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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > The Psychedelic Experience
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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: The_Aviator]
    #15480252 -

He's not delusional. Just another guy who has recently read every work by Terence Mckenna, and now believes he is some psychedelic mystic who has discovered the secret of talking to fungus..
I'd just call him what he is, a copycat.


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ephemeral anomalous

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: prismism]
    #15481164 -

Quote:
prismism said: Just because you get a chemical reaction in your brain when ingesting this specific organism...


Did you even read the post? No mushrooms were eaten when this occurred. Even if it wasn't clear by exclusion, it should be clear by deduction since my FIRST grow hasn't even pinned yet. By god.


Quote:
Besides, you're growing it specifically to kill it and eat it. Why would the mushrooms give a shit about you and your life and what you think?



For real, did you even read the post? Or do you know anything about mycelium? The mushrooms "die" on their own, the mycelium that grew them does not have to. So no, you don't kill and eat it. I'm definitely not claiming that the mushrooms themselves were communicating - they're not even growing yet, and part of the whole premise of the post is that I am making a point to MAKE SURE THE MYCELIUM, THE TRUE ORGANISM OF THE FUNGUS, LIVES ON. Your entire flame is completely bunk man. Sorry. Refrain from calling me full of shit when it obviously better applies to you here. You don't have to believe my experience - I don't ask you to, nor am I attempting to convince anybody.

By the way, you must have a VERY short-sighted idea of "intelligence."


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Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

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• Violet's Teks and Posts •

Edited by Violet (12/07/11 06:04 PM)

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: The_Aviator]
    #15481218 -

The_Aviator said:
Does your family have a history of mental illness? Don't fool yourself by saying that schizophrenia is not an abnormality caused by structural and chemical differences in the brain. This is factual. And I'm not saying you are schizophrenic or mentally ill. It would be naive of me to proclaim that without knowing more. You should just be careful about falling into delusions, especially since you have mushrooms on the way.

Don't take offense. I just don't see how this is possible. Skepticism is a good thing.



Thanks for your post. My family has no history of mental illness. Your suggestions are good though.

As for seeing how this is possible, there are a great several postulates as to how. With growing cutting-edge science, we're beginning to find extreme and fundamental evidence for the non-locality of consciousness, mind, intelligence - and the neural networks involved would be their foundation. This would be the same for our brains as for mycelial networks that work in much the same way. Large mycelial networks have far more connections than the human brain. This is not proof of advanced intelligence, but is certainly a required condition for it to arise, and to me it's a solid indicator. With us, almost all of our thoughts and senses are directly related to input from sense perceptions which a mycelial network does not have. This doesn't necessarily have to be the case, as any advanced practitioner of meditation or astral projection will firmly state. I don't intend to prove how this could happen, but to respond to your statement that you don't see HOW it COULD with a suggestion. I can't even claim to know HOW it happens.


All of you, check THIS THREAD!
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5561963
HIGHLY relevant.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
• Violet's Teks and Posts •

Edited by Violet (12/07/11 05:59 PM)

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: Violet]
    #15481400 -

Violet said:
Here are what the fungi detailed to me:
1. It recalled my proposed arrangement with it and approved. It felt the arrangement is very honorable and symbiotic.
2. Within the general parameters of those conditions, it would be very pleased if I would keep it. "If we're going to be friends, let's be real friends." I immediately and heartily agreed I would do so within every reasonable possibility.
3. It informed me that influencing mankind to cultivate it is one of it's many living strategies. It said it would be grateful for me to spread it's cultivation to any other respectful persons.



Do you honestly believe that any species of fungi need humans to propagate and flourish? The fungi do not need you to cultivate them any more than a pair of wild tigers needs humans to capture them and begin breeding them in captivity. Fungi have been around long before humans, and probably will be long after humans are gone.

I have no issue with you posting your wild daydreams, but when you claim to have 'communication' with an organism that is observably not communicating, expect me to challenge you on such a matter.


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ephemeral anomalous

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: prismism] * 1
    #15481613 -

Oh my god, you are either dumb or borderline illiterate. I'm not here to insult anyone, yet you simply seem to not get the meaning of words in sentences in order to spam this thread with silly dissonance and that's on the verge of insulting itself.

"ONE OF ITS MANY SURVIVAL STRATEGIES."

Where the hell is that implying the fungus NEEDS man to cultivate it? It just likes it. More life for it. ANY life form finds a life niche where it can. Life finds new ways to live wherever necessary, and usually wherever possible. Many forms of life have developed symbioses, even with humans, though the short-sightedness displayed in humans such as yourself makes it mostly very difficult or impossible. Just because that's true for you doesn't mean it is true for me and must YT be true for others. Don't be so stiffly closed-minded. You will find new experiences come your way.

I also beg the question anyway regarding your ability, and considerably limited human regular ability, to observe such communication before stating that it is not. Clearly you aren't willing or able. Thus shall be your experience.

Wasn't your conclusion that I either have a chemical imbalance or schizo? But now I'm a McKenna copycat? You can't even flame consistently.
Because I had an experience similar to something McKenna knew well and wrote about doesn't mean I'm a copycat. It simply means I'm another person who can vouch for its validity. Does smoking ganja make me a Bob Marley copycat? Bollocks.

... Thanks for posting anyway!



So now there have been claims of my delusion, mental ailment, chemical imbalance, copycatting, or posing wild daydreams as happenstance. I think that about covers all the bases.
You naysayers may now pass this thread over, and the thread can get to what it was intended for - people with similar experience or insights regarding it.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
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• Violet's Teks and Posts •

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: Violet]
    #15481978 -

You have posted a thread that is making a claim that you had a real conversation with your p. cubensis mycelium. I am simply challenging you on this claim. You still have not explained to me how your mycelium was able to tell you that it likes you and wanted you to grow it, and that it's okay to consume it's fruits, but it's not okay to make tea from them.

Somehow, this species of fungi speaks to you while you are sitting next to it. If this claim were true, then it would be observable and repeatable. Why is it that only you are able to hear the mycelium in your head? I have sat next to my mycelium for years. In fact, I sleep right next to them. I haven't heard or seen a single message, sign, or noise. Neither has anyone I have ever talked to. The scientific community would back up your claim if it had any validity. I'm sure you will come back with some over worded response as to how I am not able to listen or some shaman bullshit, but I'd still love an answer.

Violet said:
As for seeing how this is possible, there are a great several postulates as to how. With growing cutting-edge science, we're beginning to find extreme and fundamental evidence for the non-locality of consciousness, mind, intelligence - and the neural networks involved would be their foundation.


Please Violet, I'd love to see where your information comes from. Show me the cutting-edge science that proves that you can communicate with mycelium while sitting next to it.

You cannot change the definition of 'conversation'. I cannot take a person's word that they are communicating with something when the communication is only taking place inside that person's head. You only confirm my suspicion of schizophrenia.


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ephemeral anomalous

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: prismism]
    #15482100 -



Psychedelics are like religion. Its easy to take all the 'mystic' stuff too literally.


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The Only Illusion Is Division

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: EvolveShrooms]
    #15482144 -

It's not magic, its not god, its not the tooth-fairy. Simply the power of the human mind; something seldom gets the credit it deserves. The problem is people think they know their mind well, when most often they have no idea what hides in its dark corners.


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The Only Illusion Is Division

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: prismism]
    #15482147 -

I'm bored.

Quote:
If this claim were true, then it would be observable and repeatable.


Why do you think this? Do you believe the big bang happened?

Besides, it was observed by Violet and it may be repeatable if the exact conditions could be replicated, who can say for sure? :justdontknow:

Quote:
Why is it that only you are able to hear the mycelium in your head?


Why do mute people learn sign language? Just one of the infinite possible answers to your question.

Quote:
I have sat next to my mycelium for years. In fact, I sleep right next to them. I haven't heard or seen a single message, sign, or noise. Neither has anyone I have ever talked to.


Why does this matter? Because you and those with whom you've spoken haven't experienced a phenomenon first hand it means that this phenomenon is impossible? That doesn't make sense.

Quote:
Show me the cutting-edge science that proves that you can communicate with mycelium while sitting next to it.


He never said he had any of that.

Quote:
I cannot take a person's word that they are communicating with something when the communication is only taking place inside that person's head.


And why is this?

Absence of evidence is not absence of evidence, Prismism.


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☆Enoki + Lion's Mane Sawdust Block Grow

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: OnePerEyeM8]
    #15482162 -

I believe in science, not mysticism. Science can be observed and repeated.


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ephemeral anomalous

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: prismism]
    #15482194 -

That doesn't answer any of my questions. :confused:

You do have answers to them, right?


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☆Enoki + Lion's Mane Sawdust Block Grow

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: OnePerEyeM8]
    #15482296 -

OnePerEyeM8 said:
I'm bored.

Quote:
If this claim were true, then it would be observable and repeatable.


Why do you think this? Do you believe the big bang happened?

Besides, it was observed by Violet and it may be repeatable if the exact conditions could be replicated, who can say for sure? :justdontknow:

The big bang deals in astrophysics. We're talking about biology. If Violet was able to communicate telepathically with his mycelium, then so would everyone else, and it would be well documented by science.

Quote:
Why is it that only you are able to hear the mycelium in your head?


Why do mute people learn sign language? Just one of the infinite possible answers to your question.

People learning sign language to overcome their inability to speak is not an applicable comparison in my opinion, and it still fails to answer how he obtained the magical power of having mycelium converse with him.

Quote:
I have sat next to my mycelium for years. In fact, I sleep right next to them. I haven't heard or seen a single message, sign, or noise. Neither has anyone I have ever talked to.


Why does this matter? Because you and those with whom you've spoken haven't experienced a phenomenon first hand it means that this phenomenon is impossible? That doesn't make sense.

It matters because if psychedelic mushrooms speak to people then surely I would have heard SOMETHING. Whether it be to tell me that they wanted me to grow them, or signaling that I am not fit to cultivate them.

Quote:
Show me the cutting-edge science that proves that you can communicate with mycelium while sitting next to it.


He never said he had any of that.

I'm interested in seeing the "evidence for the non-locality of consciousnes" that he was speaking of.

Quote:
I cannot take a person's word that they are communicating with something when the communication is only taking place inside that person's head.


And why is this?

That is the way a rational person sees the world.





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ephemeral anomalous

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: EvolveShrooms]
    #15482373 -

EvolveShrooms said:
It's not magic, its not god, its not the tooth-fairy.



No, you're right it's not. Not only have I not claimed that it is, I claim the opposite. I claim that it's something that can happen and, even if only rare so far, DOES.

Newton had to "get hit in the head by the apple" before he knew to start studying gravity. Then, we began to KNOW about gravity, although it has been here all along. But even having KNOWN about gravity for so long we still do not UNDERSTAND IT.

Would people have been sensible to say his claim of this newly discovered attractive force is totally crazy, and makes him insane, simply because they weren't hit by an apple?!





Study starts from phenomenal observation. You guys aren't scientists - your approach to debunking me over this hurr innanet is very illogical & pointless, and as The_Aviator noted, it is VERY NAIVE OF YOU to call me nuts without knowing shit, O' self-proclaimed "Spinner of Bullshit".





prismism said:
You have posted a thread that is making a claim that you had a real conversation with your p. cubensis mycelium. I am simply challenging you on this claim. You still have not explained to me how your mycelium was able to tell you that it likes you and wanted you to grow it, and that it's okay to consume it's fruits, but it's not okay to make tea from them.

Somehow, this species of fungi speaks to you while you are sitting next to it. If this claim were true, then it would be observable and repeatable. Why is it that only you are able to hear the mycelium in your head? I have sat next to my mycelium for years. In fact, I sleep right next to them. I haven't heard or seen a single message, sign, or noise. Neither has anyone I have ever talked to.






HOLY SHIT, DID YOU READ THE FUCKING THREAD?!?!?!?!?!

1. My strain is not Cubensis, this was stated near both beginning and end. But don't go saying now that my claims of communication have anything to do with strain [similarly to all your other "points"] simply because I've corrected you on this; I've said nothing of the sort.
2. I didn't say it said eating the fruits are okay. Nothing was said about that. I know that it is. Ultimately doesn't matter.
3. I didn't say it said not to make tea out of it. I said that the thought brought the feeling of disgust to me. I said that I agreed to provide the opportunity for its life to continue instead of killing it in any way.
4. I never said I had to be sitting by to it. I implied it had to do with my attention, but I didn't even state that either. If anything, someone who read the damn thread would note I cited theoretical quantum non-locality.
5. As said several times already by myself and others, your lack of experience does not quantify my lack of experience.


... Wow, it took me that long to realize conversing with you is a waste of time. The list could go on though. Your part in this thread has only been as long as it has because of your failure to refer to things actually stated. Have fun replying to OnePerEyeM8's questions, they're mostly just more vicarious call-outs on you for obviously not reading/comprehending the post you're slamming.



As for the physics/biology thing... do you think biology does not involve physics? I sure hope not. You'd be even sillier than you're coming across. Biology may regard what means of communication entities have, but that doesn't mean that means of communication are limited to biological means. I'm not making any claims regarding that whatsoever. Physics are the description of the multitude of media/modes of communication and what occurs when it is made. What I DID refer to - only briefly and not in the way you're making it seem - is to the scientific advancements in understanding the plausability of non-local consciousness and the many things it entails. It was just a suggestion anyway, but if you want a lesson in these forms of physics, don't ask for it from me. You should know better. Look that shit up yourself.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
• Violet's Teks and Posts •

Edited by Violet (12/08/11 06:21 AM)

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: prismism]
    #15482406 -

Quote:
That is the way a rational person sees the world.


And that is the way an irrational person sees a rational person. :shrug:

I'm afraid pointing out all of the problems that are still present in the logic of your questions and answers would take this thread further off topic and be pointless as you seem to be quite stubborn (from what I've seen of you in this thread, not saying you aren't a great guy).

However, I like your name. Rhymes with my subtitle. :thumbup:

Violet: It may not seem like it to you so far, but most people on Shroomery are very open minded and kind. I hope you stick around long enough to see that.


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☆Rice Bran Meal + Heatshock Tek Cube Grow
☆Enoki + Lion's Mane Sawdust Block Grow

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: Violet]
    #15482416 -

Having a dead-end idea, and the breath to back it up with endless paragraphs makes for a dangerous combination. Ever hear of L. Ron Hubbard?


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The Only Illusion Is Division

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: EvolveShrooms]
    #15482445 -

With the replies of some people in this thread you'd think it was posted on a fox news forum.


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☆Rice Bran Meal + Heatshock Tek Cube Grow
☆Enoki + Lion's Mane Sawdust Block Grow

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: OnePerEyeM8]
    #15482470 -

OnePerEyeM8 said:
Violet: It may not seem like it to you so far, but most people on Shroomery are very open minded and kind. I hope you stick around long enough to see that.


Thanks. I've been lurking long enough to see that, this is why I'm here now. I knew people wouldn't like this thread too though. I don't mind. I just wish they'd spend their time doing something productive to themselves and not potentially run off contributing posts.

But this is the internet after all.



EvolveShrooms said:
Having a dead-end idea, and the breath to back it up with endless paragraphs makes for a dangerous combination. Ever hear of L. Ron Hubbard?



"Dead-end idea" is an opinion, and it's not even an idea that's being discussed or argued against - it's an experience. Endless paragraphs? Where?!

We get it. Just move on if you're not interested. Surely trolling can't be that fun.





OnePerEyeM8 said:
With the replies of some people in this thread you'd think it was posted on a fox news forum.


Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha. My kind of joke.

Recent surveys and studies have indicated that viewers of Fox News know and understand less than people who watch no news at all. Thought that tidbit might relate in a way or two.

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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: OnePerEyeM8]
    #15482475 -

OnePerEyeM8 said:
With the replies of some people in this thread you'd think it was posted on a fox news forum.




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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: Violet] * 1
    #15484851 -

Why are all of you calling him schizo and stuff. He is right. They are sentient life. I have had a couple similar experiences that coincide with his. I have no mental illness and I have learned more in 6 months with the help of our friends then I could of in my entire life. I appreciate every life on this earth. The entities he speaks of are real, whether in OUR reality or one that exists in the same place displaced by time or whatever. So do not judge somebody until you've fully experienced every way of taking mushrooms,every place and until you have experienced the level of awareness apparently only few of us have experienced. Now enough of the flaming, instead learn to listen. You do not have to believe, but part of mushrooms and psychedelics in general is to learn more about earth then we can from conventional teaching.

My grandma recently passed about 2 months ago and I took it farely hard. Usually I would not recommend taking mushrooms or anything for a long while after such an event, but I am experienced..meaning well over 100-200(maybe more who knows) trips. I use mushrooms not for the pure euphoria or "cool" visuals. I dont even care if I do get visuals. The auditory side of mushrooms is often overlooked and a lot of time freaks people out because not enough people talk about it. I went into this one particular trip knowing my intention was to bring myself out of being depressed and also learn what happened to her when she left her physical body and this world. I was given an answer. The answer was so clear and vivid that I was stunned beyond belief. I would go into it more but this is not my post. The finalize, i was told that we all live and die and must not be so afraid of death. Death is just another form of our lives. Whether its reincarnation, another realm or just existing in some sort of pure energy.

TO THE POSTER- Don't let people bring you down or judge you when they have never spoken to you directly or know anything about your medical, emotional background.

To the supporters- People like us need to help people understand. I wont force my beliefs on you, and we must not do that to others. The whole 60's movement wasn't just a coincidence you know. Why would all of those people during such a brutal, sinful time open their hearts to psychedelics? In MY opinion it's because sentient beings other then ourselves saw us coming to an end and wanted to prevent us from nuking ourselves into the darkness.

Feel free to comment, i wont judge, be angry or anything. I love this world and want to keep loving the animals, insects, people that reside here. Who are we to say we are better or smarter then another being? WE DO unfortunately. We are no better then a tick sucking blood from a mammals body. Instead we suck peoples money from them, believe everything the government says about drugs and support causes that could cause a catastrophic event. Learn to be more open people, life is about learning and living not critizing and judging.

Peace to you all, have a good morning(to all of you)
Do you really believe mushrooms are just a drug
You may choose 2


Votes accepted from 12/08/11 09:14 AM until the end of time

View the results of this poll


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Re: A conversation and agreement with my friend Teonanacatl. [Re: Manadrax]
    #15484872 -

Oh btw and about the big bang theory, i do believe in it. Watch stephen hawkins recent release about the universe, preferably on a low-medium dose. Even the smartest people in the world refer to some sort of god/entity being part of our lives. They speak about coexisting realities, alternate realities etc. This is by far not any proof but just because the big bang may be real, doesn't mean god can't be or other lifeforms other then humans. Who are we to say that billions and billions of lightyears away there isn't an exact replica of ourselves living in pure harmony because they discovered the same mushrooms or whatever psychedelic you experienced.


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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > The Psychedelic Experience
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