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InvisibleOlgualion
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immunizing mycelium?
    #1435904 - 04/07/03 01:19 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

I am sure this has been talkied about before, but I would like to hear peoples opinions.

Has anyone seen any expermentation with adding trichoderma or pennicillin to a healthy culture.  If you clean the culture after the mold has gotten a good grip, would the cleaned mycelium have a higher tolerance to contamination from those molds?

Or would it be more susceptible?  or neither?

I don't know much of the microscopic features of fungus, yet... :wink: 


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Offlinethe spiral
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Re: immunizing mycelium? [Re: Olgualion]
    #1436421 - 04/07/03 04:15 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

this is an interesting concept. however, keep in mind that a mycelial network is not composed of genetically individual cells, but cells that are all part of the same organism. since bacteria are unicellular organisms, a culture of the bacteria contains billions of individuals with different genes. some individuals in this culture will have genes that give them a resistance to, say, penicillin. if you add penicillin to the bacterial culture, those individuals with the genes for resistance will be the ones who survive the longest. therefore, if you stop the penicillin treatment, you will have killed all of the non-resistant bugs, but the resistant ones will thrive and multiply. this is how resistance is built.

since fungi are not unicellular, this same process would not work; or at least, it would be much slower and far more involved. even if you are working with a culture that was born through a multi-spore inoculation, the genetic diversity in your culture is extremely narrow compared to that of the bacteria. i do believe that this is a line of questioning worth further study, i'm just pointing out some of the basic problems with it.


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Offlinedebianlinux
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Re: immunizing mycelium? [Re: the spiral]
    #1436939 - 04/07/03 07:32 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

a big problem i see is the fact that say you ARE successful in immunizing some mycelium, you will HAVE to maintain that mycelium from that point on (very hard to do when you are intentionally contaminating it) cause a multispore doesn't have the genetics of the parent.


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Offlinethe spiral
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Re: immunizing mycelium? [Re: debianlinux]
    #1444493 - 04/09/03 10:19 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

*bump

I think this is a good idea...has anyone ever thought about ways to create a spore lineage that is especially able to overcome infections?


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"A celibate clergy is an especially good idea, because it tends to suppress any hereditary propensity toward fanaticism." - Carl Sagan


Edited by the spiral (04/09/03 10:20 PM)


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Offlineamyloid
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Re: immunizing mycelium? [Re: the spiral]
    #1448332 - 04/11/03 12:32 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

i was under the impression that when Pc. survives a bacteria or other contam. onsluaght it isnt because of immune cells attacking the contam, but the mycellium just controlling the nutreints. in any case these theoritcal immunities would not be passed down through spores...i dont think?

if no info is brought up by the end of my spring break, ill ask my genetic engineering teacher.

-doc


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"A human being is part of a whole, called by us the Universe, a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feelings, as something separated from the rest--a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons nearest us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this prison by widening our circles of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty."
-Al Einstein


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Invisiblewoodrow
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Re: immunizing mycelium? [Re: amyloid]
    #1448911 - 04/11/03 07:41 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

I have done a little experimentation similar to your idea and found that P.c. can be maintained on nonsterile media. I suspect that shrooms grown for many generations on sterile media lose their ability to fight off contams, and once lost, this ability is not likely to return by growing them on contaminated media. But, if you start with a wild shroom that already has the ability to resist contams, this may be a different matter.

One medium that works for maintaining P.c. is a mix of 3/4 spent tea leaves and 1/4 wheat bran. The mix should be moist but not wet and dispensed into small Zip-loc bags and Pasteurized by briefly heating to near boiling. The bags can be kept for several weeks, perhaps much longer, before they are used. One or more bags can be innoculated with spores or mycelium and, when the mycelium fills the bag, it can be transferred to other bags. There is no need to observe sterility because the medium is not sterile. Occasionally a bag will become moldy and quite often the shroom mycelium will completely out-grow the mold. Contams are not a frequent problem unless the mixture is too wet.
It might be possible to use the bags to spawn a larger substrate but this is something I have yet to try.


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