - 06/23/03 05:32 AM (19 years, 10 days ago)

There are people who want to own and collect everything they love, and such people will always get hurt from their loving. But I think it's possible to love transient things without becoming attached to them. I just think we have trouble thinking of humans as transient things.


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