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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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SUPERstitions
    #12704048 -

Today we were discussing superstitions.  No, we weren't talking about Christianity, Islam or Judaism.  We were talking about observing folk customs relating to superstitious beliefs like walking under a ladder, a black cat crossing your path, breaking a mirror and having seven years bad luck, etc.

Are there some you observe even though you think they are nonsense?  If so, why?

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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #12704255 -

No, we weren't talking about Christianity, Islam or Judaism.  We were talking about observing folk customs relating to superstitious beliefs like walking under a ladder, a black cat crossing your path, breaking a mirror and having seven years bad luck, etc.

I dunno. Seems all the same to me. Christians cross themselves as if that's going to have any effect, and they wear talismans (read: crosses) and hang them off the rear view mirror for good luck or some such, Jews viciously kill food animals with great cruelty because it pleases god or whatever, Muslims blow themselves up so some supernatural entity will give them virgins to fuck...

/shrug religion or superstition, seems all the same to me.


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Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Diploid]
    #12704301 -

Diploid said:
No, we weren't talking about Christianity, Islam or Judaism.  We were talking about observing folk customs relating to superstitious beliefs like walking under a ladder, a black cat crossing your path, breaking a mirror and having seven years bad luck, etc.

I dunno. Seems all the same to me.


Superstitions have an orthodoxy, a doctrine, and an orthopraxy, an observance as do religions, all religions.  However, these superstitions do not have do not have a sacred text.  Maligning religion by calling it superstition isn't the point of the thread, but merely an off-topic remark.  I specifically stated, "No, we weren't talking about Christianity, Islam or Judaism."  In case it is missed, and it looks like it has been already, those topics are not the topic of the thread.

I specifically asked, "Are there some you observe even though you think they are nonsense?  If so, why?"  So far, the question(s) remain unanswered.


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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #12704382 -

Maligning religion

You're projecting my motivation, incorrectly as it happens. My comparison isn't meant to malign but to compare and contrast what I see as clear similarities between religion and superstition. The malignant characterization is entirely in your head.

merely an off-topic remark

I don't think a faux-Philosophy forum like this one needs to be kept so rigidly on-topic. That's boring in my book.

But since it is your thread, alright then. :seeya:


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Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #12704473 -

No, why would I? :confused:


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More than treasures found, its just been knowing you.

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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #12704511 -

Code:
Are there some you observe even though you think they are nonsense?  If so, why?

Yep, I usually pretend that various incarnations of "society" contain some sort of reality, although I regard that idea as among the most dangerous superstitions. It's a sorry self-fulfilling prophecy, which is of course a trait it shares with many other old superstitions. It may not be real, but its followers will do all they can to make it so. Why I do it? Because representatives of those who believe in this particular superstition regard it as their legal right to imprison or even kill those who don't believe in following the rules of everyday insanity a.k.a. The Law.

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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: amuzakat]
    #12704598 -

I have practiced many superstitions. This occurs in the context of complex biological experiments that can be very difficult to perform well, or to get all the variables tuned just right.

So when things finally work, you repeat everything you might have done that could possibly have effected the outcome. I have noticed myself and others will pick up silly unreasonable behaviors that from a logical point of view should have no effect on the experiment.

I think this is a coping strategy to deal with the fear/pessimism that the experiment won't work. Much of science is failure. It's like I've repeated every exact damn thing from when I got the experiment to work, so it will work this time right?

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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Freedom]
    #12704606 -

obligatory stevie wonder video:


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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Freedom]
    #12704725 -

I'm going to revise my answer. There are no superstitions that I am aware of practicing.


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More than treasures found, its just been knowing you.

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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Freedom]
    #12704764 -

Freedom said:
I have practiced many superstitions. This occurs in the context of complex biological experiments that can be very difficult to perform well, or to get all the variables tuned just right.

So when things finally work, you repeat everything you might have done that could possibly have effected the outcome. I have noticed myself and others will pick up silly unreasonable behaviors that from a logical point of view should have no effect on the experiment.

I think this is a coping strategy to deal with the fear/pessimism that the experiment won't work. Much of science is failure. It's like I've repeated every exact damn thing from when I got the experiment to work, so it will work this time right?



I was just thinking that this kind of thing is probably prevalent in the cultivation forum. I imagine that someone who gets an unusually potent harvest would try to replicate all the conditions that give rise to the potency.

And this is how many supersitions arose in the context of farming. One day someone not only prayed for rain, but also danced for rain and the next day it rained. Without modern science, who can blame them for the superstition?

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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Freedom]
    #12705862 -

There many people here that cannot tell correlation from causation.  Not mentioning any names though.


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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #12705915 -

Oooh cryptic. Maybe Cyph3r can figure out who the mystery fools is are...

Are you really responding to me or are you just using the quick reply function?

Edited by Freedom (06/08/10 12:57 PM)

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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Freedom]
    #12706051 -

Quick reply in the last one.  Why are you assuming it is one fool?  I said, "nameS".


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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #12708331 -

haha my bad in the quick reply

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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Freedom]
    #12708634 -

Quote:
/shrug religion or superstition, seems all the same to me.


I dunno, I think Diploid hit it on the head. The imaginative creative play of believing in god, prayer, ritual, or luck all seem to be of the same process of imagination and belief. Religion is given more attention because it appeals to the human condition and our immortality project, hence the books and temples and effort expended over the cause. Compared to a vengeful god a black cat crossing my path carries less danger, but both are essentially the same process of make-believe.

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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #12708946 -

I have to admit: I still cross my fingers.
Like, when my wireless router is acting up and I want it to reconnect quickly.

I know it doesn't do anything, but ... it's kind of just an outlet for my energy?
You know, like ... I'm anxious for whatever-it-is to happen, but all I can actually do is wait, so to release some of that energy I just cross my fingers real hard.

Oh, and when I play Risk or Yahtzee, I invest an inordinate amount of energy in trying to "lead" the dice with my mind.
I know all about confirmation bias, but it still totally seems like it's working sometimes. :lol:


PS: I'm with Mushrooms on the religion/superstition distinction. Definitely different animals.


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Weedmaster P knows the truth.

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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: laserpig]
    #12709158 -

Friday the 13th is considered unlucky because in 1307 some crusaders got fuckin owned.

idk why that necessitates a day of the year being evil.


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Edited by learningtofly (06/08/10 03:26 PM)

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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: laserpig]
    #12713599 -

laserpig said:
I have to admit: I still cross my fingers.
Like, when my wireless router is acting up and I want it to reconnect quickly.

I know it doesn't do anything, but ... it's kind of just an outlet for my energy?
You know, like ... I'm anxious for whatever-it-is to happen, but all I can actually do is wait, so to release some of that energy I just cross my fingers real hard.

Oh, and when I play Risk or Yahtzee, I invest an inordinate amount of energy in trying to "lead" the dice with my mind.
I know all about confirmation bias, but it still totally seems like it's working sometimes. :lol:


PS: I'm with Mushrooms on the religion/superstition distinction. Definitely different animals.



Thanks for the agreement and addressing the original point.

As I worked it out in my mind when I was younger, certain things seemed less plausible.  For example, walking under a ladder and having bad luck could have been having something dropped on you.  That is circular reasoning.  I figured that out when I was a teenager.  Similarly, breaking a mirror would not result in a bad luck streak for seven years because the odds of such a thing would be remote.  I broke a mirror when I was 14.  Was I do be consigned to bad luck until I was 21?  I found the idea absurd.

Black cats?  I thought they were spooky when I was a teenager and still do.  I do everything possible to stop a black cat from crossing my path.  It's totally irrational and I know it.  Still, I can't stop thinking it will cause ill fortune.

As far as manipulating things with my mind goes, I have been attempting it, with some success, since I was five.  I think there must be some scientific explanation for it.


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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #12713744 -

Quote:
It's totally irrational and I know it.


Well, that is a complete surprise.


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Re: SUPERstitions [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #12713968 -

I partake in the superstitions. I knock on wood to avoid bad luck. Throw salt over my shoulder when I spill some. Cross my fingers occasionally. ...just to name a few. I'm not anal about it nor do I get anxious if I don't do something properly or forget. I walked under a ladder the other day and had to laugh that I didn't even notice it there on the sidewalk until after I was clear of it.

Why do I partake in the superstitions? Well, most of the time I'll do it in a social context. Like knocking on wood for example. If I say something to "jinx" myself, then I sometimes make a point of knocking on wood just to insert a bit of humour/silliness into the conversation. But I think the main reason I do it is because it can be fun to pretend. It can be a fun thing to believe in something and not believe in it... all at the same time. :smile:


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